German Navy

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
They're actually throwing us a little nugget for once:

Designskizze.jpg

Design sketch from Lürssen, who also holds the image rights. May be used for editorial purposes (publication) provided this is stated.
Released unclassified by PIZ BAAInBw.
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
Due to parliament approving the 2.1 billion Euro for it yesterday the Bundeswehr today signed a contract with Lürssen for three new ELINT ships... err, reconnaissance ships ... err, "fleet service boats". Whatever they call them now. Basically those ships that we have been unofficially parking off the coasts of Libya and Syria for the last decade.

The ships will be "about 130m length" and will get the type number 424. I doubt we'll get all that many details beyond that. Planned commissioning 2027, replacing the current 83m-long Oste class / Type 423 vessels.
Ah...Navalnews just posted an article about it.


But there is not much more information in this article than you posted. No images, no technical data of the new Type 424 class. Also not on Lürssens' website.
 
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kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
We've seen the shortlisted prices from Lürssen-GNYK and MV Werften. Meyer-Neptun and Pella Sietas have full order books out to 2025 and 2024 respectively, so probably didn't submit a bid since they wouldn't have been able to deliver in the desired timeframe anyway.
Placing it here for context:

The winning bid was apparently the one from Lürssen-GNYK for 914 million Euro total (and yes, that's more than the 860 million previously announced). MV Werften's bid was apparently conditional to the Genting financing situation, and rejected for that reason.

Some (at least 50%, possibly all) of the work will apparently be subcontracted by Lürssen-GNYK to Meyer-Neptun though, so there's someone with actual experience with tankers and rapid construction involved.

I have not seen any result for the FSG case which should have been announced this wednesday. A week ago there were rumours that politicians had successfully lobbied FSG into retracting their lawsuit, possibly in return for acting as subcontractors on one of the contracts; as of last sunday the case had not been retracted though.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
The German Federal Ministry of the Interior stealthily ordered a fourth Potsdam class OPV earlier this year. The official market designation seems to be "OPV 86 BP" btw (BP for Bundespolizei, Federal Police). The money for the ship presumably comes from the Corona Package - the first three were similarly bought from a stimulus package.

I say stealthily because they simply changed their contract with Fassmer for an additional ship based upon requiring "an identical ship to avoid differences in operation". The order includes armament like the other ships (57mm gun and two .50cal HMG). The contract change as i understand it allows for 90 million Euro budget for the ship - the original ships ordered five years ago were 68 million each including armament package. Delivery seems to be planned for sometime around June 2023.
 
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kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Atlas Elektronik will upgrade five Frankenthal class minehunters between 2022 and 2025. Contract is worth 44 million Euro.

The official version is that the boats will "receive" the IMCMS combat management system for mine warfare (commercially known as Atlas ARCIMS).

However, all five boats affected already had IMCMS integrated in an upgrade between 2009 and 2012 (Type MJ332C). The new contract merely seems to upgrade their systems to the same standard that three other boats (Type MJ332CL) received in 2017, hence why it's also that cheap. The major difference so far is that these three boats are control vehicles for up to four Seehund large minesweeping USVs each. The remaining two boats in the fleet beyond these eight (Type MJ332B) will not be upgraded and serve as mine diver boats.

Part of the contract is building a second land-side trainer with identical equipment in order to be fully able to rotate crews. A first one was already built with the 2017 contract.

It's technically still planned to start replacing all ten boats around 2025-2027.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Fassmer got the contract for the two 50m "Sea Trials, Coast" boats.

bundeswehr-erneuert-messboote-in-eckernf-rde.jpg
Image Rights: Fassmer GmbH & Co KG, declassified by PIZ AIN, use for editorial purposes permitted provided image credits are given.

The two ships will be assigned to the naval weapons trials agency WTD71, where they replace three older boats. WTD71 is housed at the Eckernförde naval base, which also hosts the 1st Submarine Squadron and the Naval Infantry Battalion.

The design is relatively conventional and follows the general lines of mid-size survey and fisheries protection boats Fassmer has been building for both public authorities and commercially (*). Overall the design is also relatively close to the Schwedeneck multipurpose boats (50m LPP, 1000 tons displacement) that WTD71 also runs since the 80s and that are themselves planned to be replaced by larger ships.

The intention for these ships is to be highly reconfigurable for different tasks. Envisioned taskset is mostly things like torpedo recovery, supporting submarines in shallow water trials, UUV/AUV/ROV deployment or diver support. The ships will be unarmed in their regular service, but - well, you don't put an exclusion marking suitably sized for at least a 27mm gun on a CG image just for fun. Normal winch markings tend to look different.


(*) Smallest version of that general design from Fassmer is the coastal research vessel Uthörn II at 36m length which is currently building for the Federal Ministry of Education and Research for use by maritime and polar research organization AWI.
 
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chis73

Active Member
Thanks for that news kato. Very interesting!

It's odd, but this is exactly the kind of vessel I've been advocating that the Royal New Zealand Navy buy for about 10 years now - a nice simple low-cost multi-purpose 'odd-job' type, that can carry a container or two of equipment on the back. Previously I've suggested the Canadian MCDV, a modified French La Perouse class, and the Damen MRAV concept. A good vessel for minor diving ops, ROV work etc., but big enough to stay out for a couple of weeks. This one looks like you could easily fit a small stabilized cannon on the foredeck for constabulary functions (unlike the Damen MRAV for example).

Anyway, I came across some information in another forum that the estimated price tag for this project was 95m Euro (for two vessels). Just wondering if you have any further information (ie. length, draught, crew complement, speed, range etc.)? There doesn't appear to be anything on the Fassmer website as yet. As you say, they look very similar to the Type 748 Schwedeneck class. I presume the propulsion is diesel-electric (judging by the pods), and that there is no sonar / echo-sounder fitted.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Anyway, I came across some information in another forum that the estimated price tag for this project was 95m Euro (for two vessels). Just wondering if you have any further information (ie. length, draught, crew complement, speed, range etc.)? There doesn't appear to be anything on the Fassmer website as yet. As you say, they look very similar to the Type 748 Schwedeneck class.
For the two SVK boats only their length - 50m - has been published; the requirements list - in which all those details are - has always been classified and was only provided to accredited bidders. The ships are built to civilian standards. For displacement scaled from similar-design vessels from Fassmer (both larger and smaller) they will probably end up at around 840-850 tons.

For similar designs from Fassmer you'll have to look in the "research and survey vessel" section of their portfolio, in particular the two Fugro Marine Services requirement concepts they adapted onto their own pre-existing 42m hull design as well as a 65m variant (Fugro also had Damen adapt that requirement concept onto a 54m MRAV hull). I wouldn't expect SVK with specs - and even then with lots of "classified" - to make it on their website before the first one is commissioned.

I would assume crew numbers for basic ship operation to be somewhere around 6-10. Propulsion will definitely be diesel-electric, if they were "exotic" (e.g. LNG) they would advertise it.

Fuel reserves for range on such ships should be heavily adaptable to whatever the customer requests. The Fugro 65m vessels do nearly 9,000 nm at 10 knots to facilitate global deployment for their business. For the two SVK ships now ordered i doubt the range or endurance will be all that big - they are laid out to support trials primarily in the Baltic Sea within the rather small German EEZ, you don't need more than a week endurance and perhaps 2,000 nm range at decent speed for any scenario that they may be used in.

The Navy plans to acquire six larger 65m vessels probably of a similar configuration under the moniker SVS ("Sea Trials, Sea" vs SVK = "Sea Trials, Coast"). Those would then be intended for longer multi-week deployments over longer distances (primarily in Norway, to be exact). Tender for that hasn't been issued yet.

Ships of WTD71 have a notional wartime reserve coastal patrol boat role (earmarked since the 70s), and that space marked out on the forecastle looks sized about right for rapid installation of a MLG27 light gun for this purpose, of which the Navy Arsenal should always have a couple spare. Integrated EO sensor and laser rangefinder, single self-contained console - perfect for that kinda thing.
Given that they are to support submarine operations and torpedo trials they should have some sort of sonar btw, even if it's just one of those echosounders you hang overboard.

The 95.08 million Euro is the cost they ended up at for the two ships; presumably this includes some sort of support/maintenance contract and spare parts package though. The originally envisioned budget for the ships was 30 million Euro and was presumably based on the cost for the Research-Ministry-financed "Uthörn II" ship from Fassmer (14.5 million), which is pretty much the same design in a 36m variant and a rather recent contract - they just laid her keel last month.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
P.S. for comparison, since i referenced her and she's also not on Fassmer's website (yet)...

This is Uthörn II, currently under construction at Fassmer. Planned delivery offhand is January 2022.

uthoern.jpg
Image credits: Fassmer GmbH & Co KG.

Uthörn II at 35.7m length is the smallest variant of the same basic design line. The ship is completely financed by and was tendered out by the Federal Ministry of Research and Education. Fassmer won the contract in a EU-wide competition.

The ship is purpose-built for the Alfred Wegener Institute (maritime and polar research) for a specific task - taking measurements on water conditions in the North Sea within the German EEZ, primarily around Germany's only offshore island of Helgoland. Temperature profiles, salinity, cloudiness etc. It also carries a fishing echosounder to detect and analyze fish swarms, and will likely carry fishing gear to take samples. With some equipment containerized she will be somewhat flexible in that regard. Replacing a 30m cutter for AWI (called Uthörn) one of her main tasks is also serving as a training vessel - they train maritime sciences students on heavier gear on ships this way.

Advertising video from AWI featuring various sequences of deployment from the old cutter Uthörn and the above CG of Uthörn II from a variety of angles.

Due to the specific task the ship could be downsized pretty much exactly to the specifications required - which are largely copied off of the ship she is replacing: sufficiently sized to be oceangoing, but only 1200 nm range and 5 days endurance (+5 days reserve) since she's not gonna hang out out there but merely go to pre-arranged survey sites (once or twice per week), take her measurements and go back. The range - and her design top speed at 10 knots - is also relatively low since she will be running her diesel-electric propulsion on methanol. Accomodation onboard is for 5 crew and 4 scientists, on single-day cruises e.g. with students she can take on 25 passengers.

Copying requirements from the old cutter went as far as the tender actually even prescribing that its "about 30m length" should be kept. The Fassmer design exceeds that as it basically puts the same deckspace on a (in all dimensions) 90% scale model of their standard 42m hull of this kind of design.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
F123 upgrade goes to a consortium of Saab (electronics), Abeking & Rasmussen (shipyard) and ESG (logistics).

The planned upgrade entails switching the CMS to Saab 9LV, replacing the radars with a Saab suite called Multi Sensor Solution (Sea Giraffe 4A Fixed-Face and Sea Giraffe 1X, adding in CEROS 200 for missile control) - the same that will also equip the new Finnish "corvettes". This full electronics upgrade is called "BASIC/SENSOR package" for F123. Some minor third-party systems will also be installed, such as IFF. The deal also includes a relatively large-scale performance-based logistics contract specifically for the ships, handled by ESG.

It is notable that the above "BASIC/SENSOR" according to Saab is only worth 4.6 billion SEK - 451 million Euro. The full upgrade was passed by the budget and defense committees for apparently 587 million Euro. That at least leaves some remote hope that Abeking&Rasmussen will also rebuild the hangar doors to fit NH90s, which is the main thing prohibiting effective use of the ships long-term.

The upgrade is sort of an MLU, although a limited one - however it's quite a bit more than one would do for a mere service life extension of 3-4 years over current projected lifetime.
The upgrade is planned to be rolled out between 2021 and 2030, i.e. it will occur in parallel to the F126 frigates being constructed With that stretching the last F123 will probably be upgraded around the time that the first F126 already comes into service. The current timetable for F126 has the last of four units reaching operational capability in late 2032. The four F123 will be 36-38 years old at that time.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
F217 Bayern has been chosen for the Indo-Pacific cruise and will set sail in August.
The cruise is now officially called "Indo-Pacific Deployment" (in English) and will start this monday at 1400B in Wilhelmshaven. The cruise will take about six months and end in February 2022.

The Inspector Admiral of the Navy (i.e. its supreme commander) was interviewed by armed forces press corps yesterday, being asked about the cruise and Navy interpretation of the South China Sea conflict.

In German, audio only podcast. Transcript in German if anyone wants to do some translation. About the first 10 minutes are about the Indo-Pacific deployment.

Salient points:
  • The German Navy does not engage in FONOPS. "Other Nations do that, we don't take part in this". In case that's not clear, that's a rather clear sublime condemnation of both the practice and those who engage in it.
  • Germany does not support the Chinese claim to the South China Sea, in particular the Spratleys and Paracel Islands, or the current practice of atolls being rebuilt to islands and claiming a 12-mile zone around them.
  • Bayern will explicitly not "confront" this Chinese claim though but will use routes through the South China Sea that are used daily by commercial shipping.
  • The stated "grand nation" visit of the cruise is to Japan. Australia is planned on the way there. Port visits in India and Pakistan should occur while transferring through the Indian Ocean. Other possible visits or joint exercises are not elaborated on - "many partners to visit on the way".
  • A port visit in China is planned, but from a bit heave-ho in the admiral's language seems to not have been signed off yet. The political contention from language used in the interview is likely about whether "China invites" or "Germany asks".
  • Bayern will take part in the embargo regime against North Korea "in a low-level form". Due to the embargo regime the frigate will also not visit North Korea. ;)

There is an official Twitter account of the crew of Bayern for the cruise, also in German:
 
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kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
The official route for FGS Bayern was published on the day of her departure:

routenplanung-indo-pacific-deployment.jpg

Planned route:

(Europe) -> Djibouti -> Karachi -> Diego Garcia -> Perth, Guam -> Tokyo -> Incheon -> Shanghai -> Ho-Chi-Minh City -> Singapore -> Colombo -> Mumbai -> Djibouti -> (Europe)

One can pretty much take a broad guess which of these stops were included with a view towards "balancing" the visit in China politically. I see about three of them.

It is somewhat notable that on the above map outside nations with port visits they also mark out (exactly) Egypt, Somalia, New Zealand, Indonesia and North Korea. Since Somalia and North Korea will be known areas of operations this may indicate that some sort of participation of the other three in e.g. exercises or maneuvers may be planned while transiting.

Somewhat similarly seas marked out on the map are exactly "Indian Ocean", "West Pacific" and "South China Sea" with otherwise only the straits the ship passes marked out. It should be noted in this regard that the map was published without any further comment.


The Chinese Embassy in Germany has reacted to the publication of the route and Bayern's departure by supplying an 11-page document in German to the German Navy ... via Twitter ... explaining "The Facts about the South China Sea and China's Position". Makes for an interesting propaganda read. It mostly outlines how China considers Nansha Qundao (aka the Spratleys) to be illegally occupied by Vietnam, the Philippines and Malaysia. Don't know if they provide that document in other languages to other nations sending ships through there, at least i don't think they do so through social media, i.e. aimed at the public...

They further appeal to Bayern that when transiting the South China Sea they should "abide by international law, respect the sovereignty, rights and interests of abutting nations and refrain from any action detrimental to peace and security in the region".
 
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ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
@kato Why New Zealand? What have we done to upset Germany? If we haven't done anything then give us a chance and am sure that we can arrange for a reasonable upset to happen. :cool:
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Planned formal PASSEX for Bayern will be with Japan, Australia, Singapore, South Korea and the United States.

Additionally RAS exercises, possibly also in other places, are being "considered".
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Bayern passed through the Suez Canal between Wednesday and Thursday.

Apparently before that they also installed the remaining modular light armament, which unlike in other deployments they don't avoid putting in photos as well - the Mediterranean was travelled with two .50cal behind modular armor plates and two 7.62mm MG5 with gunshields, before entering the Red Sea they've now added a second pair of .50cal armored nests.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
The three F124 AAW frigates will have their SMART-L long-range radar replaced by TRS-4D/LR ROT (rotator) from Hensoldt in their next major yard time between 2024 and 2028. A fourth system will be installed at Naval Technology School Parow in 2023 already. Besides training this land system will also be used for testing adjustments before deployment on the ships.

Despite the name "TRS-4D/LR" is not hardware-related to the "TRS-4D" G-band radar by the same company, but instead is probably an adapted, downsized Elta EL/M2080 Green Pine S-band radar with TRS-4D electronics in the backend - Hensoldt and IAI cooperate on long-range radars and proposed such an integration in December last year. TRS-4D/LR is advertised with 400 km instrumented range endoatmospheric and 2000 km range exoatmospheric, it is specifically a BMD-enabling radar.

With regard to the land site, it should be noted that Parow is located only 250 km west of the Aegis Ashore site in Redzikowo with considerable overlap.
 

swerve

Super Moderator
The name's confusing.

I had no idea that existed. I'd have expected the SMART-Ls to be upgraded to SMART-L MM, like the Dutch destroyers.
 

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Hensoldt and IAI started that strategic partnership only late last year, the first thing they put out was a CG image of a Green Pine on a F124 that kinda looks a bit oversized:

I guess what they've successfully sold now is a Green Pine (or a Spectra - EL/M 2090) downsized sufficiently to fit on the TRS-4D rotator gear and hooking it up to its electronics.
A bit ridiculously IAI now has a picture of a F125 with a giant radome on the bow (... and the fixed-panel TRS-4D still mounted) on its advertising page for Spectra.

That SMART-L would be replaced was not all that out loud in public, but basically decided a while ago with funding cleared in 2019 and a tender started back then. They've also been looking around at the market a bit beyond that - even at AN/SPY-6 at one point supposedly.
 
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