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Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates

Discussion in 'Air Force & Aviation' started by Todjaeger, Mar 12, 2007.

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  1. seaspear

    seaspear Member

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    If the R.A.A.F were to look over the next fifteen years perhaps upcoming long range missiles like JASSM-ER , AGM-158C or even JASSM-XR should be considered for their advantages
     
  2. Todjaeger

    Todjaeger Potstirrer

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    I did find and re-read the original article, it can be found here. The article itself mentioned JSOW, SDB II, and likely JSM as potential load outs for maritime strike roles, but again there was no mention of what the load out was for the graphic which listed a 500 n mile and 1,000 n mile coloured line, under which it said F-35 combat radius with and without a single air-to-air refueling.

    When one mentions Combat Radius, the aircraft configuration does become rather important. After all, a 760 n mile combat radius with an air defence role would mean SFA if the tasking were actually an anti-shipping or maritime strike role.

    OTOH, if the mission load out was to include a pair of 1,200 L drop tanks (which would be ~23% increase in carried fuel) and a LRASM, plus some AMRAAM's carried internally in addition to max internal fuel.

    For those who read the article, keep in mind it is nearly five years old so some of the thoughts and concerns then are no longer valid.

    I would also be interested in what people think about the article now. The impression I got from what the author wrote is that he felt the F-35 was going to be selected, but he was rather unenthusiastic about it.

    I also found it curious how the author seemed to attribute decisions made for/by the RAAF to being influenced by problems with the F-35 programme, when that does not match the timeline of events. I am specifically referring to the decision to make the interim strike purchase of the F/A-18F Super Hornets to replace the F-111C's which were to be replaced earlier than planned.

    When I checked the time frames, even if the F-35A did become available for service in 2012, there would still have been a gap of about 2-3 years between the early F-111C retirement and the F-35A entry into service. As it was, the SHornet was basically the only new aircraft that the RAAF could get and have start entering service in time.
     
  3. seaspear

    seaspear Member

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    Page 2 does refer to a dedicated anti shipping weapon to be introduced in the early twenties , the graphic shows "ranges" from only Australian airfields perhaps allied nations airfields with tanker support should extend this further in this theoretical exercise
     
  4. SpazSinbad

    SpazSinbad Active Member

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    Thanks for finding the PDF. A direct link is: https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/ad-aspi/import/SI70_F35_decision.pdf (1.9Mb) Currently there are NO drop tanks for the F-35 variants. A few years ago now Israel was in cahoots with LM about producing same but nothing since. The added range is not thought to be significant with weight/drag of tanks so development from the original partner side (not Israel) was stopped. I'll go read the PDF again now (five years - how time flies). I would assume any mention of 'F-35 combat radius' will include the weapons as noted in the SAR (btw there should be a new one soon). As for range of any kind with any loadouts other than the KPP [unless another example(s) may be found elsewhere] - good luck with that - NATOPS or Flight Manuals may have that info - let me know when you have your hands on one. :) An old Norwegian F-35 Briefing PDF has a JSM combat range graphic whilst some old USN? PDFs have the B/C info but IIRC that is similar to the SARs of that era. I'll find the Norsk JSM....

    An Israeli LM PDF brief had this graphic for F-35A 760NM Combat Radius with Internal Air to Air Configuration:

    http://i.imgur.com/jMDocjY.png

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Todjaeger

    Todjaeger Potstirrer

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    There is a mention of a dedicated anti-shipping weapon to be integrated onto the F-35 in the early 2020'2 but no mention of what it is supposed to be. Which means no idea on weight, size, or placement aboard an F-35. That last one could be significant since external stores would not only compromise LO efforts, but also increase drag and therefore reduce range, max speed, etc.

    I found what appears to be a new SAR, which is were I got a combat radius of 669 n miles for the F-35A while carrying a pair of AIM-120 missiles and JDAM bombs. As for the graphic, that might the load out as well, but without mentioning and specifying one does not really know.
     
  6. SpazSinbad

    SpazSinbad Active Member

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    The DATE on that SAR page is important. Often the pages have different dates usually older than the front page date of that particular SAR (I guess the info had not changed so it was just copy that page again). I don't dispute the info - I have a recent last year SAR but for the moment here is the Norwegian JSM / F-35A graphic:

    Meanwhile latest 2019 President Budget SAR KPP mashup page is attached from:

    http://www.f-16.net/forum/download/file.php?id=27020 (PDF 0.7Mb)

    http://norway.usembassy.gov/root/pdfs/volume-1---executive-summary---part-1_dista.pdf (PDF is around somewhere else if not on F-16.net in the F-35 sub-forum) F-35attackProfileJSMnorway.gif KPPs FY2019 PB F-35 SAR forum.gif
     

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    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  7. SpazSinbad

    SpazSinbad Active Member

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    Jeepers looking up old internet stuff can be time consuming. AFAIK the two page [now + 1 for three pages] PDF attached came from another PDF no longer available of course but same pages are in this available PDF 4.6Mb JSF - Inventing the Joint Strike Fighter by Dr. Paul Bevilaqua 11 Dec 2009 Lockheed Martin Skunk Works. One would have to realise that these pages are almost a decade old using even older info I would guess. However they are of interest to any 'drop tankers'. Mostly people point out the drop tanks are in the fuselage & stealthy already. First graphic is from the Bevilaqua PDF which also has the Meyer graphics. http://www.aereo.jor.br/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Joint-strike-fighter-Presentation.pdf [the other MEYER PDF is no longer at this URL: http://www.nps.edu/Academics/Institutes/Meyer/docs/Joint strike fighter.pdf ] F-35bevilaquaMissionProfileGraphics.gif F-35BmissionMeyerPDFprofileED.gif F-35CmissionMeyerPDFprofileED.gif
     

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  8. Stampede

    Stampede Active Member

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    Thanks Todaeger
    I'll take the advice on board.

    Regards S
     
  9. t68

    t68 Well-Known Member

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    Spaz, I do like the emblem of the baby seal, A tribute to Goon & Co;);)
     
  10. SpazSinbad

    SpazSinbad Active Member

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    This badge was concocted by artisans at LM at the time of the 'clubbed like baby seals' imbroglio. F35fightingSEALbadge16edW.gif
     
  11. Todjaeger

    Todjaeger Potstirrer

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    We should see if we can get some made up, and then posted to a certain group of Klowns...
     
  12. rossfrb_1

    rossfrb_1 Member

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    Interestingly MDBA is advertising its Meteor (and a graphic including an F-35) on the Australian Defence Magazine - Australian Defence Magazine site.
    It's may be drawing a long bow to assume that MDBA advertising its wares on an Australian defence related site implies an intention to sell that product to the RAAF but I can't help doing just that.....
    I've not heard or read anything about RAAF looking for a new or supplemental BVR AAM.
    Is there a case for AIM120(D) and Meteor for the RAAF?
    cheers
    rb
     
  13. seaspear

    seaspear Member

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    The R.A.F placed an order for 200 of the AIM120(D) last year
     
  14. seaspear

    seaspear Member

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  15. MARKMILES77

    MARKMILES77 Member

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    Can't read the article due to paywall but appears that the RAAF may fit AN/AAQ-28(V) LITENING targeting pods, taken from retiring(sold) FA-18A/Bs to it's C-130Js.
    Not sure of the purpose?
    Simply so they can operate as an extra surveillance asset if required?
    Or are they contemplating some sort of "Harvest Hawk" C-130 Gunship?
     
  16. 40 deg south

    40 deg south Well-Known Member

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  17. John Newman

    John Newman Well-Known Member

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    Saw this bit of news last night:

    First two used Australian fighter jets arrive in Canada on Sunday

    It appears that the first two RAAF Classic Hornets are to be handed over to the RCAF this weekend.

    I wonder if these two jets are not coming direct from here in Oz, but are two of the six Classic Hornets that are in the US for Red Flag??

    Cheers,
     
  18. oldsig127

    oldsig127 Active Member

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    Why would they take two of the best remaining legacy Hornets to Red Flag and hand them over, when the Canadians will be tearing out a lot of the avionics and replacing them with Canadian pattern equipment?

    Bit unlikely. I'd think that they'll be aircraft which are in good nick but not fully up to date, and probably with RAAF specific kit removed (where not required for the journey)

    oldsig
     
  19. John Fedup

    John Fedup Well-Known Member

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  20. John Newman

    John Newman Well-Known Member

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    Looks like my guess was correct, the first jets handed over are two of the six that were that were at Red Flag:

    First two Australian F-18s for the RCAF arrive in Cold Lake – here are the photos

    From the photos, the airframe that is identifiable is A21-53, one of the last As built, delivered to the RAAF in December 1989.