New Coronavirus threat

swerve

Super Moderator
Clearly, free and open societies haven’t been doing well against COVID with a few notable exceptions. Poor leadership is partly to blame along with populations with a significant number of Darwin Award contenders.

In addition to poor leadership, the US also has this stupidity to deal with, not sure how difficult $hit-canning a federal court judge is? Mind you I am not a fan of holy rollers so maybe this is gene pool improvement.
Two Colorado churches win lawsuit against state's Covid-19 mask and crowd limit requirements
Two Colorado churches win lawsuit against state's Covid-19 mask and crowd limit requirements
Germany, Denmark, Norway, Finland, Austria, Japan, Australia & New Zealand haven't done well?

Russia & Iran have done terribly. They've both tried to hide it, especially Russia, but the Russian statistics agency hasn't been so compromised that it lies about the total number of deaths. Or at least, it hadn't been up to the end of July. The death rate's been much higher than expected since Coronavirus struck. The number of excess deaths up to July 31st had been almost six times as many as the number of officially declared COVID-19 deaths. Various people have commented on massive rises in the numbers of deaths attributed to various previously known ailments, such as pneumonia. Oddly, all these illnesses share symptoms with COVID-19.
 

OPSSG

Super Moderator
Staff member
The ship's captain announces 5 people have tested positive for #COVID19 on SeaDream 1, the first cruise ship to embark on a voyage in the Caribbean. Not that cruises can’t ever be conducted — especially in travel bubbles between low case count cities. Rather, it is a bad idea for the American cruise ship industry to reopen at this time as CORVID-19 spread in America is not contained or even managed.

- 0 to 1 million cases: 96 days
- 1M to 2M cases: 44 days
- 8M to 9M cases: 14 days
- 9M to 10M cases: 10 days

Trump’s #election2022 transition temper tantrum is deadly, with #COVID19 spreading rapidly. Biden & Ron Klain needs to unite the America behind a new pandemic strategy.
The coronavirus numbers are so bad, after all the Trump election rallies, that Biden’s advisor is proposing a 6 week shutdown to prevent the hospitals from being overwhelmed again. Cities that had previously opened schools are preparing to shut them down while, insanely, not shutting down restaurants or gyms. Meanwhile, all across America, medium-size indoor social gatherings are spreading the coronavirus like crazy—medium-size social gatherings just like the ones countless Americans are just about to travel far and wide to attend for Thanksgiving and Christmas.
 
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ASSAIL

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
The ship's captain announces 5 people have tested positive for #COVID19 on SeaDream 1, the first cruise ship to embark on a voyage in the Caribbean. Not that cruises can’t ever be conducted — especially in travel bubbles between low case count cities. Rather, it is a bad idea for the American cruise ship industry to reopen at this time as CORVID-19 spread in America is not contained or even managed.

- 0 to 1 million cases: 96 days
- 1M to 2M cases: 44 days
- 8M to 9M cases: 14 days
- 9M to 10M cases: 10 days

Trump’s #election2022 transition temper tantrum is deadly, with #COVID19 spreading rapidly. Biden & Ron Klain needs to unite the America behind a new pandemic strategy.
The coronavirus numbers are so bad, after all the Trump election rallies, that Biden’s advisor is proposing a 6 week shutdown to prevent the hospitals from being overwhelmed again. Cities that had previously opened schools are preparing to shut them down while, insanely, not shutting down restaurants or gyms. Meanwhile, all across America, medium-size indoor social gatherings are spreading the coronavirus like crazy—medium-size social gatherings just like the ones countless Americans are just about to travel far and wide to attend for Thanksgiving and Christmas.
I love the hypocracy of some.
Cases are really bad after the rally super spreader events but the nation wide wave of jubilant demonstrators/celebrations after Biden’s win can’t possibly spread COVID, really.
 
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OPSSG

Super Moderator
Staff member
Keeping in mind that a Biden/Harris proposed shutdown is very unpopular in red states, but they are committed to controlling the rate of spread.
I love the hypocracy of some.
...the nation wide wave of jubilant demonstrators/celebrations after Biden’s win can’t possibly spread COVID, really.
Agreed. The BLM demonstrations and Biden win celebrations are all bad in a pandemic — would be happy to point out hypocrisy on Biden’s side too.

All 3 Twitter posts below are from Trump supporters.

It is not just gatherings, demonstration or celebrations but also a lack of mask wearing culture in the US — both Democrats and Republicans are guilty. In many other countries like Korea, Japan and Singapore, there is 99.9% compliance with mask wearing in public.

Trump/Pence rallies have a very, very, very low mask wearing rate (less than 35%) — because of Trump’s example. Trump’s campaign organisers do not care about the pandemic, and there is no attempt to enforce mask wearing — that is very irresponsible for a sitting President.

Biden/Harris on the other hand encourages mask wearing, and mail-in votes to reduce the risk in a pandemic — the Biden/Harris leadership and transition team are concerned about the spread of CORVID, and I suspect that there is a 70 to 90% rate for mask wearing, for Biden organised venues. In this picture below of a Harris event, there is even social distancing — which is used to infer lack of support for Biden/Harris and suggest fraud.
 
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The bitter truth is that COVID-19 is here to stay. It won't disappear even if the entire world received mass vaccinations which presumably would have the desired effect as intended. Of course we all know this won't be the case. The vaccines are being manufactured in a rush without long-term testing. Frankly we don't even know what effects the many vaccines are going to have on the world populace. Many people are falsely pinning their hopes on a vaccine miracle. This is wishful thinking. This pandemic will be a long trial and error experiment. Surely the scientists and pharmaceutical industries are learning a lot, but it is still in its infancy. The harsh reality is that nature is having its course.

The bad news is that humans were never prepared against a catastrophic pandemic on this scale. Worse, we haven't unified or made an attempt to take the pandemic seriously. Some people believe it is a hoax or a conspiracy to control the masses. Others believe it is an experiment fabricated in a lab. With this kind of attitude there won't be any short-term success in controlling the pandemic. The worst thing is that we are unwilling to learn hard lessons from this catastrophe. The numbers don't lie. Infections are skyrocketing. Not to even mention the number of deceased. Even during a pandemic powerful nations are involved in chestthumping. It is a terrible nightmare.
 
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John Fedup

The Bunker Group
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #666
To date the 1918 flu epidemic was and still is the worst pandemic in the last 200 years or more and if modern transportation existed back then, it may have been much worse.
SARS was a wake up call and some nations took note, notable exception my own country which had an significant outbreak and despite some great efforts by some, quickly forgot about the dangers.

COVID-19 will result in better responses in the future mainly because the economic consequences have been horrendous.
 

hauritz

Well-Known Member
Hard to compare different eras. There was never a vaccine developed for the Spanish flu. It pretty much just ran its course. In the end it was thought that around a third of the world's population might have contracted it. The death rate for the Spanish flu might have been greater than 2.5% but back then treatment for the sick mostly involved just keeping the patient comfortable. Depending on the source somewhere between 17 million and 100 million died from it.

By way of comparison there have so far been around 55 million confirmed cases with around 1.3 million deaths. That is less than one tenth of a percent of the world population. Of course there are almost certainly more cases than have been reported. Probably more deaths as well.

Had Covid 19 struck in 1918 it may well have been deadlier than the Spanish Flu.
 

Todjaeger

Potstirrer
Hard to compare different eras. There was never a vaccine developed for the Spanish flu. It pretty much just ran its course. In the end it was thought that around a third of the world's population might have contracted it. The death rate for the Spanish flu might have been greater than 2.5% but back then treatment for the sick mostly involved just keeping the patient comfortable. Depending on the source somewhere between 17 million and 100 million died from it.

By way of comparison there have so far been around 55 million confirmed cases with around 1.3 million deaths. That is less than one tenth of a percent of the world population. Of course there are almost certainly more cases than have been reported. Probably more deaths as well.

Had Covid 19 struck in 1918 it may well have been deadlier than the Spanish Flu.
Actually a flu vaccine was developed which found to be effective vs. the 1918 pandemic influenza strain. The 2009 H1N1 flu which caused a number of problems had a vaccine developed to help protect against H1N1 influenzas, and testing has since determined that the 1918 influenza strain was also a type of H1N1, and that the 2009 H1N1 vaccine would help provide protection.

This of course is no help to those infected in 1918, but it does illustrate that not only do diseases morph or mutate, but they also come back around. Something similar happening with SARS-CoV-2 is quite possible.
 

CB90

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Actually a flu vaccine was developed which found to be effective vs. the 1918 pandemic influenza strain. The 2009 H1N1 flu which caused a number of problems had a vaccine developed to help protect against H1N1 influenzas, and testing has since determined that the 1918 influenza strain was also a type of H1N1, and that the 2009 H1N1 vaccine would help provide protection.

This of course is no help to those infected in 1918, but it does illustrate that not only do diseases morph or mutate, but they also come back around. Something similar happening with SARS-CoV-2 is quite possible.
I've read some interesting stuff over the past year (written pre COVID, but oddly prescient) on changing the approach to vaccine R&D, making the case that despite having the medical science capable to do so, the current pharmaceutical market simply isn't appropriately incentivized to conduct forward looking R&D to prevent things like this from occurring.

To put it simply, there is no incentive for a pharmaceutical company to expend money to forestall likely emerging pathogens, as they will not be compensated if it doesn't work.

The case that's made is that some segments of the medical community may be better off operating like the defense industry, and actually trying to conduct R&D to have an assortment of treatments/vaccines in place before these things break out and become global threats.
Of course, such research would have the dual purpose benefit of Biological defense and attack, which would probably be complicated to navigate in the perspective of international treaties.
 

Todjaeger

Potstirrer
I've read some interesting stuff over the past year (written pre COVID, but oddly prescient) on changing the approach to vaccine R&D, making the case that despite having the medical science capable to do so, the current pharmaceutical market simply isn't appropriately incentivized to conduct forward looking R&D to prevent things like this from occurring.

To put it simply, there is no incentive for a pharmaceutical company to expend money to forestall likely emerging pathogens, as they will not be compensated if it doesn't work.

The case that's made is that some segments of the medical community may be better off operating like the defense industry, and actually trying to conduct R&D to have an assortment of treatments/vaccines in place before these things break out and become global threats.
Of course, such research would have the dual purpose benefit of Biological defense and attack, which would probably be complicated to navigate in the perspective of international treaties.
I have a fundamental problem with how whole sections of healthcare, including pharmacology and research, is approached and handled.

The basic problem from my POV similarly boils down to healthcare being a for-profit enterprise, which then drives how who does what and when. Companies will not develop vaccines, or treatments, unless they (1) believe that they can make a profit, or are being paid to develop/produce a treatment, drug or vaccine. IMO that sort of model would need to be changed.
 

fozraro

Member
Failure to provide sources
There are plenty of new strains every day considering how many viruses there are in the world. What is considered a pandemic depends on whether it can be politicized.
 

Boagrius

Well-Known Member
Yes, viruses like SARS-Cov-2 do generally mutate on a regular basis. What on earth does that have to do with whether or not the pandemic is politically driven (your original claim)?
 

fozraro

Member
Yes, viruses like SARS-Cov-2 do generally mutate on a regular basis. What on earth does that have to do with whether or not the pandemic is politically driven (your original claim)?
[Mod edit: We have exercised editorial control over your attempt to derail this thread. Learn to have some decorum when your mistakes of fact are pointed out. Consistent failure of logic and attempts at trolling in this thread are not looked upon with favour by the Mod Team.

Read the forum rules and stop posting in this thread for the next 48 hours].
 
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Boagrius

Well-Known Member
This is irrelevant to your original claim that:
What is considered a pandemic depends on whether it can be politicized.
Which is nonsense, since a pandemic is classically defined as "an epidemic occurring worldwide, or over a very wide area, crossing international boundaries and usually affecting a large number of people".

With nearly 55 million confirmed cases, over a million deaths worldwide and 220 countries affected, I can see precisely nothing controversial about classifying COVID19 as a pandemic, the likes of which we have not seen since the Spanish Flu of 1918.
 

fozraro

Member
Mod Edit: Counter factual misinformation deleted. We do not tolerate your attempts to mislead.

Your posting privileges for this thread have been revoked. Any post you make in this thread in the next 48 hours will be deleted and sanctions will be applied.
 
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