Australian Army Discussions and Updates

Boagrius

Well-Known Member
"(l-r) Hanwha Defence Australia REDBACK Infantry Fighting Vehicle, Australian Army Armoured Personnel Carrier M1123 AS4, and Rheinmetall Defence Australia LYNX KF41 Infantry Fighting Vehicle at Russell Offices, Canberra." (Image source ADF image library link)
Defence have a video to go with the above:

 

Redlands18

Well-Known Member
One advantage Rheinmetall will have is the experience gained with Land 400 phase 2, they will have people on the ground who have been through this process before.
 

Anthony_B_78

New Member
A couple of questions on Land 400 Phase 3 since that's the current topic:

I think the decision will be made next year with IOC (I assume that would be one mechanised battalion?) is in about 2025? Then all delivered by 2031? Or is that all a little optimistic?

On the actual numbers. So we're looking at three battalions fielding the IFV, right? "Rifle" companies will need 14 each, then maybe what another 28 per battalion? That would only be 210. Yeah we need more for spares and training, but isn't 450 a bit high?
 

Redlands18

Well-Known Member
A couple of questions on Land 400 Phase 3 since that's the current topic:

I think the decision will be made next year with IOC (I assume that would be one mechanised battalion?) is in about 2025? Then all delivered by 2031? Or is that all a little optimistic?

On the actual numbers. So we're looking at three battalions fielding the IFV, right? "Rifle" companies will need 14 each, then maybe what another 28 per battalion? That would only be 210. Yeah we need more for spares and training, but isn't 450 a bit high?
They are replacing 431 M-113AS4 so yes numbers are pretty spot on. The M-113 come in 7 different variants including APC, Armoured Fitters, Armoured Recovery, Armoured Ambulance, Armoured Mortar, Armoured Command, Armoured Logistics. So we can pretty much expect the same. There is plans for a true SP Mortar fitted with a turreted 120mm Mortar, there has been talk of a Amphibious version but I’m not sure if that is still being planned.
The 2020 Defence update has Land 400 phase 3 going on past 2035 but I’m not sure about IOC, though 2025 sounds a bit optimistic.
We won’t know the actual numbers being ordered until the winner is announced, with phase 2 the number being talked about was always up to 225 but in the end only 211 Boxers have been ordered at this stage.
 

Anthony_B_78

New Member
They are replacing 431 M-113AS4 so yes numbers are pretty spot on. The M-113 come in 7 different variants including APC, Armoured Fitters, Armoured Recovery, Armoured Ambulance, Armoured Mortar, Armoured Command, Armoured Logistics. So we can pretty much expect the same. There is plans for a true SP Mortar fitted with a turreted 120mm Mortar, there has been talk of a Amphibious version but I’m not sure if that is still being planned.
The 2020 Defence update has Land 400 phase 3 going on past 2035 but I’m not sure about IOC, though 2025 sounds a bit optimistic.
We won’t know the actual numbers being ordered until the winner is announced, with phase 2 the number being talked about was always up to 225 but in the end only 211 Boxers have been ordered at this stage.
I wouldn't agree that numbers are spot on based on how many M113s we bought. I mean, there's no plan for the new IFVs to be given to reserve units is there? And even if we look at the M113 numbers, we discover that fewer than that number were upgraded (and what a waste that exercise was, IMHO). Yeah, on a superficial level, it's a replacement for the M113, so you can say about the same number sounds right. But I just don't think that should be the case if we're only outfitting three battalions? Numbers will likely change though, like you say. But then the Boxer numbers haven't changed too much. They make sense to me too. They'll be in use with three armoured cavalry regiments, each with two cavalry squadrons. So, maybe, 40-50 Boxers per regiment? That'd be between a little more than half and up to about 75% of the inventory. Yet three battalions of the IFVs might account for fewer than half of 450. I wonder if the original number is somewhat of an ambit claim? My guess is we'll be lucky to see 350. Or am I completely wrong?
 

aussienscale

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Quick little vid from Hanwha Defence on the Redback Spike LR2 Test firing, comments from the video description:

"This video shows one of two key integration milestones achieved recently on the Hanwha Redback Infantry Fighting Vehicle. The Iron Fist active protection system was successfully demonstrated in late 2020, and several SPIKE LR2 missiles were successfully fired from a Redback vehicle in earlier this year. Team Redback, led by Hanwha Defense Australia, has been formed to deliver best of breed Australian and global technologies to military customers, including the Australian Defence Force. The Redback is under consideration by the Commonwealth under an ongoing tender process for Project LAND 400 Phase 3"

Interesting, was not aware they started doing testing late last year, have already demonstrated the Iron Fist active protection system, would like to see a video on that !! Would assume the Lynx KF-41 following the same time frames ? or do they have a certain amount of time and demonstration points to hit as they go through the phase running their individual program ?

 
View attachment 48094
Massive reorg for the reserves. Losing brigade titles and potentially battalions by the looks of it.
Screen shot taken from Aus and NZ Defender who have taken a doom and gloom approach.
Thank you for sharing. Ties with the Force Structure Plan from a few months back. Would like to see more detail in how this will be implemented.

I guess this is one way to 'change up' the ARes.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
View attachment 48094
Massive reorg for the reserves. Losing brigade titles and potentially battalions by the looks of it.
Screen shot taken from Aus and NZ Defender who have taken a doom and gloom approach.
He is a crank of the highest order that guy, blames ADF ”headsheds” for the demise of his magazine given the changes in media policy over the years, makes up his own designations and names for things out of his own head and constantly gets details wrong.

His opinion of things, is one to take with more than the usual caution, IMHO.
 

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
He is a crank of the highest order that guy, blames ADF ”headsheds” for the demise of his magazine given the changes in media policy over the years, makes up his own designations and names for things out of his own head and constantly gets details wrong.

His opinion of things, is one to take with more than the usual caution, IMHO.
Another Goon squad member?
 

Stormyaus

New Member
View attachment 48094
Massive reorg for the reserves. Losing brigade titles and potentially battalions by the looks of it.
Screen shot taken from Aus and NZ Defender who have taken a doom and gloom approach.
First post, so be kind. The idea of changing up the reserves in this way makes sense - there's a lot of wasted capability in units that in some cases exist to keep a historical title running.

At the same time, limiting to domestic contingencies seems wasted. If I were designing a role or function for the reserves, it would be focused on domestic taskings as well as stability operations in the Pacific - essentially a constabulary function. The current ARes capability would fulfil that function - light vehicles would allow freedom of movement across most countries in the Pacific, and most situations (i.e. RAMSI Mk2 or something similar) would not require a capability beyond light infantry and other supporting assets. Allow reservists who serve with a single unit for 15-20 years to develop relationships with corresponding units, i.e. 1 and 2 RPIR, or the Fijian military, that would enable long-term bonds to be developed, and recognise the value of relationships in the region's cultures.

This is also real work - we've seen deployments on these kinds of operations this century, and it would give focus to Ares training and a true reason for the existence and maintenance of the 2nd division. I'm realistic that in a crisis situation, an ARA BN would deploy first, with Ares units conducting follow-on operations due to readiness constraints. But this could free up ARA units to focus on and respond to contingencies arising from the real and growing threat of great power competition in the region, and also mean that units which will now be essentially mechanised forces wouldn't have to re-roll as light infantry to conduct constabulary operations in the region.
 
He is a crank of the highest order that guy, blames ADF ”headsheds” for the demise of his magazine given the changes in media policy over the years, makes up his own designations and names for things out of his own head and constantly gets details wrong.

His opinion of things, is one to take with more than the usual caution, IMHO.
Very rarely are his articles positive especially when it comes to Subs, Tiger and F-35.
We should only but US gear in his opinion. My subscription won't be renewed after seeing what's actually written. It's a shame we can't post comments on the articles written.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Very rarely are his articles positive especially when it comes to Subs, Tiger and F-35.
We should only but US gear in his opinion. My subscription won't be renewed after seeing what's actually written. It's a shame we can't post comments on the articles written.
Yep, that’s his other issue. He certainly doesn’t want feedback on some of the more ‘exotic’ things he comes up with...

Consequently, I predict a bleak future for his website.
 

aussienscale

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Came across this one today, 7 new watercraft to be build by 2 businesses in Cairns, also found the site for the company doing the design work, not sure which one they will be though ?



Nice to see this all moving along, but again the lack of detail gets a little frustrating !!

Cheers
 
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