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ADF General discussion thread

Discussion in 'Geostrategic Issues' started by Todjaeger, Feb 4, 2012.

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  1. oldsig127

    oldsig127 Active Member

    Mar 13, 2014
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    Article by Stephen Kuper. Anyone here know whether he has any credibility in defence matters? His Linkdin profile says nothing.

    A suggestion to anyone reading this article. Leave the comments alone unless you really want your eyes to bleed from increased blood pressure. On secnd thought, this pretty much applies to most public comments on that site

    ngatimozart likes this.
  2. Takao

    Takao Active Member

    Dec 11, 2017
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    It is just the 2 ex-CAFs and 3 or so ASPI peeps.

    Anytime it's come up at work there has been much derision - from civilian and all military. It's not even a half-baked idea, not even sure the batter is fully mixed.

    Of course, it wasn't the silliest idea I heard today... o_O
  3. buffy9

    buffy9 Member

    Mar 4, 2018
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    HMAS Adelaide's deployment to Op Render Safe in the Solomon Islands coincides rather nicely with the Bougainville referendum for independence, which appears to be going peacefully several weeks out.

    It would seem the LHD is being used as a key signal of the ADF in the region. It is supporting very low end HADR and engagement activities in a key SW Pacific nation, whilst at the same time being present locally for a key regional event - ready to respond if necessary, perhaps.

    I haven't been able to find much info on what assets are loaded aboard besides some MRH-90s, engineer/diver elements, a donated ambulance and various other small support/auxiliary elements. Should there be a situation in Bougainville, Honiara may act as a safe/accessible staging area whereby increased forces can be loaded aboard and then be transported to Bougainville, in conjunction with more tactical airland insertions, should it come to that.

    HMAS Adelaide heads to the Solomons - Australian Defence Magazine

    Factions pave way for lasting peace - Post Courier

    Bougainville prepares for 'peaceful, credible' independence vote - official
  4. Massive

    Massive Active Member

    Feb 20, 2011
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    I definitely agree with this.

    It also leads me to have a fair bit of sympathy for the efforts of Paul Dibb and Hugh White. While I don't typically agree with their answers, they are clearly trying to move to a clear strategy and flow the ADF force structure from this.

    Not many are really prepared to engage in this debate though - it flares and dies quickly.

    It is almost as if a balanced force is the easy answer, so no one asks the hard question that will lead to an equally hard answer.


  5. Volkodav

    Volkodav Defense Professional Verified Defense Pro

    Oct 28, 2010
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    Been reading "The Impact of the Charles F. Adams Class Guided Missile Destroyers on the Royal Australian Navy" by Dr David Shackleton, AO Vice Admiral (RAN Retired).

    Very interesting on the acquisition side of things, well frightening actually, the very successful procurement was more by accident than design, with government policy, the appearance to be a good ally, and the RANs desperation to get anything at all, over riding the capability required to achieve stated objectives. In a nut shell the Adams Class got up because it was American and the cheapest option, had there been a cheaper option, even if it was basically useless, it would have been selected instead.

    Still have a long way to go but interesting statements about the apparent complete lack of understanding of the design compromises necessary in 60s vintage warships by the RAN, let alone the politically classes, the almost total reliance on the RN telling us what we needed and why, and most disturbingly the reason what the construction of the final two River Class DEs was such a mess, have been very informative.

    On the Rivers, Swan and Torrens were constructed without even a formal contract, let alone a fixed design, they were sorted out as they were built. I had no idea that things were so amateurish in the decade before I was born.

    I suppose this explains the romantic desire for simpler less complex times when a person with authority could sell a "bright idea" without any real need to "jump through hoops", it how it actually used to work. Put your idea forward, if it fit the government of the days narrative and was affordable with the money made available, then pretty much anything could get up, whether it fit the actual needs of the ADF or not, is how it actually used to happen. It explains a lot of the waste and inconsistency seen post war.
    ozrock62 and Takao like this.