Which Aircraft Should PAF opt for? [Recent F-16 deal news, etc]

[kashifshahzad]

(rolls virtual eyes) Oh yaara, The Rafale will be the best choice for us.Either that or if we can get our hands on the mother of all Falcons ie the block 60.
Like I said wait for a month, then you'll get plenty of detail on the whys of my assertion/opinion.
P.S take PShamim seriously, he really is what he says.

OK OK you all men plz be cool i am taking Pshamim what he is . what is his name and why dont he make much of the posts here he stick in the other forums

what do you think the block 60 is going to run ??

 

[SABRE]

(rolls virtual eyes) Oh yaara, The Rafale will be the best choice for us.Either that or if we can get our hands on the mother of all Falcons ie the block 60.
Like I said wait for a month, then you'll get plenty of detail on the whys of my assertion/opinion.
P.S take PShamim seriously, he really is what he says.

In short run Block 60s will give PAF a huge boost & edge in the sub-continent but in the long run I favor Rafales since France promisses later version to be way better also make cheap MultiRole version available for export which they say would be better. Lets see. I dnt think any decision would be made before multi-role version is roled out.

 

[P.A.F]

i favour rafale as well as it will fit into the PAF perfectly.

 

[BilalK]

lolz, man I wish we were high ranking PAF officers right now!

I also agree that the Rafale should be procured, currently (as SABRE said) the multi-role version hasn't rolled out from the factory yet, and I think it'll take some time. In the meanwhile the PAF should put its focus on the new F-16s and JF-17s. I hope that the PAF goes for ~80~ Desert Falcons - F-16E/F Block-60 - as it would be a massive boost in capability and technology for PAF.

In all honesty, I believe a large number of Rafales (Multirole version) should be procured, similar to the number of new F-16s we acquire, thats my take anyways.

 

[kashifshahzad]

In short run Block 60s will give PAF a huge boost & edge in the sub-continent but in the long run I favor Rafales since France promisses later version to be way better also make cheap MultiRole version available for export which they say would be better. Lets see. I dnt think any decision would be made before multi-role version is roled out.

i favour rafale as well as it will fit into the PAF perfectly.

lolz, man I wish we were high ranking PAF officers right now!

I also agree that the Rafale should be procured, currently (as SABRE said) the multi-role version hasn't rolled out from the factory yet, and I think it'll take some time. In the meanwhile the PAF should put its focus on the new F-16s and JF-17s. I hope that the PAF goes for ~80~ Desert Falcons - F-16E/F Block-60 - as it would be a massive boost in capability and technology for PAF.

In all honesty, I believe a large number of Rafales (Multirole version) should be procured, similar to the number of new F-16s we acquire, thats my take anyways.

LOL if you were the high ranking Officers right now then i have kicked you out of the AIR FORCE

SEE THIS THEN DECIDE

<H1>Lockheed Martin F-16E/F Block 60/62 Fighting Falcon

Last revised May 8, 2004

</H1>

For a long time, it was uncertain if there would be a Block 60/62 version of the F-16C/D. However, in 1994 the United Arab Emirates (UAE) indicated that they needed 80 long-range strike fighters. The UAE wanted the latest available technology incorporated into these planes, and they indicated that if the USA was not willing to release such technologies, they might consider such competitors as the Eurofighter and the Dassault Rafale.

In pursuit of the UAE contract, Lockheed Martin came up with a delta-winged design based largely on the F-16XL. Wingroot troughs could hold four AIM-120 AMRAAM missiles, and a thrust-vectoring General Electric F110 engine was proposed. The delta-winged F-16 was to carry an improved radar, an internal FLIR and laser designation system, and an improved cockpit with a much more advanced set of multi-function and liquid-crystal displays.

However, very early on Lockheed Martin began to develop second thoughts about such an advanced aircraft, and began to consider a more conventional design for the UAE. The UAE had indicated that they were reluctant to commit themselves to an untried aircraft, one which had no other customers and in particular one in which the USAF was uninterested. By this time, the Pentagon had indicated that they were interested in the Joint Advanced Strike Technology (JAST) project as a potential replacement for the F-16. Lockheed Martin was a contender for the JAST project, and since the delta-winged F-16 could outperform the JAST in virtually every aspect except stealth and for considerably less money, the company might end up competing against itself. The delta-winged F-16 project was quietly shelved.

Lockheed then proposed a Block 60/62 lot of F-16C/Ds for the UAE order. The Block 60/62 would be largely based on the earlier Block 50/52, but would have an internal targeting and navigation system similar to LANTIRN but with only the sensor heads outside the aircraft. However, the Block 60/62 designation would not be applied until the aircraft actually enter production.

Again, two alternative engines would be offered. The Block 60 would be powered by the General Electric F110-GE-129EFE (Enhanced Fighter Engine), which would offer 34,000 lb.s.t with possible growth to 36,000 lb.s.t. The Block 62 would be powered by the Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229A which offers 32,000 lb.s.t, with possible growth to 35,900 lb.s.t. Both of these engines are available with thrust vectoring.

The Block 60/62 will be equipped with a Northrop Grumman sensor suite that will be based on the APG-68(V)5 radar. It is an integrated system that will have an internal targeting and navigation system similar to LANTIRN but with only the sensor heads outside the aircraft. An Agile Beam Radar (ABR) will be provided which will have an active array with a large number of transmit/receive modules This beam can be steered almost instantaneously, making it possible to interleave various radar modes. For example, the radar could search for surface targets and do terrain-following while simultaneously searching for airborne threats.

The cockpit will have the backup electromechanical instruments removed, and three full-color displays will be added.

An attempt will be made to use commercially-available products such as PowerPC and Pentium processors, and the Ethernet databus will be used.

After two years of negotiations (including a controversy of whether computer software codes would be released), the UAE signed contracts on March 5, 2000 for 55 single seat and 25 two-seat Block 60 F-16s. These planes would be known as Desert Falcon. On March 14, it was announced that the powerplant would be the General Electric F110-GE-132, an uprated version of the existing F-16 engine which can deliver 32,000 lb.s.t.

Norway has also expressed an interest in the advanced Block 60 F-16. The RNoAF will require a modern multi-role fighter as it transitions between its F-16 MLU aircraft and the future JSF. Greece and Israel have expressed interest in the Block 60 as well. The advanced F-16 faces stiff competition for these export orders from the Eurofighter and the Dassault Rafaele. However, at the moment, it does not appear that the USAF will itself be interested in a Block 60 F-16, since the JSF is scheduled to replace the F-16 beginning in 2008. This is, of course, subject to change if the JSF is delayed or turns out to be more expensive than expected.

The planned under-nose integrated FLIR targeting system (IFTS) has been replaced by a new podded FLIR mounted on the intake hardpoints. Apparently, there were problems in achieving the promised performance with the original layout. The Northrop Grumman AAQ-32 targeting FLIR and laser designator has been repackaged in a new station. However, the original wide-area navigation FLIR housing above the nose will still be there. The Northrop Grumman APG-68(V)5 agile-beam radar has been redesignated APG-80. The Block 60 aircraft will be capable ob delivering the EGBU-24 Paveway III, the Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM), and the Wind-Corrected Munitions Dispenser (WCMD). In addition, it will be able to carry the AGM-88 HARM, the AIM-9M Sidewinder, and the AIM-120 AMRAAM.

In 2003, the Block 60 was redesignated F-16E/F, in recognition of the major structural, avionics and propulsion system advancements, which make the Block 60 a practically new version of the F-16. The first of 80 Block 60 F-16s for the United Arab Emirates Air Force made its maiden flight at Fort Worth on December 6, 2003. It bore the serial 3001 and wore the civil registration of N161LM. Deliveries are scheduled to run from 2004 to 2007.

And now the General Dynamics F-16C/D Fighting Falcon

[size=+1]<H1 align=left>Origin:USA

Type:single-seat air-combat and multi-role fighterMax Speed:1,146 kt / 1,320 mphMax Range3,886 km / 2,415 milesDimensions:span 10.00 m / 32 ft 9.75 in
length 15.03 m / 49 ft 4 in
height 5.09 m / 16 ft 8.5 inWeight:empty 8,273 kg / 18,218 lb
max. take-off 19,187 lb
Powerplantne 13154-kg (29,000-lb) afterburning thrust Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 or General Electric F110-GE-129 turbofanArmamentne 20-mm M61A1 Vulcan cannon with 500 rounds, plus provision for up to 9276 kg (20,450 Ib) of externa ordnance on one underfuselage, six underwing and two tip hardpoints, this total declining to 5420 kg (11,950 Ib) for sorties including 9-g manoeuvres; the ordnance can include AIM-9 Sidewinder and AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missiles, a wide range of disposable ordnance (free-tall and guided), drop tanks and electronic pods (ECM, reconnaissance and targeting)​

</H1>[/size]


and now your
Dassault Rafale

Origin:France
Type:multi-role combat aircraftMax Speed:1,150 kt / 1,324 mphMax Range1,093 km / 679 milesDimensions:span 10.90 m / 35 ft 9.125 in
length 15.30 m / 50 ft 2.375 in
height 5.34 m / 17 ft 6.25 inWeight:empty 9060 kg / 19,973 lb
maximum 19,500 kg / 42,990 lb
Powerplant:two 7450-kg (16,424-lb) afterburning thrust SNECMA M88-2 turbofansArmamentne 30-mm DEFA 791 B cannon, plus provision for up to 6000 kg (13,228 Ib) of disposable stores carried on 14 external hardpoints




Now compare them LOL

 

[kashifshahzad]

General Dynamics F-16C/D Fighting Falcon

Origin:USA
Type:single-seat air-combat and multi-role fighterMax Speed:1,146 kt / 1,320 mphMax Range3,886 km / 2,415 milesDimensions:span 10.00 m / 32 ft 9.75 in
length 15.03 m / 49 ft 4 in
height 5.09 m / 16 ft 8.5 inWeight:empty 8,273 kg / 18,218 lb
max. take-off 19,187 lb
Powerplant:{one 13154-kg (29,000-lb) afterburning thrust Pratt & Whitney F100-PW-229 or General Electric F110-GE-129 turbofanArmament:{one 20-mm M61A1 Vulcan cannon with 500 rounds, plus provision for up to 9276 kg (20,450 Ib) of externa ordnance on one underfuselage, six underwing and two tip hardpoints, this total declining to 5420 kg (11,950 Ib) for sorties including 9-g manoeuvres; the ordnance can include AIM-9 Sidewinder and AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missiles, a wide range of disposable ordnance (free-tall and guided), drop tanks and electronic pods (ECM, reconnaissance and targeting)