US Navy News and updates

[FormerDirtDart]

I would guess a number of people may be wondering "How many Mk VIs can they fit in a well deck?"
View attachment 47725

@FormerDirtDart Source for this image please. Rule #14 applies.
Ngatimozart

It's an image clipped from a US Navy slide pack that has been on my hard drive since around the time the first prototype (Coastal Command Boat) was delivered. (so 2013-ish)
To satisfy your desires, my mornings research has determined it was part of a briefing delivered by US Navy Under Secretary Bob Work at the Cato Institute in 2012.

 

[FormerDirtDart]

SM-2 launched from the Zumwalt for the first time.
Now, if only they had ammo for those two gun on the front of the boat

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1318294219690311682

 

[Terran]

USS Zumwalt Successfully Completes First Standard Missile Shot - Naval News

The USS Zumwalt (DDG 1000) successfully executed the first live fire test of the MK 57 Vertical Launching System with a Standard Missile (SM-2) on the Naval Air Weapons Center Weapons Division Sea Test Range, Point Mugu, Oct. 13.

www.navalnews.com

Sadly not going to happen, there have been pushes to adapt the system to more conventional shells like modified Excalibur rounds but that was dropped. In 2018 there was talk of using BAE HVPs. In either case step one would be modifying the AGS loading system to accommodate the new rounds. That’s $250million then the cost of the shell which though cheaper the the original still costs as much as a fully loaded car.

 

[John Fedup]

I guess the biggest problem is there are only 6 guns in the fleet and even dumb rounds would cost a fortune for such a small gun number. No point in modifying the AGS for such a small number either.

Would a 155 mm HVP In the AGS have significant advantages over a 127 mm version used in naval guns? Could the AGS fit into a AB? If so, then 30-40 guns added to the fleet might make the rounds more economical.

Maybe a fantasy modification of the AGS is needed using the army’s 1000 mile range gun. Design a new big armoured hull for these new guns and place 4-6 guns per hull and BBs make a comeback.

Leaked Images Show the Army’s Mind-Bending New Super Gun

The Strategic Long Range Cannon has a range of over 1,000 miles.

www.google.ca

 

[FormerDirtDart]

I guess the biggest problem is there are only 6 guns in the fleet and even dumb rounds would cost a fortune for such a small gun number. No point in modifying the AGS for such a small number either.

Would a 155 mm HVP In the AGS have significant advantages over a 127 mm version used in naval guns? Could the AGS fit into a AB? If so, then 30-40 guns added to the fleet might make the rounds more economical.

Maybe a fantasy modification of the AGS is needed using the army’s 1000 mile range gun. Design a new big armoured hull for these new guns and place 4-6 guns per hull and BBs make a comeback.

Leaked Images Show the Army’s Mind-Bending New Super Gun

The Strategic Long Range Cannon has a range of over 1,000 miles.

www.google.ca

Essentially BAE believed a variant of the AGS could fit on an AB. And, I would have to agree. If such a system had been added to AB Flt III plans, the LRLAP ammunition development and procurement might have been more economically viable. It would have also been likely that such a gun mount might have been considered for the USN Future Surface Combatant.
The 155mm Advanced Gun System-Lite (AGS-L) for DDG-51 Flight III

 

[John Fedup]

Is this proposal grasping at straws or just plain bizarre? It is a suggestion that the US could supplement its naval forces by having privateers going after Chinese commercial vessels thus hampering China economically. China would certainly arm and train crews for this thus requiring substantially capable armed “pirate“ ships. The USN is having a hard enough time getting its ship number up, where is this new fleet going to come from?
American Pirates? US privateers could help win a war with China

 

[spoz]

Oh, for heavens sake. Privateering was banned in 1856 by the Declaration of Paris and the second Hague Convention of 1907 to which the US was party. It now is a recognised part of international law. Therefore, anybody not a state who attacks merchant ships is a pirate, not a privateer; and any state which alleged it could issue letters of marque would be seen as committing a crime and therefore would lose all international support.

 

[DDG38]

Is this proposal grasping at straws or just plain bizarre? It is a suggestion that the US could supplement its naval forces by having privateers going after Chinese commercial vessels thus hampering China economically. China would certainly arm and train crews for this thus requiring substantially capable armed “pirate“ ships. The USN is having a hard enough time getting its ship number up, where is this new fleet going to come from?
American Pirates? US privateers could help win a war with China

So many holes with this article I don't know where to start. Aside from the political implications and ensuing PR nightmare for the US, the assumption is flawed thinking that the USN will be at war with China by itself. Then there's the issue of heavily armed contractors (as that's what they'll be) taking on very quickly also heavily armed Chinese merchant ships. Absolute bollocks. I wonder if the authors of the article have shares with Blackwater ?

 

[Terran]

I wonder if the authors of the article have shares with Blackwater ?

Blackwater isn’t Blackwater anymore. It hasn’t been for over 9 years. It’s called Academi now. It’s kept its nose clean so far which is why most people don’t even seem to know it’s current name.

 

[John Fedup]

Blackwater isn’t Blackwater anymore. It hasn’t been for over 9 years. It’s called Academi now. It’s kept its nose clean so far which is why most people don’t even seem to know it’s current name.

It is also likely that the reduced demand for their services has helped keep the current low profile.

 

[John Fedup]

Another negative story on the LCS which explains why the USN is anxious to see the frigate program underway. This article describes the propulsion problem with the Freedom class. Unfortunately there isn’t much information on the Independence class issues. If it is performing better it should given preference for the remaining builds. This probably can’t happen due to pork barrel politics.

Another littoral combat ship breaks down on deployment

It's the latest in a string of reliability issues that have plagued the LCS since its introduction to the fleet.

www.defensenews.com

 

[John Fedup]

Interesting story as to why the USN has a private forest.

Why the US Navy Manages Its Own Private Forest

When you need 200-year-old trees to repair a 200-year-old ship, where do you go? The Navy thought ahead.

www.military.com

 

[FormerDirtDart]

Another negative story on the LCS which explains why the USN is anxious to see the frigate program underway. This article describes the propulsion problem with the Freedom class. Unfortunately there isn’t much information on the Independence class issues. If it is performing better it should given preference for the remaining builds. This probably can’t happen due to pork barrel politics.

Another littoral combat ship breaks down on deployment

It's the latest in a string of reliability issues that have plagued the LCS since its introduction to the fleet.

www.defensenews.com

The Independence-class has already been given preference for the remaining builds.
The last Freedom-class build is already on order, USS Cleveland (LCS-31). Which was awarded 21 months ago.
A total of 16 Freedom-class ships have been ordered, 15 built or under construction. While 19 Independence-class have been ordered, with 17 built or under construction and 2 additional contracts already awarded. The last 4 Independence-class ships were ordered in late 2018 (2 in Sep, 2 in Dec)

 

[cdxbow]

The Independence-class has already been given preference for the remaining builds.
The last Freedom-class build is already on order, USS Cleveland (LCS-31). Which was awarded 21 months ago.
A total of 16 Freedom-class ships have been ordered, 15 built or under construction. While 19 Independence-class have been ordered, with 17 built or under construction and 2 additional contracts already awarded. The last 4 Independence-class ships were ordered in late 2018 (2 in Sep, 2 in Dec)

Was that decision related to size/capacity?

 

[CB90]

USS Zumwalt Successfully Completes First Standard Missile Shot - Naval News

The USS Zumwalt (DDG 1000) successfully executed the first live fire test of the MK 57 Vertical Launching System with a Standard Missile (SM-2) on the Naval Air Weapons Center Weapons Division Sea Test Range, Point Mugu, Oct. 13.

www.navalnews.com

Sadly not going to happen, there have been pushes to adapt the system to more conventional shells like modified Excalibur rounds but that was dropped. In 2018 there was talk of using BAE HVPs. In either case step one would be modifying the AGS loading system to accommodate the new rounds. That’s $250million then the cost of the shell which though cheaper the the original still costs as much as a fully loaded car.

The biggest issue is that the AGS is only 3 ship sets of guns.
And not only is it just 3 ship sets, they're on very "exquisite" platforms which need to be able to standoff from enemy counterfire, which means they require rounds with very high end performance.

HVP was a great idea because it was intended to be a concept that could be scaled down to provide a HVP option for the massive fleet of MK45 5" guns in service. It would have allowed a justification of funds as the cost/benefit would have been spread out over nearly all USN surface combatants. With that withering on the vine of funding, the justification to put it on Zumwalt shrinks considerably.

The best bet now is for a gun program that shows promise of providing a revolutionary improvement in gun capability (something like railgun level of performance), at which point Zumwalt makes for a great test platform.

 

[John Fedup]

HVP rounds for rail guns will likely happen at some point. The research on the shell designs has resulted in determining such shells can enhance power gun capabilities albeit at lower velocities gun a rail gun. Although such HVP shells for the AGS could be manufactured for less than the PGM rounds that were priced at $800k, the pricing would still be prohibitive for a 9 gun application. Had more DDG1000s been built with these guns (10-15) then either shell could be viable with sufficient quantities. If a future large surface combatant ship happens, then a HVP AGS package or rail gun will be possible options. For the Zummies, probably removal of the AGS then add more missiles.

 

[John Fedup]

This Forbes article recommends the disposal of the Freedom class LCS and an accelerated build for the new generation frigate. Given the record to date, termination seems like a good idea IMHO. The LCS split buy was politically driven along with the desire to keep yards open. One has to wonder if anyone in charge back then was aware of how problematic the Freedoms would be. The speed specification played a large part in this saga and a monohull required the exotic propulsion system that the Freedom class ended up with.

it will be interesting to see what happens.

Now Is The Perfect Time To Sink The Freedom Class Littoral Combat Ship

It is time for the U. S. Navy to declare the Freedom class Littoral Combat Ship an irredeemable failure.

www.forbes.com

 

[Antipode]

This Forbes article recommends the disposal of the Freedom class LCS and an accelerated build for the new generation frigate. Given the record to date, termination seems like a good idea IMHO. The LCS split buy was politically driven along with the desire to keep yards open. One has to wonder if anyone in charge back then was aware of how problematic the Freedoms would be. The speed specification played a large part in this saga and a monohull required the exotic propulsion system that the Freedom class ended up with.

it will be interesting to see what happens.

Now Is The Perfect Time To Sink The Freedom Class Littoral Combat Ship

It is time for the U. S. Navy to declare the Freedom class Littoral Combat Ship an irredeemable failure.

www.forbes.com

I say kill the poor thing already, as well.

IMHO It's just not worth it to have such a headache over a craft that even (expensively) perfected wouldn't add that a critical capability to the USN. There are alternatives and other pressing matters, it would make sense that they scratch it in pro of accelerating the Constellation class.


Salud!

 

[StobieWan]

This Forbes article recommends the disposal of the Freedom class LCS and an accelerated build for the new generation frigate. Given the record to date, termination seems like a good idea IMHO. The LCS split buy was politically driven along with the desire to keep yards open. One has to wonder if anyone in charge back then was aware of how problematic the Freedoms would be. The speed specification played a large part in this saga and a monohull required the exotic propulsion system that the Freedom class ended up with.

it will be interesting to see what happens.

Now Is The Perfect Time To Sink The Freedom Class Littoral Combat Ship

It is time for the U. S. Navy to declare the Freedom class Littoral Combat Ship an irredeemable failure.

www.forbes.com

Over due - the program should have down-selected one of the hulls earlier which is why neither were specified with common sensors, CMS etc.

Clear them out of inventory and you save a logistics and training overhead- allocate more funding to buying more constellation and get done with it.

 

[Systems Adict]

Was having a look at some of the articles on the news feed of Linked-IN & saw this...

Shipbuilding: Here today, gone tomorrow

It makes for interesting reading, as it mirrors some of the discussions / concerns that other nations (like the UK) have had over the last 30 years...