The Russian-Ukrainian War Thread

seaspear · Apr 16, 2023

We are off the thread but with stealth and low observability ,there are many different claims on the detection by radar this article provides some information about the radar cross section and detection range, but all radars are not of same capability ,the f-35 is claimed to have a cross section of 0.0015 per square metre Stealth.pdf (williamdoneil.com)
What is the radar cross section of the F-35? – ProfoundAdvice (profoundadvices.com)
Also China has made claims on having quantum radars that are in dispute

Feanor · Apr 16, 2023

Larry_L said:
I recently had a look at Ukraine weapons tracker. They are tracking weapons received, and destroyed. Of interest to me, among other things, are a Russian Russian 1L119 Nebo-SVU multi-functional radar as well as a Ukrainian Crab howitzer. This is the first report I have seen of one of those destroyed.

Plenty of Krab howitzers have been destroyed. Lostarmour lists 11 destroyed Krabs with footage to confirm, making this a low-end estimate.

Потери бронетехники в вооруженном конфликте на Украине 2014-2023 гг

Список уничтоженных бронемашин, обновляемый командой проекта LOSTARMOUR на основании данных из открытых источников

lostarmour.info

Feanor · Apr 16, 2023

seaspear said:
We are off the thread but with stealth and low observability ,there are many different claims on the detection by radar this article provides some information about the radar cross section and detection range, but all radars are not of same capability ,the f-35 is claimed to have a cross section of 0.0015 per square metre Stealth.pdf (williamdoneil.com)
What is the radar cross section of the F-35? – ProfoundAdvice (profoundadvices.com)
Also China has made claims on having quantum radars that are in dispute

Let's keep this on topic. The RCS of F-35s, and capabilities of quantum radars are not relevant to this discuss. The closest to a LO aircraft in play is the Su-57 and it's being used very sparingly, if at all.

Bob53 · Apr 16, 2023

Is anyone else scratching their heads at the reticence to send F16s to the Ukraine? If reports are true that the Ukraine will exhaust their S300 & BUK missile supplies by early May this presents a significant issue in pushing any counter offensive forward. Any massing of troops and equipment (including deep behind the lines) would be vulnerable with out adequate air cover or missile stocks. If that was to happen the Ukraine would have next to now no air force cover as such and significantly reduce Surface to Air capability.

If F16s could be supplied in reasonable numbers ...say 20-40 it would go a long way to keeping Russian airforce on the other side of the border. I dont really think the argument that it takes time to train the pilots flies anymore. The Ukrainians have proven adept at taking on and mastering Western Defence technology. I am concerned its now looking to be too little too late.

vikingatespam · Apr 16, 2023

Bob53 said:
Is anyone else scratching their heads at the reticence to send F16s to the Ukraine? If reports are true that the Ukraine will exhaust their S300 & BUK missile supplies by early May this presents a significant issue in pushing any counter offensive forward. Any massing of troops and equipment (including deep behind the lines) would be vulnerable with out adequate air cover or missile stocks. If that was to happen the Ukraine would have next to now no air force cover as such and significantly reduce Surface to Air capability.

If F16s could be supplied in reasonable numbers ...say 20-40 it would go a long way to keeping Russian airforce on the other side of the border. I dont really think the argument that it takes time to train the pilots flies anymore. The Ukrainians have proven adept at taking on and mastering Western Defence technology. I am concerned its now looking to be too little too late.

F16 would be vulnerable to RU S-300 systems. UKR needs AA missiles, and I would hope that someone has been working on the issue of producing knock-off munitions in the last year. Should be possible ?

Feanor · Apr 16, 2023

Bob53 said:
Is anyone else scratching their heads at the reticence to send F16s to the Ukraine? If reports are true that the Ukraine will exhaust their S300 & BUK missile supplies by early May this presents a significant issue in pushing any counter offensive forward. Any massing of troops and equipment (including deep behind the lines) would be vulnerable with out adequate air cover or missile stocks. If that was to happen the Ukraine would have next to now no air force cover as such and significantly reduce Surface to Air capability.

If F16s could be supplied in reasonable numbers ...say 20-40 it would go a long way to keeping Russian airforce on the other side of the border. I dont really think the argument that it takes time to train the pilots flies anymore. The Ukrainians have proven adept at taking on and mastering Western Defence technology. I am concerned its now looking to be too little too late.

F-16s are vulnerable, expensive, and there's the issue of pilots. Probably a late model F-16 with AESA would be a match for an Su-35S. But are those readily available in quantities? Or are we talking about F-16A/Bs out of storage? And as is pointed out above would be vulnerable to Russian GBAD. On the flip side supplying Ukraine with IRIS-T, Patriots, etc. solves the exhaustion of missile stocks and doesn't create the same problem. Of course there's the issue of whether they're concentrated to protect cities from strikes against the power grid, or on the front line covering troops. And Ukraine has lost SAMs by deploying them within hitting range of Russian Iskanders and Tornado-S.

Bob53 · Apr 17, 2023

Yes just about any fighter at risk of GBAD but no more than Mig 29. And GBAD needs to be within range and th3 Ukrainians have proven adept at avoid ping or Destroying GBADs within the range. No Patriot system in numbers are going to be supplied in time for any counter offensive,. in my view F16s should have been supplied over the past 6 months. At least they can deny unfettered access to Ukrainians sky and out up a fight against some of the other generation SUs should they come into contact. Russian Air Commanders would probably be reluctant to fly over the Ukraine knowing a flight of F16s is in the region armed with AMRAAM.

swerve · Apr 17, 2023

vikingatespam said:
F16 would be vulnerable to RU S-300 systems. UKR needs AA missiles, and I would hope that someone has been working on the issue of producing knock-off munitions in the last year. Should be possible ?

There's been some adaption to allow western missiles to be fired from some of Ukraine's ex-Soviet launchers, but IIRC so far they're getting old stocks. Vastly better than launchers with no missiles to fire, but not necessarily any better than (or even as effective as) the missiles that have been used up, let alone new western SAM systems.

T.C.P · Apr 17, 2023

swerve said:
There's been some adaption to allow western missiles to be fired from some of Ukraine's ex-Soviet launchers, but IIRC so far they're getting old stocks. Vastly better than launchers with no missiles to fire, but not necessarily any better than (or even as effective as) the missiles that have been used up, let alone new western SAM systems.

The Franken Sam project is very interesting. IIRC, they are going to launch sparrows from Buks. I wonder what the range and effectiveness will be.

Russian tank POV of being hit by an FPV drone. The tank just shrugs it off. Ukraine is developing bigger FPVs with HEAT levels of explosive and this drone was not one of them. Also it will be interesting to see how cope cages deal with FPVs. Cope nets have been very successfu on both sides even stopping advanced loitering munitions like the Lancet. Waiting for a video of a FPV hitting a cope cage.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/12pau5y
In the Zaporizhiye area, around 30miles from the front, Lancets hit a UKR boat.-

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/12ppfw1
Considering how slow they are,potential UKR river assault will be subject to some vulnerablities. ATGMS, Lancets, will all be ablle to target riverine boats with ease. I wonder how they would fare at night. I have yet to see Lancet attacks at night and dont think they are capable of night attacks.

Larry_L · Apr 17, 2023

Feanor said:
Plenty of Krab howitzers have been destroyed. Lostarmour lists 11 destroyed Krabs with footage to confirm, making this a low-end estimate.

Потери бронетехники в вооруженном конфликте на Украине 2014-2023 гг

Список уничтоженных бронемашин, обновляемый командой проекта LOSTARMOUR на основании данных из открытых источников

lostarmour.info

Thanks for reminding me of that site. I found the English side. They currently list 13 Krabs as lost.

Larry_L · Apr 17, 2023

There have been reports of Prigozhin saying Russia should saying Russia should stop where they are at and declare it's goals as achieved. The Instutite for the Study of War clarifies what he really means, which is really almost the opposite.

Quote from ISW: Prigozhin established a strawman argument he attributed to Russia’s “internal enemies” who seek to rationalize Russia ending the war in Ukraine now.[2] The point of his essay was to attack this strawman, not to advance it. Prigozhin actually called on Russia to commit to a decisive fight that will either defeat Ukraine or result in a temporary Russian defeat that will catalyze Russia’s nationalist rebirth and set conditions for future victory.[3] A full reading of Prigozhin's essay, titled, “Only an Honest Fight: No Negotiations,” does not lend itself to any reasonable interpretation that Prigozhin advocated for an end to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine.

Institute for the Study of War

Reporting from some Western sources that Wagner Group financier Yevgeny Prigozhin called for Russia to end its war against Ukraine is inaccurate. Some Western reports covering Prigozhin’s April 14 essay on a potential Ukrainian counteroffensive and the f

understandingwar.org

Wagner Group Head Urges Moscow To Wind Down War In Ukraine

Yevgeny Prigozhin, the Kremlin-connected businessman who controls the Wagner mercenary group that is playing a leading role in the fighting in eastern Ukraine, has said that a long conflict in Ukraine could lead to the dissolution of Russia.

www.rferl.org

I have used Google translate on Russian sites at time and come away confused with partial understanding. Now I have to question sites that should have good translators.

KipPotapych · Apr 17, 2023

T.C.P said:
The Franken Sam project is very interesting. IIRC, they are going to launch sparrows from Buks. I wonder what the range and effectiveness will be.

Russian tank POV of being hit by an FPV drone. The tank just shrugs it off. Ukraine is developing bigger FPVs with HEAT levels of explosive and this drone was not one of them. Also it will be interesting to see how cope cages deal with FPVs. Cope nets have been very successfu on both sides even stopping advanced loitering munitions like the Lancet. Waiting for a video of a FPV hitting a cope cage.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/12pau5y
In the Zaporizhiye area, around 30miles from the front, Lancets hit a UKR boat.-

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/12ppfw1
Considering how slow they are,potential UKR river assault will be subject to some vulnerablities. ATGMS, Lancets, will all be ablle to target riverine boats with ease. I wonder how they would fare at night. I have yet to see Lancet attacks at night and dont think they are capable of night attacks.

It appears I need the reddit app to open these links, which I do not have and have no interest of getting one. A bit of looking and I found these, that I am assuming are the same thing on Telegram.

The tank and the drone:

Операция Z: Военкоры Русской Весны

‼️Кадры удара: наш Т-72 получил в лоб FPV-дрон с гранатой РПГ-7 у Марьинки Российский танк выдержал попадание дрона-камикадзе с противотанковым снарядом, возможно помогла динамическая защита. t.me/RVvoenkor

t.me

The boat:

Операция Z: Военкоры Русской Весны

‼️БАРС «Каскад» поразил боевой катер ВСУ на Днепре «Ланцетом» БПЛА-камикадзе точно влетел во вражеское военное плавсредство. t.me/RVvoenkor

t.me

T.C.P · Apr 17, 2023

KipPotapych said:
It appears I need the reddit app to open these links, which I do not have and have no interest of getting one. A bit of looking and I found these, that I am assuming are the same thing on Telegram.

The tank and the drone:

Операция Z: Военкоры Русской Весны

‼️Кадры удара: наш Т-72 получил в лоб FPV-дрон с гранатой РПГ-7 у Марьинки Российский танк выдержал попадание дрона-камикадзе с противотанковым снарядом, возможно помогла динамическая защита. t.me/RVvoenkor

t.me

The boat:

Операция Z: Военкоры Русской Весны

‼️БАРС «Каскад» поразил боевой катер ВСУ на Днепре «Ланцетом» БПЛА-камикадзе точно влетел во вражеское военное плавсредство. t.me/RVvoenkor

t.me

all the Russian footage on reddit, is from the telegram groups, so you wont need it anyway

KipPotapych · Apr 17, 2023

^ I see. Thanks. Don’t think I had ever seen links like that, haha. Usually, they open in a separate window and ask if I want to open them in the app or proceed with the browser; here they “demanded” I get the app.

Feanor · Apr 17, 2023

Update. Feb. 27th-Mar. 3rd

Kherson-Nikolaev-Odessa.

Reportedly Ukraine lost an Su-24 in Kherson region. Note this is based on the reports of the pilot's death, rather then confirmation of a downing.

Colonelcassad

Армией России уничтожен бомбардировщик ВВСУ. Киевские ресурсы пишут, что вчера в Херсонской области был сбит фронтовой бомбардировщик Су-24 "Доветряных сил" Украины. Как минимум один из членов экипажа ликвидирован. @RVvoenkor

t.me

The West.

Russian Shahed strikes in Khmel'nitskiy.

The Russian-Ukrainian War Thread

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