iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
Despite all the naysayers, it's going to happen.
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0
- Thread starter OPSSG
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downunderblue
Active Member
Am back after some time offline here.
Can anyone explain in layman terms why the Govt is taking so long to select the GPF?
I assume DOD/RAN need to go through a lot of processes, to be readied before the Minister, before he then makes a submission before Cabinet for determination.
I'd argue if this was a priority then it should have been determined in the previous Government, and we lost 6m with the election, but we need a decision asap.
Anyone aware (unclass) where we are at? So much of the issue with the subs and the lack of hulls clearly comes from political indecision, but arent we back there again?
Get on with it Marles.
Can anyone explain in layman terms why the Govt is taking so long to select the GPF?
I assume DOD/RAN need to go through a lot of processes, to be readied before the Minister, before he then makes a submission before Cabinet for determination.
I'd argue if this was a priority then it should have been determined in the previous Government, and we lost 6m with the election, but we need a decision asap.
Anyone aware (unclass) where we are at? So much of the issue with the subs and the lack of hulls clearly comes from political indecision, but arent we back there again?
Get on with it Marles.
downunderblue
Active Member
I was in Adelaide last week with the kids for the school holidays. We went for a 'mystery drive' where I ended up going exactly where I wanted to, and we drove up past Osborne.
Of note, I noticed from a distance what appeared to be a modern warship which seemed out of place. I was puzzled and wondered if it was a foreign warship in for repairs etc, but today I googled away and think instead I observed NUSHIP EYRE alongside the pier. From the bow, she looks quite impressive, but the superstructure belies it's small general displacement.
The below pic was sourced on another forum and allegedly recently taken by an amateur photographer. I assume he had a massive telefoto lens or was on the water as it's reasonable hard to see (especially using my eyes) whilst docked at Osborne.
Whilst keeping the kids preoccupied, I took them to the St Kilda Adventure Playground. The little one was grumpy so we ended up cutting it short, but one other observable was we passed an ADF fenced area with some radio towers or similar. I learned this was the St Kilda Transmitting Station, which apparently was announced in 2021 as a test facility for Aegis supporting integration for the Hunter and upgraded Hobarts. There seems to be a lot going on in Adelaide, at least from a Defence perspective alone (I won't comment on the town in general- note I said town, not 'city').
Cut a long story short, between all that, and RAAF Edinburgh, the SA economy seems very invested in Defense industry and sustainment, which makes me curious as a Victorian how we missed out on all this over the years. Clearly Williamstown Naval Dockyard didn't have much space to expand, so good luck to SA, but I used to love seeing the FFG's being built there in the 80's. Time flies.
Of note, I noticed from a distance what appeared to be a modern warship which seemed out of place. I was puzzled and wondered if it was a foreign warship in for repairs etc, but today I googled away and think instead I observed NUSHIP EYRE alongside the pier. From the bow, she looks quite impressive, but the superstructure belies it's small general displacement.
The below pic was sourced on another forum and allegedly recently taken by an amateur photographer. I assume he had a massive telefoto lens or was on the water as it's reasonable hard to see (especially using my eyes) whilst docked at Osborne.
Whilst keeping the kids preoccupied, I took them to the St Kilda Adventure Playground. The little one was grumpy so we ended up cutting it short, but one other observable was we passed an ADF fenced area with some radio towers or similar. I learned this was the St Kilda Transmitting Station, which apparently was announced in 2021 as a test facility for Aegis supporting integration for the Hunter and upgraded Hobarts. There seems to be a lot going on in Adelaide, at least from a Defence perspective alone (I won't comment on the town in general- note I said town, not 'city').
Cut a long story short, between all that, and RAAF Edinburgh, the SA economy seems very invested in Defense industry and sustainment, which makes me curious as a Victorian how we missed out on all this over the years. Clearly Williamstown Naval Dockyard didn't have much space to expand, so good luck to SA, but I used to love seeing the FFG's being built there in the 80's. Time flies.
Nice to see you back.
I think final submissions were in March. Marles has stated he intends to announce the selected platform this year, so call it somewhere between Oct-Dec.
The department have stated they would normally be ready to present to the minister in first half 2026 for this type of tender. So we have a mismatch, but the delaying party would be Defence rather than the minister.
I suspect in the end the minister will win.
I would expect that before announcement the government would want to have the contract signed by both parties. So all terms and conditions would have to be resolved. Even with simple commercial contracts, this stage of the process can take months as both parties haggle and negotiate, and often need to obtain their own board approvals. The final document can be hundreds, if not thousands of pages long, all requiring line by line checking. Bear in mind that the deal needs to include the first three hulls plus an agreement for onshoring the remainder.
I'm thinking that both suppliers would have included optional extras, which is also normal in a tendering process. Some of these might be interesting to the government, but require additional time to flesh out. For instance MHI might have offered to provide two or three hulls by 2029 rather than just one. If that were on the table, spending an extra couple of months to reach agreement would pay off enormusly over the next several years.
The other part is probity. All it takes is for one mistake to be made in the tender evaluation process and the looser has the ability to lodge a complaint. If they do so it can stop everything and force the government to start again. Spending time to ensure the process is watertight is important.
That's a very foggy horizon in that photo, so I'm thinking the photographer must have been on the water. Nice shot and good to see Eyre functional and under her own power. I'm assuming this came from contractor trials.
Musashi_kenshin
Well-Known Member
Ah yes, good old "lawfare". Can't win on merits, get the courts involved.
It seems that every month or so there's a new piece of news about why MHI is the only sensible choice - the latest one being the offer to share IP with Australia.
Naturally the process should be done properly, but the constant arse-covering and cost of bureaucracy is becoming increasingly crippling in democratic countries.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
Agree about the bureaucracy issue, especially applicable to my country! WRT to the GPF selection for Australia, the Mogami frigate has a lot going for it., capability, in production, quick delivery, planned local production down the road, and now IP rights. Japan is a local ally with lots of expertise commercially and militarily. IIRC correctly, Japan was very disappointed when the first sub competition went to France. The order should go to Japan, just my two cents.
Would Bisalloy steel be part of discussion on ships built in Japan?
www.aumanufacturing.com.au
Bisalloy to supply steel into US navy shipbuilding - Australian Manufacturing Forum
Armour steel manufacturer Bisalloy Steel has broken into the US military shipbuilding market, snaring a purchase order for processed Australian steel from Newport News Shipbuilding. Newport News is a division of HII, the largest military shipbuilder in the US and one of two US companies that...
www.aumanufacturing.com.au
Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
At least 12 months ago, it was announced that Bissalloy would export 250t of their steel to HII which has been refined specifically for submarine construction. It’s an enhancement of the steel used in the Collins class which is considered to be stronger and easier to weld than the HY100 used in US submarines & the UK version of HY80 used in the Astute class. The initial steel shipment was for HII to conduct tests as to its suitability for use in USN submarines - I haven’t seen any reports that indicate that this has progressed and would certainly be in contravention of Trump’s American made requirement.
One of the features of the steel is its very high tolerance to blast which may suit using it to protect vital areas of surface ships such as the GPF’s however, I suspect that MHI also have very high spec steel available in-house.
One of the features of the steel is its very high tolerance to blast which may suit using it to protect vital areas of surface ships such as the GPF’s however, I suspect that MHI also have very high spec steel available in-house.