kiwipatriot69
Active Member
I'm not a gun owner, so can anyone clue me in on what Hunter, duck , rabbit, deer or pig would require a AR 15 rifle for? Seems abit overkill, to me. Or target shooting really?
NZDF General discussion thread
- Thread starter NZLAV
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I'm not a gun owner, so can anyone clue me in on what Hunter, duck , rabbit, deer or pig would require a AR 15 rifle for? Seems abit overkill, to me. Or target shooting really?
wwhether you agree with it or not that was essentially the basis for the oz changes kp69
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
That’s why Snipers still use Bolt Action Rifles, they are still more accurate. Automatic and Semi Automatic Weapons are designed for one thing, killing large numbers of Humans.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
Australia got very tough on Gun Laws in the late 90s after a guy who was a couple of Roos short in the Back Paddock(low intelligence) got hold of a couple and gunned down 35 people in a mass Shooting in Tasmania.
Thoughts and best wishes to you and those who survived this tragic event.
Such bigotry,hatred and violence has no place in a civilized liberal democracy.
Take care
Regards Cam
Thanks and greatly appreciated. I remember after the quakes our Aussie cobbers were the first here, and we had Aussie cops from all states on the streets here helping our cops. They were bloody brilliant, did Australia very proud and we remember them with a lot of fondness.Unfortunately it appears the Shooter was a Person from the Continent to the west of you, I will not call him by his nationality as he does deserve that honour.
On behalf of all your Cobbers this side of the Ditch I would like to apologise if true to all our Anzac Mates that this thing came from our beautiful land.
We had a mass shooting at Aramoana in November of 1990 with 13 shot dead by a mongrel. A cop, Sgt Stu Guthrie, was amongst the dead and Sgt Guthrie was ex RNZN as well. NZ has similar gun laws to Australia, but unfortunately, if you want a weapon no questions asked, have the cash - it's not what you know; it's who you know. Since the CoA has been mass deporting Kiwis back here, we've had an influx of new bikie gangs here.
As of about 9 pm Fri 15/3 NZDT the toll is 49 dead and 48 wounded. 41 were killed in the main mosque (Deans ave), 7 in the Linwood mosque (about 1 km from me) and 1 died from wounds in hospital. There were 2 IED in one vehicle, one terrorist has been charged with murder and will appear in Court Saturday morning, two others are being held by police and investigated at the moment and a fourth is being held and investigated with the police saying that they are indirectly involved. Also there was a big armed police raid on a property in Dunedin late this afternoon, but it is unknown whether or not that is related to the Christchurch massacre.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
And I’m quite sure there will be extensive help from OZ this time around to, more in the form of Investigators this time, there would be already extensive work going on over here into the Person or persons involved who come from Australia.
Security services and police in Australia will be doing a fine tooth comb search through any Aussie perps movements within Australia. According to NZ PM at this mornings press conference, main shooter DID NOT feature on any AU or NZ watch lists or radars prior to yesterday despite some members of local MSM banging on about NZ & AU security services failure to provide warnings this happening. These same journos who bang on about same spies impinging on peoples freedoms and rights and spying on innocent Kiwis all for the US. Now they aren't spying efficiently enough. Journo idjits.
Ok update: No increase in death toll, but women and children amongst the dead. 42 wounded with two people in critical care, one of whom is a 5 year old child. Said child has been transferred to Starship - specialist paediatric hospital in Auckland. Two people have been arrested overnight bring the total to three arrested. The fourth person that was taken into custody yesterday, was a member of the public with a firearm trying to help the police and they have been released, hopefully without charge. Events in Christchurch such as the third cricket test between NZ and Bangladesh and Bryan Adams concert have been cancelled. Also other events around NZ have been cancelled as well. Significant armed police presence at mosques around the country last night. Continued significant armed police presence continues in Christchurch today. Normally NZ police don't carry arms in public. Significant helicopter activity through the night near the scene of the Linwood mosque and that continues today and similar in the CBD near the Deans Ave mosque and now the Court House. The Court House building has been closed to the public for the duration of the shooters court appearance which is this morning due to security concerns. Christchurch residents advised to stay off the streets and indoors. The house that was raided in Dunedin yesterday was secured at 11-15pm last night because it is the current NZ residence of the shooter. NZ gun laws will be changed and most likely will follow the Australian law in that semi auto assault weapons will be outlawed.
City is still quite numb from shock. It hasn't sunk in yet and quite different from the earthquakes which are a natural event, whereas this is a crime of hate caused by a group of individuals. People have been dropping flowers off at the cordens near the two mosques all morning.
recce.k1
Well-Known Member
Well said and my concern now is this idiot will be the enabler for retaliatory attacks on the general NZ and Australian populations ... ironically it could potentially be worse in Australian cities as there is already a sizable amount of disgruntled Muslim youth living there plus they have issued more threats in the past and in some odd occasions have acted. But no doubt the Australian (and NZ) authorities will be well aware of this and have stepped up monitoring (and including monitoring "both sides" of the spectrum so to speak) and let's hope nothing comes to pass.
But outside of NZ/Australian control, this idiot/terrorist has also potentially put NZ'ers and Australians working and traveling overseas at greater risk, as well as potentially citizens of the US and UK etc - after all "we" are all seen as being "Western". Caught a bit of CNN just now and in Turkey there was some outrage shown. Considering the victims in Christchurch were originally from just about every Muslim country any anger won't be confined to just Turkey (and then there is the potential that radical elements or authoritarian Governments could inflame tensions to generate populist support).
Just when it seemed that things were settling down somewhat between the "West and Jihadis" (and the degradation of ISIS), this idiot/terrorist has now provided a platform for those seeking to justify conflict to escalate matters. Let's hope common sense prevails.
Those victims in Christchurch and the Muslim community in NZ are considered in the main to be "Kiwis". Currently NZ'ers are grieving and showing solidarity with the local Muslim communities.
Redlands18
Well-Known Member
Christchurch has already seen 1 major sporting event cancelled with the 3rd Cricket Test between NZ and Bangladesh called off. The Bangladeshi players were only minutes away from entering the Mosque when they heard the Gun Fire and retreated to Hagley Oval. We have already seen one International Cricket team attacked by Terrorists, the Sri Lankan Team in 2009, thankfully they escaped realitivley unharmed but Pakistan has not been able to host an International side since, having to play all there home games in the UAE.
Unfortunately there are to many people in this World who want to see an all out war between Islam and the West.
My wife (and sister in law and her former husband) are all ex-NZ Police. Talking with them and their old mates network it seems that NZ gun laws are not nearly as stringent as in Australia.
In Australia you can't register a pump or lever action shot gun or long arm or any semi-automatic rifle. All other weapons must be registered and held in safe storage by a licenced gun owner. Unregistered weapons were bought back post Port Arthur and destroyed. There have also een a couple of amnesty periods to clean up those "missed or forgotten" arms that might have been missed.
Now, that doesn't mean that there aren't black market weapons in Australia, nor that there aren't people with licences to own and use (for example) pistols for range shooting. The key though is the bolded bit. In NZ there is no requirement to register weapons. On the other hand NZ makes it harder to get licenced.
I may have details of this wrong. I have not fired any weapon since I last used an SLR or M-16 as a personal weapon. And my wife is no longer a Kiwi, much less a cop, but she still haunts their FB pages and keeps in touch with the state of things
oldsig
Cool & thanks, I stand corrected. My last personal weapons were the SLR, Sterling SMG and Browning 9 mm pistol. The last weapon that I fired was a Browning 50 cal HB HMG. I also used to have a privately owned No 4 Mk 1*. Personally I see no need for assault weapons in civilian hands, because they are not recreational hunting rifles, nor target rifles, nor should they be used by professional hunters. They only have one use and that is to kill people.
A cousin of mine was doing pest control for DOC in the Southern Alps, he used an AR-15 shooting out of a helicopter thar and other exotic animals.
There’s a place for these kinds of weapons but you really do have to have a legitimate reason for ownership, target shooting isn’t reason enough.
With tragic events like this, I think we need a different approach.
Much less media coverage.
The more the media is involved, the more emotional the public become.
Report it by all means, but the media are using these events to make money first and foremost.
I honestly believe that the death penalty needs to be re visited when there is 100% no doubt of guilt in these types of events. Conspire to carry out such an event should carry life imprisonment in a military prison.
Much less media coverage.
The more the media is involved, the more emotional the public become.
Report it by all means, but the media are using these events to make money first and foremost.
I honestly believe that the death penalty needs to be re visited when there is 100% no doubt of guilt in these types of events. Conspire to carry out such an event should carry life imprisonment in a military prison.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
Interesting about the restrictions on pump and lever action shotguns in Australia. Canadian bird hunters would absolutely fight that. Three shot semi automatic shotguns are also permitted. Handguns and assault rifles are highly restricted and few are eligible to have one. Of course, as I have previously mentioned, all the restrictions here are pretty much meaningless when you share a land border with the most prolific gun owning nation on earth along with lax controls.
Novascotiaboy
Active Member
John it’s not hard to get a restricted weapon including pistols legally in this country. Two separate days of training. Two separate written tests. Two waiting periods and you can purchase. It’s then a matter of storing your weapons correctly and firing them only on legal ranges. But you are very correct about illegal weapons that are prolific. With recent multi officer deaths at the hands of persons with military grade rifles in the past few years here in Atlantic Canada and in Alberta there is a heightened response to any incident by officers with M16 derivatives. Witnessed this recently in the community during arrests of two who were breaking into houses. Every officer was carrying a 5.56 mm carbine.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
Although we have had our share of 5.56 mm incidents, in the GTA, it is 9 mm semiautomatic handguns that are the biggest problem, easier to smuggle and carry covertly. In any event, controlling guns is difficult for all countries due to the high criminal demand. The people suppling these weapons to whack job terrorists deserve the same punishment as the guy who pulled the trigger.
They did here too. But PM Howard was newly elected and struck while the public would brook no crap from opportunist politicians. The new legislation was passed only about 10 days after the Port Arthur massacre. That is insanely fast; an amazing acheivement because it required matching enabling legislation in every state as well, some with governments which would normally have said NO!
John Howard's security detail made him wear body armour at a couple of noisy rallies, but except for some of the real nutters most shooters could see they were on the wrong side of history.
There have been some attempts to roll it back at state level, but nothing successful.
Ardern needs to legislate while everyone is still painfully aware of why it's happening.
oldsig
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
In Canada the federal government controls firearms and criminal law, the provinces only help enforce and have no legislative authority in this area that I am aware of. Certainly makes changes easier. Pretty amazing that all your states were on the same page as the federal government. As you say,changes right after a horrific event are quicker to implement.
I am still waiting to get my feelings and emotions in order over the shootings in CH Ch and I struggle to comprehend the thinking behind them. On friday we lost our innocence as a nation and that hurts like hell and has made me very angry that someone could come to NZ and try to enforce their views of hatred against Muslims and immigrants (He was a bloody immigrant himself) on us. I am very saddened by what has happened and angry.
I disagree with those who call for the death penalty as it would tarnish our society and does not achieve anything. For example in the US the states which have the death penalty have a murder rate average of around 4.5 per 100000 and the states which don't it is down to 3.5 per 100000 , in NZ it varies around 0.7 to a max of 1 on a year to year basis
While we have lost our innocence and will inevitably have to make changes to our internal security we must not change our overriding culture. We are one .
I disagree with those who call for the death penalty as it would tarnish our society and does not achieve anything. For example in the US the states which have the death penalty have a murder rate average of around 4.5 per 100000 and the states which don't it is down to 3.5 per 100000 , in NZ it varies around 0.7 to a max of 1 on a year to year basis
While we have lost our innocence and will inevitably have to make changes to our internal security we must not change our overriding culture. We are one .