Russian Navy Discussions and Updates

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SolarWind

Active Member
I am under the impression that they are still going to install Pantsir-M on the Kuznetsov, but forgo most other envisioned upgrades due to budget cuts and the need to get it out and battleready sooner.

Russia’s Aircraft Carrier to Enter 7-Month Trials Following Overhaul
Russia’s Sole Aircraft Carrier to Be Fitted With Advanced New Air Defense System

The carrier, however, is still slated to be equipped with an advanced new air defense system– the Pantsir-M/EM air defense system fitted with eight 57E6-E surface-to-air missile launchers (32 missiles in total) and two GSh-6-30K/AO-18KD 30 millimeter six-barrel rotary cannons.
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Does anyone have any info that they cancelled these plans?
 
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Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
SolarWind said:
I am under the impression that they are still going to install Pantsir-M on the Kuznetsov, but forgo most other envisioned upgrades due to budget cuts and the need to get it out and battleready sooner.

Russia’s Aircraft Carrier to Enter 7-Month Trials Following Overhaul
Russia’s Sole Aircraft Carrier to Be Fitted With Advanced New Air Defense System



Does anyone have any info that they cancelled these plans?
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Good question. The Pantsyr-ME would be a relatively simple upgrade compared to the other cancelled plans so it may be that they will still be installed, but I suspect not. A lot of the time, with the increase in secrecy these days, we won't know until it's done. For example, look at the Marshal Shaposhnikov upgrade program. How many UKSK is it getting? 8 cells? 16 cells? They removed the old tilted Rastrub launchers, and also removed the crane set up near the SAM at the rear. They're supposed to install Kh-35 launchers, but how many? Just 2 small 4-tube launchers in place of the giant Rastrub? Why did they remove the crane? 2 small Kh-35 launchers fit nicely in place of the removed crane rig, but then what would go in place of the Rastrub? More Kh-35s? A tilted launcher for Yakhot missiles? It's rather unclear.
 
S

Spacearrow99

Member
H I Sutton - Covert Shores

1 Sierra class and 2 Victor class subs are missing from the sub chart.

The 22350M and 20386 have mutiple units in service by 2030. The 20386 is a frigate in by modern naval accounts, but some ships of that size of called frigates. My main disappointment with 20386 is the 16 redut vl.
 
FORBIN

FORBIN

Member
Spacearrow99 said:
H I Sutton - Covert Shores

1 Sierra class and 2 Victor class subs are missing from the sub chart.

The 22350M and 20386 have mutiple units in service by 2030. The 20386 is a frigate in by modern naval accounts, but some ships of that size of called frigates. My main disappointment with 20386 is the 16 redut vl.
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Yet interesting and nice with all classes and yes 885M is less long http://www.hisutton.com/Pr885_Analysis.html

But some are not operationnals/active and exist 3 reserves categories in the 2nd and 3rd never the boat is back in service but not easy to know, Sierra 1 is not active as the 4th Borey SSBN Knyaz Vladimir only launched ! a big error
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Active :
1 or 2 Delta III, 6 Oscar II, 7 Akulas, 2 Sierra II, 1 or 2 Victor III, 1 Yasen, 1 Lada, 21 Kilo whose 6 new 06363

​
 
Sandhi Yudha

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
Feanor said:
Good question. The Pantsyr-ME would be a relatively simple upgrade compared to the other cancelled plans so it may be that they will still be installed, but I suspect not. A lot of the time, with the increase in secrecy these days, we won't know until it's done. For example, look at the Marshal Shaposhnikov upgrade program. How many UKSK is it getting? 8 cells? 16 cells? They removed the old tilted Rastrub launchers, and also removed the crane set up near the SAM at the rear. They're supposed to install Kh-35 launchers, but how many? Just 2 small 4-tube launchers in place of the giant Rastrub? Why did they remove the crane? 2 small Kh-35 launchers fit nicely in place of the removed crane rig, but then what would go in place of the Rastrub? More Kh-35s? A tilted launcher for Yakhot missiles? It's rather unclear.
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In februari this year the ship caught fire during welding process, how severe was it?
Russian Navy destroyer fire, Vladivostok, VIDEO
How much effect had it on the ship's upgrade and renovation program?
 
StevoJH

StevoJH

The Bunker Group
If that article is to believed it took up to 3.5 hours to put the fire out. I wouldn’t be surprised if the ship was CTL. The ship is 33 years old, in most Naval services that’s when they are looking to get rid of ships, not refit and modernise them.
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
StevoJH said:
If that article is to believed it took up to 3.5 hours to put the fire out. I wouldn’t be surprised if the ship was CTL. The ship is 33 years old, in most Naval services that’s when they are looking to get rid of ships, not refit and modernise them.
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Russia has no choice. Even their frigate production is in trouble. They certainly have no replacements for their destroyers at this time. To the best of our knowledge, work on the upgrade is continuing despite that fire.

Sandhi Yudha said:
In februari this year the ship caught fire during welding process, how severe was it?
Russian Navy destroyer fire, Vladivostok, VIDEO
How much effect had it on the ship's upgrade and renovation program?
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I couldn't say. Work appears to be continuing.
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Sandhi Yudha said:
Thats a very stealthy and smooth looking ship!
The engines/propulsion are Russian-made isn't it?
How about the sensors, similar to the Project 21630 Buyan Class?
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This very attractive vessel borders on being a waste of resources for the VMF. It's a patrol ship, whose only weapon is a gun turret and two HMGs. It can carry a container with a modular weapon load but it appears that it can only carry one long Kalibr container with 4 tubes. This vessel is weaker then the 21631, nevermind the 22800s with their Pantsyr-ME (from the 4th ship). It has good range, and can base a helo with a decent quantity of fuel, but other then anti-piracy missions, and coordinating humanitarian efforts, I really don't see the purpose of these ships. When the VMF is badly short on real warships, and funding is tight, the money would have been better spent on two more 20380 corvettes or one 22350 frigate, then on all 6 22160s.
 
FORBIN

FORBIN

Member
Sandhi Yudha said:
Thats a very stealthy and smooth looking ship!
The engines/propulsion are Russian-made isn't it?
How about the sensors, similar to the Project 21630 Buyan Class?
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Russian propulsion​

Feanor said:
This very attractive vessel borders on being a waste of resources for the VMF. It's a patrol ship, whose only weapon is a gun turret and two HMGs. It can carry a container with a modular weapon load but it appears that it can only carry one long Kalibr container with 4 tubes. This vessel is weaker then the 21631, nevermind the 22800s with their Pantsyr-ME (from the 4th ship). It has good range, and can base a helo with a decent quantity of fuel, but other then anti-piracy missions, and coordinating humanitarian efforts, I really don't see the purpose of these ships. When the VMF is badly short on real warships, and funding is tight, the money would have been better spent on two more 20380 corvettes or one 22350 frigate, then on all 6 22160s.
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Initialy also planned a SAM VLS but finaly don't have so an OPV
Shtil-1 VLS air defence system (proposed)
Project 22160-class patrol ship - Wikipedia

Ru Pr 22160.jpg
 
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Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
FORBIN said:
Russian propulsion​


Initialy also planned a SAM VLS but finaly don't have so an OPV
Shtil-1 VLS air defence system (proposed)
Project 22160-class patrol ship - Wikipedia

View attachment 46078
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With a SAM, with room for 8 Kalibr tubes like originally planned, and with proper anti-submarine warfare kit, this would simply have been another corvette. It would have become far more expensive, taken far longer to build, and simply duplicated the capabilities of something like a 22385. In its current state its a blue water patrol vessel. It makes little sense. It could be used for anti-piracy missions, humanitarian efforts, or even to carry a special forces team with landing boats and UAV support, but these are niche roles, and the VMF is badly short on modern warships of all types.
 
Sandhi Yudha

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
At last..... a second diesel-electric submarine of project 677 (Lada class), The Kronshtadt, was launched on 20 September in a special ceremony at the Admiralty Shipyards in St. Petersburg.


Second Lada class submarine launched in St. Petersburg
Military & Defense
September 20, 12:01UTC+3
Project 677 submarines of the Lada class belong with the fourth generation of diesel-electric subs


More:
Second Lada class submarine launched in St. Petersburg

Some more links:
https://navaltoday.com/2018/09/20/r...e-launched-13-years-after-construction-start/
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...sia-launches-second-lada_class-submarine.html


I wonder how much the second and third vessels have been changed compared to the first boat.
 
Feanor

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Given that they don't carry an anaerobic propulsion system, I have to wonder what exactly is the point of these vessels? Do they offer any significant advantages over the 636.3 that the Black Sea and Pacific Fleets are getting cheaply, and in large numbers?
 
Ranger25

Ranger25

Active Member
Staff member
Reports are surfacing of a dry dock accident for the Admiral Kuznetsov.

Sounds like the dock lots power to it’s ballast pumps and partially submerged causing a 70ton France to crash into the deck and a 5m gash in the hull.

More reports to follow for sure

Crane damages Russia's aircraft carrier
 
S

StobieWan

Super Moderator
Staff member
Ranger25 said:
Reports are surfacing of a dry dock accident for the Admiral Kuznetsov.

Sounds like the dock lots power to it’s ballast pumps and partially submerged causing a 70ton France to crash into the deck and a 5m gash in the hull.

More reports to follow for sure

Crane damages Russia's aircraft carrier
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Mixed reports on the damage, ranging from totally minor to a constructive loss - if her engineering spaces did take in a lot of water, it'd really depend on how far along they were with the refits - she'd already had her budget slashed earlier to seriously reduce the amount of work undertaken so this might be the end of the line for the old girl if say, some of the spaces that had the brand new gear were flooded.

The dry dock itself may be more of an issue than the carrier, as apparently there's nothing else in easy range.
 
D

DaveS124

Active Member
Update from the Russian news service TASS.

The Russian authorities are setting up a commission to investigate the sinking of the PD-50 floating dock in Northern Russia and to decide on whether it should be lifted from the seabed, Russia’s Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov said on Tuesday.

He said it was possible that the dock will be lifted from the seabed and repaired.

According to the senior Russian official, the incident will not affect the repairs of the Admiral Kuznetsov heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser, which are to be completed in 2021. "We will do our best not to delay the date," he said.
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Go to Special commission to decide on sunken floating dock’s future - Russian deputy premier
 
ngatimozart

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
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