Royal Australian Air Force [RAAF] News, Discussions and Updates

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Is the RAAF going the way of the Predator, or are we going to consider the Heron from Israel, which has some Australian content and could be part manufactured here?
Hasn’t been decided but we have people in the US learning how to operate and maintain Reaper systems, while we have just retired the Heron capability...

Make of that what you will.

Given who we operate alongside with in Coalition, I think it would be a real WTF? Decision if we were to chose anything other than Predator B / Reaper despite IAI’s best lobbying efforts...
 

hauritz

Well-Known Member
Hasn’t been decided but we have people in the US learning how to operate and maintain Reaper systems, while we have just retired the Heron capability...

Make of that what you will.

Given who we operate alongside with in Coalition, I think it would be a real WTF? Decision if we were to chose anything other than Predator B / Reaper despite IAI’s best lobbying efforts...
One of the things I find interesting about UAVs is that you actually don't really need that many of them.

The bulk of the training could be done virtually, so there wouldn't be any need to hold onto a large stock of training aircraft. The only requirement would be during live exercises and of roles such as surveillance and actual military operations. In the case of the Heron the RAAF only ever operated two of them so it is hard to imagine that they would ever a huge stock of these aircraft.

With new printable technology and relatively simple airframes it may be more economical to simply develop the ability to mass produce these aircraft as required, rather than hold onto a large stock of UAVs that might never even be taken out of their crates.
 

Joe Black

Active Member

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
The only missing piece I think is the JSM order in my mind.

RAAF would be one of the most potent airforces in SEA.
The air-launched anti-ship missile project is separate to this announcement, but I don’t think we will see it soon. JSF needs Block 4 software before it can integrate an ASM such as the Joint Strike Missile.

It will have JSOW Block C1 as an interim anti-ship capability sooner, I would think...

As to your comment, I agree...
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
DSCA FMS for GBU-53/B (SDBII)

Australia – GBU-53/B Small Diameter Bomb Increment II (SDB II) | The Official Home of the Defense Security Cooperation Agency

Interestingly the FMS speaks of the F-35A, and no mention of the Super Hornets, which as I understand can use as well ?

Cheers
It isn’t integrated onto Super Hornet yet though Raytheon says integration activities onto it are ‘underway’.

Could just be that RAAF doesn’t see a need to put this weapon onto that aircraft when it will equip JSF already? Afterall JASSM isn’t going onto Super Hornet either...
 
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hairyman

Active Member
We have 24 Super Hornets and 12 Growlers. It will be quite along time before we have anywhere near that number of JSF's.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
We have 24 Super Hornets and 12 Growlers. It will be quite along time before we have anywhere near that number of JSF's.
That isn’t quite true IMHO, they are much closer than you think. In less than 3 years from now we will have almost the same number of JSF in-service as we do Super Hornet and Growler combined.

The RAAF JSF delivery profile is:

2x JSF in 2014. (2)

8x JSF in 2018. (10)

8x JSF in 2019. (18)

15x JSF in 2020. (33)

15x JSF in 2021. (48)

15x JSF in 2022. (63)

9x JSF in 2023. (72)

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...ommittees/fadt_ctte/JointStikeFighter/c04.pdf
 

Stampede

Well-Known Member
That isn’t quite true IMHO, they are much closer than you think. In less than 3 years from now we will have almost the same number of JSF in-service as we do Super Hornet and Growler combined.

The RAAF JSF delivery profile is:

2x JSF in 2014. (2)

8x JSF in 2018. (10)

8x JSF in 2019. (18)

15x JSF in 2020. (33)

15x JSF in 2021. (48)

15x JSF in 2022. (63)

9x JSF in 2023. (72)

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...ommittees/fadt_ctte/JointStikeFighter/c04.pdf


Yes, it's really starting to happen.
To think that only next year we will have this aircraft on / over Australian soil.
Very exciting

Regards S
 

Hazdog

Member
That isn’t quite true IMHO, they are much closer than you think. In less than 3 years from now we will have almost the same number of JSF in-service as we do Super Hornet and Growler combined.

The RAAF JSF delivery profile is:

2x JSF in 2014. (2)

8x JSF in 2018. (10)

8x JSF in 2019. (18)

15x JSF in 2020. (33)

15x JSF in 2021. (48)

15x JSF in 2022. (63)

9x JSF in 2023. (72)

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...ommittees/fadt_ctte/JointStikeFighter/c04.pdf
Is there any possibility that the option for 28 more F-35's will be taken up?

If so whether or not they are A's or B's is a debate for another date...
 

John Newman

The Bunker Group
Is there any possibility that the option for 28 more F-35's will be taken up?

If so whether or not they are A's or B's is a debate for another date...
If you spend some time reading the 2016 DWP and the DIIP, you will see that a decision on the final batch won't happen until around the mid 2020's.

Just have to be patient until then.
 

John Newman

The Bunker Group
That isn’t quite true IMHO, they are much closer than you think. In less than 3 years from now we will have almost the same number of JSF in-service as we do Super Hornet and Growler combined.

The RAAF JSF delivery profile is:

2x JSF in 2014. (2)

8x JSF in 2018. (10)

8x JSF in 2019. (18)

15x JSF in 2020. (33)

15x JSF in 2021. (48)

15x JSF in 2022. (63)

9x JSF in 2023. (72)

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary...ommittees/fadt_ctte/JointStikeFighter/c04.pdf
I read a little while ago that there is a possibility that the first of the next eight airframes (from LRIP 10 due during 2018) might actually be delivered from the LM production line late this year, a few months earlier than originally planned.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
I read a little while ago that there is a possibility that the first of the next eight airframes (from LRIP 10 due during 2018) might actually be delivered from the LM production line late this year, a few months earlier than originally planned.
Time will tell, but the sooner the better, IMHO.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
The air-launched anti-ship missile project is separate to this announcement, but I don’t think we will see it soon. JSF needs Block 4 software before it can integrate an ASM such as the Joint Strike Missile.

It will have JSOW Block C1 as an interim anti-ship capability sooner, I would think...

As to your comment, I agree...
Just going back over this, AGM-154 JSOW-C1 is on the scheduled Block 3F weapons list (as is the ‘standard’ AGM-154 JSOW-C).

So much for proponents of the argument that F-35 at Block 3F doesn’t have it’s ‘full’ weapons capability.

At introduction to service it has US made Paveway II/III and Enhanced Paveway II/III (GBU-49/51) and JDAM with 500lbs,1000lbs and 2000lbs bomb bodies, plus BLU-109 penetrating warhead variants, SDB1 and JSOW-C/C1.

These capabilities cover a full range of strike capabilities, including moving and hardened targets, stand off precision strike with SDB1 and JSOW-C as well as an anti-shipping capability through JSOW-C1. On top of this it has full air to air capability with AIM-9X Block I/II, AIM-120C5/7 and AIM-120D and the gun internal on F-35A and in the pod on B/C.

Then the aircraft has the British weapons available as well - AIM-132 ASRAAM and the Paveway IV 500lbs weapon.

Has there been an aircraft with this wide a choice of weaponry available at their absolute entry to service before? Many fighter aircraft in the world don’t have this wide array of weapons as in-service aircraft...
 

StingrayOZ

Super Moderator
Staff member
Has there been an aircraft with this wide a choice of weaponry available at their absolute entry to service before? Many fighter aircraft in the world don’t have this wide array of weapons as in-service aircraft...
I don't think so. Being *the* western multirole fighter, it will only get better.
 

pussertas

Active Member
Confidential F-35, P-8, C-130 Data Stolen in Australian Defence Contractor Hack

(Source: ZD Net; posted Oct 11

In November 2016, the Australian Signals Directorate (ASD) was alerted by a "partner organization" that an attacker had gained access to the network of a 50-person aerospace engineering firm that subcontracts to the Department of Defense.

Restricted technical information on the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft, the C-130 transport aircraft, the Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) smart bomb kit, and "a few Australian naval vessels" was among the sensitive data stolen from a small Australian defense contractor in 2016.

The secret information was restricted under the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR), the US system designed to control the export of defense- and military-related technologies, according to Mitchell Clarke, an incident response manager at the ASD who worked on the case.

One document was a wireframe diagram of "one of the navy's new ships". A viewer could "zoom in down to the captain's chair and see that it's, you know, 1 meter away from nav chair", Clarke said.

The data theft was first reported on Tuesday as part of the 2017 Threat Report from the Australian Cyber Security Centro (ACSC). Little information was given at the time. The victim was described as a "small Australian company with contracting links to national security projects". The attacker had "sustained access to the network for an extended period of time" and had stolen a "significant amount of data".

Clarke provided significantly more detail in his presentation to the national conference of the Australian Information Security Association (AISA) in Sydney on Wednesday.
 

t68

Well-Known Member
(Source: ZD Net; posted Oct 11

In November 2016, the Australian Signals Directorate (ASD) was alerted by a "partner organization" that an attacker had gained access to the network of a 50-person aerospace engineering firm that subcontracts to the Department of Defense.

Restricted technical information on the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft, the C-130 transport aircraft, the Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) smart bomb kit, and "a few Australian naval vessels" was among the sensitive data stolen from a small Australian defense contractor in 2016.

The secret information was restricted under the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR), the US system designed to control the export of defense- and military-related technologies, according to Mitchell Clarke, an incident response manager at the ASD who worked on the case.

One document was a wireframe diagram of "one of the navy's new ships". A viewer could "zoom in down to the captain's chair and see that it's, you know, 1 meter away from nav chair", Clarke said.

The data theft was first reported on Tuesday as part of the 2017 Threat Report from the Australian Cyber Security Centro (ACSC). Little information was given at the time. The victim was described as a "small Australian company with contracting links to national security projects". The attacker had "sustained access to the network for an extended period of time" and had stolen a "significant amount of data".

Clarke provided significantly more detail in his presentation to the national conference of the Australian Information Security Association (AISA) in Sydney on Wednesday.
Don't you just wish these sort of things should have no access to the Internet ( seperate controlled system which cannot connect to the net)
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Don't you just wish these sort of things should have no access to the Internet ( seperate controlled system which cannot connect to the net)
Not really, because it would make real world business very difficult. Imagine trying to deal with Defence without even being able to email them?

What I wish is that the Department of Defence, ACSC and ASD would get on the front front with cyber security for a change and actually get out of their offices and help these companies fix these vulnerabilities.

Unfortunately despite the Government’s so-called concern about these issues, our lead agencies take a very reactive approach to these sorts of incidents, as we have seen with this one.

My view is that any company that is contracted or sub-contracted to Defence in any capacity should be thoroughly vetted from a Cyber Security POV, by ASD / CERT Australia or AusCERT to meet minimum Defence defined standards for contracting and these security audits should remain on-going during the life of any of that company’s dealings with defence.

Having access to this companies website, internal / FTP servers, mail servers etc and the IT portal’s administrator panel secured by the word: ‘admin’ will be found through any reasonable penetration testing audit.

It is obvious that despite high level Government attention on Cyber security the real world day to day level of cyber security remains as it always has been - very, very ordinary.
 

pussertas

Active Member
Re: Confidential F-35, P-8, C-130 Data Stolen in Australian Defence Contractor Hack

Don't you just wish these sort of things should have no access to the Internet ( separate controlled system which cannot connect to the net)
Agreed. Have always hoped that contact between the French providers of the Barracuda IA submarine would be by a DVD disk delivered between the two sites by long term CPO's.
 
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