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Terran

Terran

Well-Known Member
I got corrected on the Halon system. I had heard of it but it’s isolated to important areas like the armory and engine room. A second system is used in the hold. An aqueous foam system which was also under repair. The bay where it started had apparently been used as a garbage dumpster. Boxes, Drywall and rags. The compartments were left open which makes them basically billows.
 
ASSAIL

ASSAIL

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Terran said:
I got corrected on the Halon system. I had heard of it but it’s isolated to important areas like the armory and engine room. A second system is used in the hold. An aqueous foam system which was also under repair. The bay where it started had apparently been used as a garbage dumpster. Boxes, Drywall and rags. The compartments were left open which makes them basically billows.
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Just waiting for a cigarette butt to be chucked in on a cocktail of inflammable compounds.
I imagine any breeze thru the stern door would act like furnace bellows as you suggest.
 
J

JohnJT

Active Member
ngatimozart said:
If you look at the last photo, just forward and portside of the island there are two holes burnt through the flight deck - 1 medium and 1 small. Go forward along the flight deck and the third hole that has burnt through is quite large, almost the width of the flight deck. You can't miss them because they very prominent.
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Those holes are in the superstructure. I've marked the width of the superstructure in the attached pic for clarity. (pic credit USNI).BHR.jpg

The area of the ship we're looking at is here (note the two vertical antennas in both pics):
150326-N-MD297-002.jpg
 
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Terran

Terran

Well-Known Member
ASSAIL said:
Just waiting for a cigarette butt to be chucked in on a cocktail of inflammable compounds.
I imagine any breeze thru the stern door would act like furnace bellows as you suggest.
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Wouldn’t even need that Rags have a bad habit of combusting on there own.
 
ngatimozart

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
ngatimozart

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Day 4 update on Bonhomme Richard fires.

news.usni.org

On Day 4, Fire Crews on USS Bonhomme Richard Battle Hot Spots and Flare Ups - USNI News

SAN DIEGO, Calif. – More than 300 sailors and firefighters continued to battle hot spots as part of the ongoing efforts to extinguish fires and flareups inside the skin of amphibious assault ship USS Bonhomme Richard (LHD-6), as efforts enter the fourth day, Navy officials said. Throughout the...
news.usni.org news.usni.org
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
Flexson said:
I can only see holes clear through the top of the Super Structure (that might just be my bad eyesight) not the Flight Deck. Is it possible, like quite a few warships out there, she has an Aluminium Super Structure?
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According to this article, yes the superstructure is aluminum which surprised me. I thought aluminum on major combat vessels was out of favour due to HMS Sheffield‘s loss in 1982 during the Falklands conflict.
www.nationalreview.com

Burning USS Bonhomme Richard Signals More Trouble for Navy | National Review

The latest incident in a long line of recent trouble suggests continued internal weakness.
www.nationalreview.com www.nationalreview.com
 
Terran

Terran

Well-Known Member
Mixed materials are common these days. Particularly when you want to keep the center of mass low. Speaking inch which last report I read the BHR has taken on a bad list. The crew are working on trying to right her but firefighters are off. I haven’t heard anything new on the fires I hope that issue is solved.
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
Yama said:
Sheffield was steel. Amazons had aluminium superstructures...
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Correct, my bad. Worse, I now vaguely recall reading about Sheffield not having an aluminum superstructure like Ardent and Amazon. Still, it is interesting that BHR has an aluminum superstructure.
 
oldsig127

oldsig127

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
John Fedup said:
According to this article, yes the superstructure is aluminum which surprised me. I thought aluminum on major combat vessels was out of favour due to HMS Sheffield‘s loss in 1982 during the Falklands conflict.
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That would surprise me too. Sheffield's superstructure was steel. The transcripts of several inquires including unredacted Naval BoI are available online. If I can find a copy or current links on one of my external disk archives I'll post it sometime, but the physical causes were many including inappropriate materials used to insulate data cables which generated high volumes of toxic smoke and burnd wonderfully well, habitability improvements to messing which were fire prone, and mandated operation of the fire pumpsystem in a manner appropriate to *internal* risks not *external* risks which led to it being made entirely inoperable with the initial hit.

I wouldn't bet on it, but I think a good search of the literature will find that the whole aluminium superstructure thing is at least in part an urban myth. Antelope and Ardent *did* have aluminium superstructures which were not involved in their loss.

oldsig

(Edit: Ooops, wrote this hours ago and didn't hit post. NOW the bloody thing is a zombie post)
 
spoz

spoz

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
Oldsig is right - aluminium had nothing to do with the loss of Sheffield. Belknap got trashed by Kennedy and there was a fire but the aluminium itself didn’t burn although it was weakened sufficiently for the superstructure to collapse. Sure, aluminium plate will become plastic and then melt at a lower temperature than steel, but in a fire at one atmosphere pressure of air it won’t burn (almost anything will burn in a pure O2 environment, as witnessed by Apollo 1).
 
T

Tomte47

New Member
The whole aluminium burns thing is mostly untrue, aluminium powder or very thin foil can burn but so can iron powder..

Solid aluminium does not burn but it ofcourse melts at a lower temp then steel which is what you see happening to the ships with aluminium superstructures.
 
John Fedup

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
This article discusses the implications resulting from the BHR fire. WRT to the consequence of this ship being out of action for years or more likely lost, maybe an offer to lease a QE carrier from the UK for a few years is a consideration. The UK could get some revenue towards eventually equipping their carrier with F-35Bs and the USN gets a temporary replacement along with the opportunity to evaluate a 65-70k ton carrier.

warontherocks.com

More Than Just a Fire: The Implications of the Bonhomme Richard Catastrophe - War on the Rocks

As I write this, the USS Bonhomme Richard — a Wasp-class amphibious assault ship — burns at Pier 2, Naval Station San Diego. Scores of Navy and civilian
warontherocks.com
 
Todjaeger

Todjaeger

Potstirrer
Ranger25 said:
I’m sure we’ve all seen but fires officially out. Now the long assessment will begin on whether she can be saved or stricken from the rolls like the USS Miami. Either way will be a long time until this capability is replaced.
The USN and USMC have already been lobbying for increased ARG capabilities, this obviously is a step Backward.

USS Bonhomme Richard Fire Extinguished; CO Thanks Crew for 'Strength and Resilience' - USNI News
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CNO it seems did a walk through of USS Bonhomme Richard yesterday to see some of the damage while an investigation is initiated to determine the cause and see if changes to designs and/or policies and procedures are needed to prevent something like this from happening again. Also it seems that a damage inspection and survey will be done to determine the extent of the damage, estimate the costs and effort to effect repairs, and then make a determination on repairing or replacing the vessel.

Link to San Diego Tribune article here. Unfort cannot find a direct link to the AP story about it that I initially read, best is US Yahoo.
 
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