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UK Defence Force General discussion

Discussion in 'Geostrategic Issues' started by t68, Jan 10, 2019.

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  1. StobieWan

    StobieWan Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I can think of at least two Conservative defence reviews in the past which were far reaching with global impacts.

    One under Duncan Sandy's and one under John Nott.

    If anyone is under the impression that the Conservative party have defence nailed as a policy I'd just blow a rude raspberry ..

    Neither party has covered themselves in glory over the decades I fear.
     
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  2. DouglasLees

    DouglasLees New Member

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    On that happy note, I can’t remember the last time the Conservative Party actually conserved anything. ...

    In the context of the Armed Forces, under their watch the policies of deconstruction have been pursued with greater vigour and intensity than under New Labour (remember that lot?).
     
  3. ngatimozart

    ngatimozart Super Moderator Staff Member Verified Defense Pro

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    I think this about covers it.

     
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  4. DouglasLees

    DouglasLees New Member

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    Marvellous. I remember it well! It seems a more innocent age, before identity politics and the excesses of social media.
     
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  5. John Fedup

    John Fedup Well-Known Member

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  6. DouglasLees

    DouglasLees New Member

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    That’s very good news John. Thanks. I wish the scheme well and I hope it is open to apprentices who are not academic in the narrow sense - for it is they whose abilities we need but who have been most neglected by what we might call the ‘educational-industrial complex’!
     
  7. Tabby Cat

    Tabby Cat New Member

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    Mod edit: Member banned and content deleted following account creation to circumvent a prior Permanent Ban.
    -Preceptor
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 13, 2020
  8. ngatimozart

    ngatimozart Super Moderator Staff Member Verified Defense Pro

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    G'day @Tabby Cat Welcome to the forum. I am struggling to see what, if anything, your post has to do with Russian strategic weapons, apart from being a possible target, and that is not the purpose of this thread. That's why I have moved it to the appropriate thread. I am further finding it difficult to ascertain any link between the current situation of their HRH the Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Russian strategic weapons. Even the highly versatile Edmund Blackadder would be flummoxed there. We don't take kindly to social gossip here, especially when it is related to a veteran who did 2 tours in Afghanistan, and went on to found, and is still very actively involved, in the Invictus Games for wounded and disable veterans.

    I would argue that nations that are allied and / or friendly with the US should have always been prepared to be able to defend themselves with out US support. Not to do so is strategic blundering of a high order because history has shown us that sometimes our allies are not always in a position to materially aid us. Australia and NZ learned that in 1941. It also appears that the US may be entering a period of isolationism with Trump attempting to find ways of reducing US defence comments overseas, and I read in the weekend that Democrat contender Bernie Sanders would, if he won the White House, reduce the US defence commitments overseas. Now Sanders has to win the democrat primaries first, but 2016 showed that stranger things have happened.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 13, 2020
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  9. StobieWan

    StobieWan Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm struggling to think of a recent war of choice in which the UK has fought alongside the US, which wasn't in itself precipitated by a US call to arms.

    Can't think of one. The UK on the other hand has fought a couple of useful actions independently of the US in the last thirty years, Sierra Leone I think standing as a good example of what a useful mix of inventive interpretation of orders, creative use of local forces and a will to win can bring to the table.

    One thing I'd like to tackle in passing is the apparent belief that Brexit will produce a more outward looking view - Brexit is largely an inwardly nationalistic movement and it's likely why so much foreign money was poured into advertising campaigns targeting some key voters and trying to persuade them that Brexit was a good idea and a no deal Brexit was perfectly acceptable - simply put, Brexit would likely weaken the UK' s position on the world stage.

    The future ? We're still a key member of various treaty organisations, still a permanent security council member and still have global presence. Russia is a European problem to solve and you can see that is appreciated quite clearly by the sudden increase in key purchases by various countries in NATO (Turkey's spare slots for F35 didn't sit around for long!)

    We'll have to wait and see what this all brings.
     
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  10. swerve

    swerve Super Moderator

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    Exactly. With US & Indian officials & politicians drooling over the improved terms (for their countries) they expect to get, we can see what trade deal negotiations should be like.
     
  11. ASSAIL

    ASSAIL Defense Professional Verified Defense Pro

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    Brexit will result in Britain having a more outward view, trade circumstance will demand it.
    For too long she has been totally embroiled in EU politics, regulatory and economic matters, this has been the pragmatic approach caused by EU membership.
    Since Britain abandoned the Commonwealth to side with the EU Commonwealth countries have readjusted. Yes the adjustment was very painful for a number of years but it opened doors to the rest of the world and I have no doubt that Aus and NZ for instance, ultimately were better off for the split just as the UK will be on leaving Europe.
    This doesn’t mean there won’t be new and existing trade opportunities with the EU just that a UK Trade Dept must negotiate new terms free of the regulatory constraints of the past.
    Britain has asked for help from the Australian Department of Trade (DFAT - Foreign Affairs and Trade) to provide help with negotiating FTAs with non EU others. DFAT has successfully negotiated FTAs with Japan, ROK, China, the Trans Pacific Partnership and others and currently completing deals with India and Indonesia so it has a wealth of recent experience.
    As Britain’s own experience matures Trade deals with numerous non euro partners will flourish and her political partnership with such countries will grow because of it. Just as the Commonwealth thrived and survived once we were discarded, so will the UK.

    Non of this presumes that Britain has totally ignored others because of the EU, simply that a change of emphasis will result from the realpolitik.
     
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  12. t68

    t68 Well-Known Member

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    Isn’t that counter productive since AU/UK are about to have there own meetings in regards to a FTA
     
  13. ngatimozart

    ngatimozart Super Moderator Staff Member Verified Defense Pro

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    The UK has also obtained help from the NZ MFAT for negotiating trade deals as well, so you could be facing Kiwi negotiators across the negotiating table.
     
  14. Ranger25

    Ranger25 Active Member

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    The Faulklands ring a bell?
     
  15. Todjaeger

    Todjaeger Potstirrer

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    I would not really consider the Falklands War a "war of choice", unless one feels that the UK responding with military and naval force to the invasion of several British Overseas Territories constitutes a "war of choice."
     
  16. ngatimozart

    ngatimozart Super Moderator Staff Member Verified Defense Pro

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    Yep, I can think of one or three:
    1. The ill fated Suez War of 1956 after Nasser of Egypt nationalised the Suez Canal. Britain and France did a sneaky deal with Israel about attacking Egypt in the Sinai so that Britain and France could mask their intentions of invading the canal zone as protection of the waterway during hostilities, when in fact it was a hostile takeover of assets.
    2. The Malayan conflict.
    3. The Borneo Confrontation, or as the Indonesians call it, Konfrontasi.
    The Falklands War was legitimate defence against foreign invasion of sovereign territory.
    Ah but wasn't the UK joining the EU the continuation of a 500 year plan? Must be a change in the plan. :D

    Well apparently the Defence Secretary is having sleepless nights: What keeps Britain’s defense secretary up at night? due to his concerns that the US may be withdrawing from leadership of western defence. As the article rightly supposes, funding will be a substantial issue, especially after the cuts from the various SDRS. As me mum in law says - all mouth and trousers.