Indonesian Aero News

Ananda

The Bunker Group
Base on what I know during my previous Bank financing local shipyard defense project (patrol boats), if it is domestic suppliers then the contract will be in IDR. Thus it's classified as domestic financing.

For example the yards build 44M KAL Patrol Boats, usually the contract in IDR stated for the patrol boats to fully completed FFBNW. Thus all foreign components like machinery and basic sensors must be calculated on the IDR Contract. However for weapons and additional sensors, it's done in separate contract with foreign suppliers. Thus it will be under USD and classified as Foreign Financing.

So it's possible for Army the amount of Domestic financing will be larger compared to other services. If significant portion of small/medium caliber ammo and land equipment contracted through Pindad and other local suppliers, then they will fall under IDR Domestic Financing.

So it could be the USD 4.4 bio related to rotary wings procurement (as Army wants to enlarge their Air Mobile capabilities). Whether it's S-70 or MV-22 will remain to be seen. It can be also on point defence Missiles, or more 155mm mobile guns. There's talk the army want to phasing out some of their old 105mm field gun.
 

Ahmad

Active Member
Thank you for sharing.
So $8,4 Milyar goes to TNI-AU, divided in
- 0,3 training aircraft (fixed and rotary wing)
Does this include the budget for the last 3 KT-1B and the upgrade of the T-50i?
- 0,9 armament
This will hopefully not all be spend on dumb freefall bombs.
- 2,1 radars and airdefence missiles
More NASAMS-batteries?
- 0,3 UAVs
More CH-4Bs?
- 0,2 helicopters
Just 200 million, probably additional numbers of a type already in use, EC725?
- 1,5 Transport aircrafts
Hopefully enough for 5 C-130Js
- 1,5 Special Mission Aircrafts.
I thought AEW and MPA were not on the priority list.
- 1,6 Fighters
If the $1,2 for the Su-35 is not added to this 1,6, will this be enough for a full squadron of F-16Vs?

How about the A330 MRTT, or do they mean inflight refueling tankers with "special mission aircrafts"?
I doubt they are going to buy dumb free fall bomb from foreign source since both state owned Pindad and private owned Sari Bahari have already been able to make them.

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Pindad

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Ahmad permanently banned for not providing links in posts. He was warned here on 20/3/2021 by OPSSG.
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
From Budget point of view, F-16V still the 'fitting' choice, and this consultant (which seems have inside information from MinDef) shown LM have strong 'lobby'. So potential for F-16 still there based on Budget availability and 'Lobby' power. After all LM and Airbus due have long relationship with Indonesian Defense circle.

Google algorithm just shown me the article on Tempo Online regarding LM still doing their Lobby for F-16V/ F-16 Blk 72. Just as I put before, never underestimate LM Lobby connection on Indonesian Military establishment.

I suspect they see their chances back looking on the packages the competitors Airbus, Dasault and Boeing offering. Perhaps they are now pushing on affordability factor. This is getting interesting, Dasault also increase the tempo of their Lobby. Interesting that latest Boeing or Airbus ones seems not feasible on Media or online sources yet.

There're push from Parliement for MinDef to conclude the choices soon. Could the end of TNI-AU fighter procurement drama already entering final stages ?
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
Dont worry, maybe we can watch this drama until 2024. In that year a contract will be signed, which will be a triumph for the current administration and the political party behind it.....to be later cancelled again, blaming Covid-19 or something else.
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
Well, SBY's got 24 refurbished F-16 with 6 spares for USD 750 Mio. Thus in theory we can get 48 refurbished F-16 plus 12 spares for that USD 1.6 bio budget. That'll broke many fanboys dream and create Political havoc. It will also be fun too watch.

It's not bad though, If that 48 refurbished F-16 plus 32 refurbished existing ones can be network connected. Add with integrated ground sensors plus AEW and C4ISR, and more importantly you can get all of that before 2024. Thus can be part of Political Image building for next election.

The fanboys will scream to Underworld gate. Some Parliament members will talk trash for years to come. At least it's something better then waiting this drama unfold (if they don't make any decisions soon).
 

Arji

New Member
personally, I don't care whether it's Rafale, F-16, or F-15. So long as we have a decent AEW system. We desperately need that infrastructure already, and with it, we might not be able to cover all of our airspace, but we at least will not be disadvantaged in a local air superiority fight.
 

ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Well, SBY's got 24 refurbished F-16 with 6 spares for USD 750 Mio. Thus in theory we can get 48 refurbished F-16 plus 12 spares for that USD 1.6 bio budget. That'll broke many fanboys dream and create Political havoc. It will also be fun too watch.

It's not bad though, If that 48 refurbished F-16 plus 32 refurbished existing ones can be network connected. Add with integrated ground sensors plus AEW and C4ISR, and more importantly you can get all of that before 2024. Thus can be part of Political Image building for next election.

The fanboys will scream to Underworld gate. Some Parliament members will talk trash for years to come. At least it's something better then waiting this drama unfold (if they don't make any decisions soon).
If TNI-AU can get ~80 F-16V (equivalent) aircraft in-service mated to a networked IADS comprising ground and aerial radars systems (AEW&C / AWACS) then it’s air defence capability will have grown exponentially compared to the penny-packet aircraft acquisition style of years gone past...

Who cares who screams what? You’ll actually have a definite, broad and overlapping capability for a change...
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
The Indonesian aerospace industry will not develop much with just refurbishment/modernisation of old F-16s.

So besides a good functioning and integrated air defence, a country will have to add some more value for their money. More ToT, licence production or component manufacturing and assembly.

And of course like Ananda already said, a brandnew aircraft type brings more prestige and glory for politicians than just some more of the same.

Edit:
Just want to add this:

So while the aircraft is Senegal’s third CN-235, it is the first CN235-220MPA version.
 
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Ananda

The Bunker Group
Add what Sandhi wrote, network of F-16 interact with ground and aerial Sensors is part what LM offer to build. However Indonesia Political circles being what they are, consist of Nexus of interest. So, I'm afraid they care whose going to scream if it can bring Public outcry and Political hurdles (especially it can ruin someone chances) for 2024 election.

Take Su-35 as example, regardless the AF official position to support the procurement. However if we see between the line the AF is not that enthusiasts for another Russian fighters. This can be read on some of the brass 'complaining' on how expensive the operational and maintenance that need to be done outside Indonesia. However the trade deals with Russia for Su-35 gain many support in Parliament, since it open distribution of trade 'deals' between Political parties supporters.

F-16 on the other hand always in the mind of TNI-AU. They're fighting hard to get existing F-16 being refurbished and they're trying to get the refurbishing jobs done domestically to improve their support infrastructure.
When Su-35 can't be pursue further due to Geopolitical consideration, I don't see much disappointment from Air Force side.

Prabowo's now looking for alternative of F-16, and personally considering the budget being set asside for fighters program (post #1,917), I have doubt they can afford other than F-16V and/or some refurbished F-16 airframe. Unless they (MinDef) want to relocate budget that being prepared for other assets.

In such if we see the budget allocation plan they (TNI-AU) prepared (on picture in that post), they know how important to build networking environment. The question now, whether their choice can pass Political hurdle (which will come as some parties potentially see that their champion projects being sidelines). Like I said each Political circles already have some lobbyist around them like vultures looking on potential "projects".

Small number package procurement means more projects. Uniformality and integration of Defense assets means less projects. Indonesian Political circles like high numbers of smaller package projects, then less number of bigger projects. Personally I'm just want to see if current MinDef and the Administration can fight the pressure in order to change that.

In paper they have capabilities to do that considering their 'coalition' Control the Parliament. However can they become good sheepard to control those ferocious appetites (especially now everyone jockey position for 2024).

Sorry not want to talk much on Politics, however how to handle Politics in Indonesia determine how TNI can be developed further. Sometimes I miss Soekarno and Soeharto.
 
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ADMk2

Just a bloke
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
The Indonesian aerospace industry will not develop much with just refurbishment/modernisation of old F-16s.

So besides a good functioning and integrated air defence, a country will have to add some more value for their money. More ToT, licence production or component manufacturing and assembly.

And of course like Ananda already said, a brandnew aircraft type brings more prestige and glory for politicians than just some more of the same.
Were I in charge, I’d like a solid, reliable networked IADS with a capable fighter (F-16V) to provide the backbone of the air defence system. Then you could add the political favourites etc, for niche roles - SU-27/30 with Brahmos for maritime strike, Rafale for stand off strike (Scalp NG etc) or whatever floats your boat...

Meanwhile you have a competent, solid backbone providing the ‘meat’ of your defence capability on a day to day basis...
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
Two C-130 Hercules transport aircrafts from Skadron Udara 32 Lanud Abdulrachman Saleh Malang are sent to NTT.



And here we can see a recent photo of the Elang Hitam UAV. A part of the body and wings are painted black, but the real Elang Hitam is actually completely black.
 

Attachments

Ananda

The Bunker Group
This MALE UAV Elang Hitam (Black Eagle) time line put it at 2025 to get full UCAV and ISTAR capabilities. I wonder whose going to be their tech partners/suppliers for off the shelf tech. Could it be Turkish/TAI or multiple sources ?

To gain independent, ideally the MALE consortium should get from multiple tech Partners. It will cost more, but they can have better learning curve on system integration.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
FB_IMG_1617860035402.jpgFB_IMG_1617860028784.jpg

From Kris FB page. This shown they are also preparing the mobile support infrastructure for this MALE UAV. Looking at size and dimensions, seems they have prepared for C-130 transportation fitting.
FB_IMG_1617860009647.jpg
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
View attachment 48153View attachment 48154

From Kris FB page. This shown they are also preparing the mobile support infrastructure for this MALE UAV. Looking at size and dimensions, seems they have prepared for C-130 transportation fitting.
View attachment 48155
Makes sense. It will be very unpractical if it doesnt fit into the largest transport aeroplane of TNI-AU.

I just wonder how many flying prototypes are built at the moment. Until now we have seen a black-white one and one with a brownish camouflage pattern, but it is also unclear if both are flying prototypes or just a fake/mock-up one.


Btw i still try to identify these recently delivered missiles.

It looks like a mixture of the ATMACA, UMTAS and RGM-84. But looking to the shape and size, i think its the Roketsan UMTAS. Im just surprised to see these missiles in Indonesian hands.
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
Turkish missiles? What's that for? Black Eagle UAV?
I have no idea.
I never heard of Indonesia buying Turkish ASMs for UCAVs.
I dont think its for tge Elang Hitam, at this stage they are still working on the normal UAV-version, so it is unlikely that they already bought some missiles for the UCAV-version.

The only UCAV TNI-AU has are the CH-4Bs, these are also no chinese AR-1 missiles.
 

Arji

New Member
Ma

Makes sense. It will be very unpractical if it doesnt fit into the largest transport aeroplane of TNI-AU.

I just wonder how many flying prototypes are built at the moment. Until now we have seen a black-white one and one with a brownish camouflage pattern, but it is also unclear if both are flying prototypes or just a fake/mock-up one.


Btw i still try to identify these recently delivered missiles.

It looks like a mixture of the ATMACA, UMTAS and RGM-84. But looking to the shape and size, i think its the Roketsan UMTAS. Im just surprised to see these missiles in Indonesian hands.
What was the name of the company on the guy's shirt? Might be clue to where the missile supposed to go...
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
What was the name of the company on the guy's shirt? Might be clue to where the missile supposed to go...
Sorry, i tried to search for it, but i didn't succeed.



9 APRIL 2021
Today it is the day that TNI-AU becomes 75 years old....
SWA BHUWANA PAKSA!

Edit
I planned to post here an overview of birthday celebration messages from all the squadrons, but sadly that useless Facebook doesnt cooperate.

So because of that, Ill post here just one message.
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
What was the name of the company on the guy's shirt? Might be clue to where the missile supposed to go...
I think, I’ve found the missile. It is the chinese AR-2!

Probably for the CH-4B UCAVs.
 
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