The Russian-Ukrainian War Thread

[KipPotapych]

^ Fair. I don’t see how it would change anything though.

Example one. Many (perhaps most?) here think I post Russian propaganda; some may be thinking (was so suggested or implied previously, more than once) I am on the Russian payroll even (tell me where to collect). If I post some evidence tying me to Canada, would that change anyone’s mind? Probably not. See Tulsi’s garbage I talked about the other day, born and raised ‘Mercian.

Example two. I know someone who used to fly a standard-size Russian flag at the back of their truck for months on after the invasion. The dude would feed you with all kinds of nonsense (that often began with a rational thought). Wish I took a picture. He put the flag up after the town replaced the Canadian flag with the one of Ukraine, by the way. The dude is a Canadian citizen, who went a mile to bring his in-laws from Ukraine to Canada (who now call him an orc and the like, lol).

Example three. If I responded to one of Rob’s posts above -> see example one. Laughing.

There are plenty more, but I believe I made the point.

 

[personaldesas]

^ Fair. I don’t see how it would change anything though.

Example one. Many (perhaps most?) here think I post Russian propaganda; some may be thinking (was so suggested or implied previously, more than once) I am on the Russian payroll even (tell me where to collect). If I post some evidence tying me to Canada, would that change anyone’s mind? Probably not. See Tulsi’s garbage I talked about the other day, born and raised ‘Mercian.

I agree with that. These accusations are often completely nonsensical. I’ve seen Westerners fiercely defend the Russian government, and Russians fiercely oppose it, and vice versa. You can maybe make some broad statistical inference, but it is basically useless when judging an individual.

That said, if someone makes their identity part of the argument, uses it to support their credibility, and then repeatedly offers to prove it. It's interesting not because it would settle the underlying argument, but because it says something about the integrity of that specific claim and the way it was used.

Example two. I know someone who used to fly a standard-size Russian flag at the back of their truck for months on after the invasion. The dude would feed you with all kinds of nonsense (that often began with a rational thought). Wish I took a picture. He put the flag up after the town replaced the Canadian flag with the one of Ukraine, by the way. The dude is a Canadian citizen, who went a mile to bring his in-laws from Ukraine to Canada (who now call him an orc and the like, lol).

It does make you wonder whether people have nothing better to do.

I can understand having strong views, but driving around for months with that kind of public symbolism is a level of commitment I find hard to relate to. I don’t think I’d ever go that far just for the sake of provocation, whatever my position was.

 

[John Fedup]

I agree with that. These accusations are often completely nonsensical. I’ve seen Westerners fiercely defend the Russian government, and Russians fiercely oppose it, and vice versa. You can maybe make some broad statistical inference, but it is basically useless when judging an individual.

That said, if someone makes their identity part of the argument, uses it to support their credibility, and then repeatedly offers to prove it. It's interesting not because it would settle the underlying argument, but because it says something about the integrity of that specific claim and the way it was used.



It does make you wonder whether people have nothing better to do.

I can understand having strong views, but driving around for months with that kind of public symbolism is a level of commitment I find hard to relate to. I don’t think I’d ever go that far just for the sake of provocation, whatever my position was.

If you want to see provocation, there are people driving around with some bumper stickers on their pickups that certainly can provoke.

 

[Redshift]

you was replying to me off the response i gave someone else, basic intelligence, why is it hard for you to understand

I was replying to the sentence that you typed, that was your opinion do try and get a grip I even quoted it back to you.

 

[deyhere]

I agree that nobody should be posting sensitive personal information publicly.

But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity, the implied argument being that someone who is not Russian cannot be aligned with Russian government narratives. He then repeatedly said he would be happy to prove that identity, as so would strengthen the argument.

So I don’t see the issue with taking him up on an offer he made himself, as long as nothing sensitive is posted publicly and he remains fully in control of what, if anything, he wants to show.

Otherwise, it is fair to ask whether the offer was ever serious, and whether that particular line of argument was being made in good faith.

you see what i mean, classic western manipulation and spin. you forgot the part where you guys were so sure that am Russian? someone even posted that his "country Indonesia are friends with my country Russia" and was trying to tell me how dumb i am. you forgot to add that bit. it went from Russian to Russian troll to not a native English speaker. you westerners are so spoilt, this is exactly how you execute foreign policy, it's al most comical.

am ready to prove you are all liars, why not. that's how you bully people on here and if one refuses to be bullied, you start crying "Russian troll". so what are you? Ukrainian troll?

a lot of Brits think it's mad supporting Ukraine fight Russia, why you surprised am one of those people? you just want to squeeze out those voices that try to reason different. you guys most think the whole world is dumb

 

[deyhere]

I don't have to travel to africa to understand the harm that happened during the colonials period, but that is the past which we cannot change, I have travelled through a significant number of countries in soith east Asia and my own country has significant populations of different ethnic groups.

• European: 67.8%
• Māori: 17.8% (the indigenous population, or tangata whenua)
• Asian: 17.3% (notably Chinese and Indian communities)
• Pacific peoples: 8.9% (e.g., Samoan, Tongan, and Cook Islands communities)
• MELAA: 1.9% (Middle Eastern, Latin American, and African) [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]

Google Search

Have you travelled to AFrica

Yes, i have been to a lot of African countries, i have almost done the entire continent, just a handful of countries i have not visited. i have an ongoing project in Ghana at the moment.

do you have any idea what the west done to Africa? most of these African countries got their independence in the 60's and are still being robbed till today by the west. should someone go and remind them and galvanise them to turn against the west. don't forget the memories are a bit still fresh?
why you bothered with how many countries Russia invaded when your track record is very bad? 100 years ago Russia done sh**t now you have to arm Ukraine to fight Russia regardless of the outcome, regardless of if they have nuclear weapons.

 

[personaldesas]

you see what i mean, classic western manipulation and spin. you forgot the part where you guys were so sure that am Russian? someone even posted that his "country Indonesia are friends with my country Russia" and was trying to tell me how dumb i am.

Classic Western manipulation from Indonesia, apparently.

 

[personaldesas]

you see what i mean, classic western manipulation and spin. you forgot the part where you guys were so sure that am Russian? someone even posted that his "country Indonesia are friends with my country Russia" and was trying to tell me how dumb i am. you forgot to add that bit. it went from Russian to Russian troll to not a native English speaker. you westerners are so spoilt, this is exactly how you execute foreign policy, it's al most comical.

am ready to prove you are all liars, why not. that's how you bully people on here and if one refuses to be bullied, you start crying "Russian troll". so what are you? Ukrainian troll?

a lot of Brits think it's mad supporting Ukraine fight Russia, why you surprised am one of those people? you just want to squeeze out those voices that try to reason different. you guys most think the whole world is dumb

Can you quote me where I did all that?

 

[deyhere]

Can you quote me where I did all that?

No, but you writing as if you have not been reading the thread, spinning it hard,

I agree that nobody should be posting sensitive personal information publicly.

But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity, the implied argument being that someone who is not Russian cannot be aligned with Russian government narratives. He then repeatedly said he would be happy to prove that identity, as so would strengthen the argument.

So I don’t see the issue with taking him up on an offer he made himself, as long as nothing sensitive is posted publicly and he remains fully in control of what, if anything, he wants to show.

Otherwise, it is fair to ask whether the offer was ever serious, and whether that particular line of argument was being made in good faith.

that's what you said, why you spinning? i insisted out of the blue to identify my self? why didn't also add that you and your gang was constantly pushing the idea that, am not who i say i am, and in a very aggressive manner? so the man decided to prove his identity.

pure western manipulation technique "But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity". sick

 

[personaldesas]

No, but you writing as if you have not been reading the thread, spinning it hard,

that's what you said, why you spinning? i insisted out of the blue to identify my self? why didn't also add that you and your gang was constantly pushing the idea that, am not who i say i am, and in a very aggressive manner? so the man decided to prove his identity.

You are making claims about what I supposedly said or did. Please quote them.

If I misrepresented something, I’ll correct it. But I’m not going to argue against vague accusations or personal attacks. Either show the specific quote, or I’ll assume there is nothing substantive to answer.

pure western manipulation technique "But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity". sick

What exactly is incorrect about that sentence? If I misrepresented your argument, please correct me. But simply calling it “manipulation” does not answer the point.

 

[rsemmes]

You are making claims about what I supposedly said or did.

Eh?

That happens here, really?

 

[deyhere]

You are making claims about what I supposedly said or did. Please quote them.

If I misrepresented something, I’ll correct it. But I’m not going to argue against vague accusations or personal attacks. Either show the specific quote, or I’ll assume there is nothing substantive to answer.



What exactly is incorrect about that sentence? If I misrepresented your argument, please correct me. But simply calling it “manipulation” does not answer the point.

you must think am dumb, you said "But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity". you see your statement when replying to kippotapysh. why didn't also add that you and your gang was constantly pushing the idea that, am not who i say i am, and in a very aggressive manner, so the man decided to prove his identity?
take it easy man.

 

[personaldesas]

you must think am dumb, you said “But he repeatedly pushed back against the idea that he was repeating Russian government talking points by leaning on his identity”. you see your statement when replying to kippotapysh.

If you reread the post you are quoting, you’ll see I already addressed that point.

why didn’t also add that you and your gang was constantly pushing the idea that, am not who i say i am, and in a very aggressive manner

Because that is simply not true. I merely pointed out that your writing does not read like that of a native English speaker, which naturally raises doubts when someone claims to be a native-born Brit.

I also don’t know who you think my “gang” is. People in this thread usually disagree on almost everything, so if you are getting broad pushback from different directions, maybe that is worth reflecting on rather than treating it as coordination.

it went from Russian to Russian troll to not a native English speaker.

Maybe I’m missing something. You say I called you Russian or a Russian troll. But looking back at what I actually wrote, this was my guess:

If I had to guess I’d say you’re a spanish (or romance) speaker.

So where exactly did you read “Russian” or “Russian troll” into that? Maybe that would clear things up for me.

you westerners are so spoilt, this is exactly how you execute foreign policy, it's al most comical.

That is interesting phrasing. As a Brit, do you not count yourself as Western?

 

[Rob c]

Yes, i have been to a lot of African countries, i have almost done the entire continent, just a handful of countries i have not visited. i have an ongoing project in Ghana at the moment.

do you have any idea what the west done to Africa? most of these African countries got their independence in the 60's and are still being robbed till today by the west. should someone go and remind them and galvanise them to turn against the west. don't forget the memories are a bit still fresh?
why you bothered with how many countries Russia invaded when your track record is very bad? 100 years ago Russia done sh**t now you have to arm Ukraine to fight Russia regardless of the outcome, regardless of if they have nuclear weapons.

Perhaps you dan explain how these independant countries are still beins robbed with facts.
Last time I Iooked NZ had not invaded anyone in the last 100 years, so I would suggest you stop trying to paint over every one with the same brush ib fact I don't know of any indibidual country that comes close to the Russian total of just under one every 5 years.
You still ignore questions as to why NATO is so bad and as it is the reason given by you for the recent iinvasions lets have some answers.
As for some people disagreing with supporting the current support for Ukraine, in countries like mine fou are allowed to disagree, without falling out of a high windows or having a nerve agent in your tea or being sent to Siberia, This is totally normal and fully excepted and not at all questioned.
If you have travelled so extensively, were do all the funds come from?

 

[personaldesas]

G7 leaders agree to increase sanctions on Russian energy

https://www.ft.com/content/a7b956d0-97ce-4a54-ba1d-e1c6eee9a293

 

[Feanor]

Thread closed pending moderator discussion.