The Russian-Ukrainian War Thread

Vivendi

Well-Known Member
Systematic?
Is it a law passed by the Russian Parliament? A decree signed by Putin? What is the name of the officer who gave the order? In writing? You are accusing the country.
Ukraine is committing those crimes, but you don't like Russia. Criminals are criminals, even when committing one crime, that is the equivalence.
If you have done some reading about this it should be clear that the Russian war crimes I referred to are not isolated incidents, they are systematic. In addition Russian war criminals have been decorated by Putin, and Putin himself is wanted for war crimes and should be arrested.
 

rsemmes

Active Member
There are a bunch of criminals in Ukraine.
You don't like Russia.
I see your point now, it's all clear.

You do realize I never used the word "isolated", right?
 

Vivendi

Well-Known Member
You do realize I never used the word "isolated", right?
Yes and so what? Either you have not read the sources I linked to or you chose to ignore what they are saying. In your lasts posts you have not provided a single argument backed by any reports, articles or any other sources, you have just presented your opinions.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
According to Kalibrated...
Pokrovsk and Kupiansk.

If that is already true, it is a good chunk of Pokrovsk. As RUSI said, Ukraine just needs to hold one more year.
Except if you click on it, it says DRG, which is the Russian abbreviation for a an infiltrating recon element. This doesn't represent Russian control, but those penetrations I mentioned earlier, and they are continuing. You can see Suriyakmaps has a grey zone to the center of Pokrovsk on his map representing the same thing.
 

Vivendi

Well-Known Member
The Estonian, Latvian and Lithuanian parliaments have declared Russia to be a terrorist state. Estonian parliament declares Russia a terrorist state – POLITICO
The European Parliament has declared Russia to be a state sponsor of terrorism. European Parliament declares Russia to be a state sponsor of terrorism | News | European Parliament

The Polish Parliament (Sejm) has declared Russia to be a state supporting terrorism. Resolution on the recognition of the Russian Federation as a state supporting terrorism.pdf

The Dutch Parliament declares Russia to be a state sponsor of terrorism Dutch Parliament declares Russia state sponsor of terrorism / The New Voice of Ukraine

The Slovak Parliament recognizes the Russian Regime as a terrorist regime and Russia to a state sponsor of terrorism Slovak parliament recognises Russian regime as terrorist and Russia as terrorism sponsor | Ukrainska Pravda

The Czech Parliament has declared the Russian Regime to be a terrorist regime. Lower House of Czech Parliament Recognises Russian Regime as Terrorist | European Pravda

The OSCE Parliamentary Assembly recognizes Russia as a state sponsor of terrorism OSCE Parliamentary Assembly recognizes Russia as state sponsor of terrorism

Bulgaria: Russia Warns of Retaliation After Bulgarian Parliament Labels It a Terrorism Sponsor - Novinite.com - Sofia News Agency

ICCT: Russian State Terrorism and State Sponsorship of Terrorism | International Centre for Counter-Terrorism - ICCT

Soufan Report: Russia a state sponsor of terrorism: Soufan report

Hudson Institute: Treat Russia as a Terrorist State | Hudson Institute
 

rsemmes

Active Member
Yes and so what? Either you have not read the sources I linked to or you chose to ignore what they are saying. In your lasts posts you have not provided a single argument backed by any reports, articles or any other sources, you have just presented your opinions.
There are a bunch of criminals in Ukraine.
There are a bunch of criminals in Russia.
There is no need to argue the point, there is no need to provide more reports.

I would argue Russia being the only "terrorist state".
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Except if you click on it, it says DRG, which is the Russian abbreviation for a an infiltrating recon element. This doesn't represent Russian control, but those penetrations I mentioned earlier, and they are continuing. You can see Suriyakmaps has a grey zone to the center of Pokrovsk on his map representing the same thing.
It appears Chasov Yar has fallen. However, like with the announcement of the fall of Toretsk back in January, Russian forces have pushed through the town, not encircled it. As a result Ukrainian forces are right outside the town from at least one axis, and could readily re-enter the town with counter-attacks. Unlike Toretsk, Chasov Yar is on the high ground, and Russian forces did push beyond the town southward and northward, making it less exposed. In principle this lays the ground-work for a move on Konstantinovka, but I suspect this will take quite some time. Russian forces haven't pushed north beyond Poltavka or Rusin Yar, so the western pincer for enveloping Konstantinovka doesn't exist. It's likely that will be the eventual effort, but right now the focs seem to be on the Pokrovsk metropolitan area.
 

KipPotapych

Well-Known Member
Except if you click on it, it says DRG, which is the Russian abbreviation for a an infiltrating recon element. This doesn't represent Russian control, but those penetrations I mentioned earlier, and they are continuing. You can see Suriyakmaps has a grey zone to the center of Pokrovsk on his map representing the same thing.
Is there a difference nowadays between DRGs and “small attack groups” that pass the defences, accumulate, and occupy the area? I mean I understand the theoretical difference, but is there a practical difference on today’s battlefield in Ukraine?
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Is there a difference nowadays between DRGs and “small attack groups” that pass the defences, accumulate, and occupy the area? I mean I understand the theoretical difference, but is there a practical difference on today’s battlefield in Ukraine?
There are raids intended to cause damage, and attacks intended to secure ground. DRGs often don't take positions they can hold, and often aren't supported with the kind of effort that attacks are. You can't just take a patch of ground and sit there. You need supplies, troop rotations, and support. And you need routes that make it possible to do all of this. DRGs can often penetrate much further largely because they only need to get through once, do their job and find a way back, possibly not even the same route. It's possible to have an area where you can't keep permanent presence because they will get hit by the enemy, but you can pass through now and then, if you're careful, and don't make a habit of it. So I believe we do need to distinguish penetrations by recon and SpN elements separate from firm advances intended to gain ground.

That having been said, your point is taken, one might very well convert into the other. In fact if enough DRGs can go in frequently enough and cause enough problems for Ukraine, it's possible they will force Ukraine to pull back from any area where they have a hard time maintaining a stable front line, and thus allow for a Russian advance to take place. But the frequency of this seems to be awfully high, which is why I allow for a different possibility, namely that actually a substantial Russian element has penetrated Ukrainian lines and is now in the process of establishing themselves, and the result could be the loss of a substantial part of Pokrovsk without a traditional large scale assault. There is even a third possibility, that Ukraine is already pulling out of the area, but not yet willing to admit this publicly, and the Russian penetrations aren't of any sort of solid Ukrainian presence, but rather of Ukraine's rear screening elements as they pull out their main forces.

Russian forces north of the conurbation are continuing to advance, so it's starting to look like that "eastern" (now northern) pincer will complete the envelopment to the point where logistics will be compromised and Ukraine will have to do a withdrawal under drone controlled roads, like they had to in previous cases, unless they're already pulling out. On the northern side the second refuse mound seems to be next in line for assault. There are also, so far, unconfirmed reports of similar Russian recon team penetrations into Mirnograd from the north-east.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Yeah, it seems to me that the difference can be fairly washed out. Here is a recent thread on the subject from a Ukrainian soldier (recommend following for those on Twitter):

View attachment 53228
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The thread can be found here: https://x.com/solonko1648/status/1949592293524021607
I think he does a good job of distinguishing recon groups from forces actually there to capture ground. I also am starting to think that this advance is about more then Pokrovsk. I suspect they're aiming for the Dobropol'ye-Belozerskoe area in the north-west part of the Donbas, which start to threaten logistics for the Kramatorsk-Slavyansk area. The end point of the push, likely well into next year, is probably the Aleksandrovka area, leaving the north-western route as the only big artery for Ukraine's forces in the Donbas.
 

Stampede

Well-Known Member
It has nothing to do with taking Ukraine, it never had.
We want a NATO Ukraine, Russia doesn't; Russia is doing something about it. The Soviet Union did not invade western Europe, Russia is going to do it? I see a lot of imagination there.
Now, we want to protect our interests... Russia wants to protect its interests.
Is it Russia or Putin protecting their interests.
Are they both the same or is there a difference?

Just a thought

Cheers S
 

John Fedup

The Bunker Group
Is it Russia or Putin protecting their interests.
Are they both the same or is there a difference?

Just a thought

Cheers S
I would say Putin and his gang are Russia so no difference. What would be interesting to know is there a significant shift by Russian citizens wrt interests in general regarding the war and relations with NATO/EU (bearing in mind their views won't matter to the Putin gang)?
 

rsemmes

Active Member
Is it Russia or Putin protecting their interests.
Are they both the same or is there a difference?
Just a thought
Cheers S
A British PM took UK into Iraq, is there a difference?
Trump or the US is imposing sanctions on EU and the rest of the world?

Sorry, tariffs...
 

Vivendi

Well-Known Member
A British PM took UK into Iraq, is there a difference?
Please stop with the whataboutism and the false equivalences. The Iraq war was a disaster, should never have happened, and some Western leaders should have been investigated for potential war crimes. Please don't use that as a lame excuse for Russian war crimes in Ukraine.

Stick to the topic.
 

Redshift

Active Member
Those 2 nuclear subs are not for Ukraine, Trump and Putin are sizing their... egos.

But maybe Zelenski gets what he wants, (the end of the world) Victory!
You really do have a direct line to Trump and Putin or else how could you possibly know the motivation with such certainty!!!!!
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Update.

Sumy area.

Russia bit off some ground east of Aleksandriya, across the border from Gornal' and recaptured Varachino. Meanwhile Ukraine, after some back and forth fighting, has fully recaptured Kondratovka. Ukraine also bit off some ground west of Alekseevka. Overall Ukraine's counter-offensive here continues to develop. Russia does continue to make small advances west of Yunakovka.


Russia hits a Ukrainian Lyut' UGV in Sumy region.


Russia hit Buyn' town in Sumy area. Allegedly the target is a Ukrainian staging area.


Russia hits some vehicles allegedly belonging to the 104th TerDef Bde in Orlovka, Sumy region. Reportedly Garpiya-A1 drones were used.


Russian strikes on Konrdatovka, confirming Ukrainian control of the village.


Russia's 810th MarBde operating a T-62M (exact variant unclear) in the Kursk border area.


Russian 92nd Engineers doing mineclearing in Kursk region with several types of UGV.

.

Kharkov area.

Russian forces slightly expanded the area of control east of Volchansk and have crossed the Volchya west of Volchansk grabbing the forest, and a chunk of the town. Meanwhile near Liptsi Ukraine has recaptured some ground north of Glubokoe. Russian forces have also opened a new direction, taking the village of Degtyarnoe in the north-eastern part of Kharkov region.


Russian drone targets a Ukrainian RAK-12 towed MLRS near Volchansk.


Russia hits allegedly a Ukrainian T-72 near Liptsi. It's clearly a Soviet-made MBT, but it could be a T-64, it's hard to make out. The ERA layout doesn't help.


4 Ukrainian POWs allegedly taken near Demidovka, Belgorod region.


Kupyansk area.

A Ukrainian counter-attack from the north re-entered the first houses of Melovoe. Meanwhile Russia has expanded their push towards Kupyansk securing all of Golubovka, Rad'kovka, and Kondrashovka, and contesting Moskovka. Russian forces also entered the northern outskirts of Kupyansk itself. On the right shore of the Oskol Russian forces continue to advance along the road to Kupyansk.


Russia hit a 2S1 near Kupyansk.


Ukrainian soldiers with a burning vehicle in Kupyansk area. Note the label says T-72 but the vehicle we can see is clearly an IMR. Maybe it's not what's burning and a T-72 burns behind it? It's hard to tell.


Oskol front.

Russian forces continue to expand their presence north of Borisovka Andreevka. On the southern side east of the Oskol back and forth fighting over the eastern part of Torskoe continues. Russian forces are making another push to take the village. There are some Ukrainian counter-attacks and the situation remains unusually fluid, but Russian forces do seem to be present in most of the east side of the village. There is also a separate salient through the southern part of the forest, into the village. Across the Zherebets Russian forces are pushing up to Shadrigolovoe. Inside Karpovka Russia was initially repulsed but has re-entered the village. Russian forces have also taken some country-side west of Kolodezi. There has been a Ukrainian counter-attack west of Grekovka retaking some ground. This comes even as a separate Russian push took some ground west and north-west of Grekovka.


Russia hit the crossing over the Oskol near Gorohovatka. This bridge leads to Borovoe.


Russia hits a Ukrainian SUV in Borovoe, Kharkov region.


Seversk salient.

Back and forth fighting continues north-east of Seversk, leading to a large grey area. There are reports of a large scale Russian attack that ultimately failed, with Russia choosing not to commit additional forces after the attack was revealed, but nonetheless taking large losses. Russian forces have pushed up to the outskirts of Seversk from the east, in a narrow salient, after some back and forth fighting. North of the Severskiy Donets river Russian forces pushed forward in the Serebryanskoe woods. Near Ivano-Darievka Russia continues to bite off pieces of countryside.


A rare tank engagement in the Seversk area of a Ukrainian tank firing on a Russian tank-shed. The outcome is unclear.


Russian drones hitting a pair of Ukrainian tanks in the Seversk area.


Russian bomb strikes on Seversk.


Some footage of Ukraine's defense lines near Kramatorsk.

 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
Chasov Yar.

Russian forces have fully taken Chasov Yar and pushed into Predtechino, a small village in the low lands westward, as well as into the country-side west of town along a broad front. North of Chasov Yar Russian forces have taken some treches and are approaching Mayskoe.


Aerial view of the ruins of Chasov Yar.


Konstantinovka area.

Russian forces have taken all of Belaya Gora, taken some additional trenches north of Toretsk, and have taken another chunk of ground along the rail line approaching Aleksandro-Shul'tino. On the west side Russian forces have taken most of Scherbinovka, and in general we are seeing a Ukrainian withdrawal here, as these positions become difficult to supply with Russian forces squeezing the only remaining route northward. Yablonovka and Aleksandro-Kalinovo are almost fully under Russian control, and there is no longer a way out of the Toretsk area past the reservoir there. In general there is now a buffer of country-side under Russian control in all directions north of Toretsk.


Russian 2S44 operating on the Konstantinovka axis.


Pokrovsk area.

North of Pokrovsk Russian forces have pushed through Boykovka, taking Mayak, Pan'kovka, Fedorovka, the Keramresurs quarry, and Zatishok. Nikanorovka is contested. They reached the rail line north of Rodinskoe, east of Biletskoe. They've also taken the first and larger refuse mound, and flanked the second refuse mound from both sides, and entered Chervoni Liman (Kraniy Liman but not the town on the Severskiy Donets). Ukraine attempted counter-attacks towards Razino and into southern Novoekonomichnoe but they were ultimately repulsed. Poltavka and Popov Yar are also under Russian control, in Rusin Yar nothing has changed. In the east Russian forces have taken Novoekonomichnoe. South of Pokrovsk Russian forces have taken Novoukrainka, and have begun pushing into Chunishino. On the south-western side Russian forces have taken all of Zverovoe, including the refuse mound, and continue to push into Leontovichi. Russian forces have also entered Pokrovsk proper and the battle for the city has begun, though so far there's a lot of fog of war. West of Pokrovsk Russian forces have pushed across the ground south-west of Udachnoe, though most of the village remains under Ukrainian control. At this point a western envelopment seems highly unlikely. South of Mirnograd Russian forces have advanced for the first time in months, approaching the outskirts of the town.


Russian FAB-1500 strike on Poltavka.


Russian Zemledelie remote minelayer and TOS-2 operating in the Pokrovsk area.


Russian Tor-M2 operating in the Pokrovsk area.


Russian Msta-S operations on the Pokrovsk axis.


Ukraine's 155th Mech operating a Leo-2A4 in the Pokrovsk area.


Russian Orlan-10 operations near Pokrovsk.


There are reports that Ukraine's 7th Airborne Corps is being sent to the Pokrovsk area. Since it's unlikely the entire unit will be used, it's unclear which brigades (btlns?) will be in play.


The question of Russian penetrations into Pokrovsk remains open. Reports of Russian infantry elements causing chaos in the town continue to trickle in.


Dnepropetrovsk axis.

Russian forces have recaptured Dachnoe after a Ukrainian counter-attack, and have continued to advance into border regions of eastern Dnepropetrovsk, taking the village of Malieka, among other spots. Russian penetrations into the region remain small and opportunistic. Suriyakmaps combines with with the Velikaya Novoselka area data, but I think it makes sense to separate the two, so some of the links will show up in both sections, with me writing about the relevant part of the information in the section.


Russian forces hit the bridge near Iskra, on the border of the regions.


Russian drones operating inside a Ukrainian net corridor, in eastern Dnepropetrovsk region. This is the road from Muravka to Novopavlovka.


Russian drone strike on a Ukrainian vehicle in Berezovoe, Dnepropetrovsk region.


Velikaya Novoselka area.

Russian forces have taken Malievka in Dnepropetrovsk region, right next to Shevchenko. South of there Russian forces have crossed into Zaporozhye and taken Temirovka, just west of Zelenoe Pole. On the northern side Russian forces took Zeleniy Guy and Novokhatskoe, and have pushed up to Andreevka-Klevtsovoe, and Aleksandrograd. Voskresenka remains contested after a Ukrainian counter-attack. Ukraine did counter-attack, briefly retaking Yalta, but was repulsed.


Russia targets a bridge near Komyshevakha.


Russian drone strike on what appears to be a 2S1 howitzer under drone netting. It burns down as a result.

 
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