iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
That's common sense. Do the powers that be have any of that? Honestly, I think some on this forum could make better decisions on equipment. At least they made the right call with the Evolved Mogami.
Royal Australian Navy Discussions and Updates 2.0
- Thread starter OPSSG
- Start date
Todjaeger
Potstirrer
It would really depend on where any minefields were to be laid by an OPV (if that is even how the mines would be deployed) and perhaps the nature of the minefield (i.e. offensive minefield vs. defensive minefield). A minefield laid around/near an Australian port to restrict or deter the approach of hostile vessels, subs in particular, would not likely require any significant self-defense capabilities because the vessel would be operating under an ADF defensive umbrella. OTOH if the intention was to sail an OPV into or near a contested SLOC like the Malacca Strait to deploy mines to close or further restrict the SLOC, then yes, significant defensive capabilities would likely be needed. However, I would think it more likely that the RAN would deploy sea mines into threatened or contested areas via submarine rather than via a known surface vessel of the RAN.
By using deploying via submarine, the field could be deployed covertly and hostiles might not even become aware of the existence of the minefield until a vessel hits one.
Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
As far as selecting a gun for the Arafura class, it would be hard to go past the same 30mm gun as selected for the Hunter class with commonality benefits of training and logistics. This article describes the 30mm round as hitting the sweet spot between range/muzzle velocity, shell size, penetration, cost, ease of fitment, reloading, etc and has a number of different shells available to suit particular tasks - including proximity fused for drone swarms. Please ignore the obvious error in the article about the Phalanx’s calibre.
On the subject of mine laying, it has been previously stated that one of the proposed roles for the Ghost Shark is mine laying in hostile environments. Depending on the number that are required to be laid, modules can be inserted to increase its length to carry a larger number. It appears to be an ideal method as they can be laid without detection or risking any personnel. A much better option than using Arafura’s.
On the subject of mine laying, it has been previously stated that one of the proposed roles for the Ghost Shark is mine laying in hostile environments. Depending on the number that are required to be laid, modules can be inserted to increase its length to carry a larger number. It appears to be an ideal method as they can be laid without detection or risking any personnel. A much better option than using Arafura’s.
I wouldn't be surprised if Anduril have designed a bay in their XL-AUV exactly for this task...
I'm not convinced that this would be the typical means of deployment, apart from in very specific offensive scenarios.
Sea mines are very heavy, and despite the nomenclature, these UUVs are not particularly large, so capacity would be limited. They also have miserable top speeds. So the ability to lay a sizable minefield at speed appears to be severely compromised. Using a mother ship to deploy the UUVs negates the element of surprise.
Sure, with an SSN or SSK, as they are large and fast (er). An XL-UUV however seems particularly inefficient for large minefields.
I do think unmanned systems are the way to go however. Something like the Austal Vantage 55, which would have vastly increased capacity, is relatively fast, unmanned can be purchased and deployed in numbers in various locations.
Just my thoughts.
OldTex
Well-Known Member
The XL-UUV may be suitable for covertly laying nuisance offensive minefields in choke points. The purpose of which is to inject an element of doubt or risk into the opponent's scheme of maneuver. If HVAs are meant to traverse the choke point then the time consuming task of clearing lanes for navigation must be done.
Joe Black
Active Member
My guess is that the Typhoon Mk-30C is going to be a serious contender, as we will be equipping this on the Hunter class. Won't be surprised to see this replacing the 25mm version on the Hobarts, and in future armed the upgraded Mogamis as well.
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
It makes perfect sense as that will bring commonality across the fleet. It's a travesty that the OPVs don't have a serious gun. This is a matter of urgency and with all the kerfuffle going on in Canberra at the moment this is small potatoes in the scheme of things. It needed to be done yesterday.
Despite my pessimism with this project, there is hope with Phase 2 which includes the oft-mentioned (but little occurring) mission systems for the class. Perhaps with the shenanigans over this class, this gives the RAN the chance to sort out what it actually wants to do with these and equip them accordingly. “Maybe” even with enough self-defence capability to out-match a civilian speedboat, if we’re lucky!
Unfortunately I think the original money to “buy a gun” is gone, when we paid Leurrssen $10m to cancel the gun they had ordered on our behalf…
Murse
Member
Whats the kerfuffle in Canberra? General Canberra-ness or something specific like RAN vessels being fired upon?
I was wondering if the RAN does any info exchange with Turkey. With the German cancellation of the F126 to building more Meko200's, I just realised RAN and Turkiye both have the same Spanish carrier and German Meko 200's. since we operate both, I was wondering if we ever exchange operational information, etc.
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
Just the current crap they're fighting over. It distracts them from the big defence picture.
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
Man, it's quiet on here. Where are you guys?
Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
The drumbeat of the Mogami frigates is very impressive - the 10th standard Mogami has just been commissioned in the Japanese Navy, less than 3 years since it was laid down (launched after 18 months) and all 24 will be in service by 2032 (along with 3 for the RAN). Details in this Naval News article
“Nagara was laid down on July 6, 2023, and launched on December 19, 2024 under Japan’s fiscal year 2022 procurement plan. The Nagara was built at a cost of about 52.3 billion yen ($323 million).”
“Nagara was laid down on July 6, 2023, and launched on December 19, 2024 under Japan’s fiscal year 2022 procurement plan. The Nagara was built at a cost of about 52.3 billion yen ($323 million).”
iambuzzard
Well-Known Member
That's impressive, particularly the short period between laying down, launch and commissioning of each ship. It's not warp speed but it's damn fast.
Going Boeing
Well-Known Member
The Type 83 design for the Royal Navy has evolved to accommodate its new “hybrid navy” direction. BAE has shown its version of the Common Combat Vessels which appear to be based on the Type 26 hull. This Naval News article gives more information about the design.
The impressive radar setup on the Hunter class would allow a similar CCV version to be developed with less changes required and it’s probable that that the RAN will also pursue hybrid navy options, as already disclosed by the plan to build 6 LOCSV’s, Ghost Sharks, & other unmanned surveillance vessels.
Article courtesy of Defense Media on Facebook.
The impressive radar setup on the Hunter class would allow a similar CCV version to be developed with less changes required and it’s probable that that the RAN will also pursue hybrid navy options, as already disclosed by the plan to build 6 LOCSV’s, Ghost Sharks, & other unmanned surveillance vessels.
Article courtesy of Defense Media on Facebook.
The Hunter class has a pineapple mast, what do we call this mast? trying to think of a name? I wonder if the UK is converting to CEAFAR radars?
Teapot?
Let's not get too far ahead of ourselves... There's a fair chance the poms end up going with fitted for but not with hull...
There was a discussion some time back about maritime strike capability from USAF bombers? (In the context of B-21A V SSN).
Well this sorts that idea out…
www.defenceconnect.com.au
Well this sorts that idea out…
US Pacific Air Forces successfully deploy Long Range Anti-Ship Missile from B-2 stealth bomber
The US military has successfully live-fire tested a Long Range Anti-Ship Missile deployed from a B-2 Spirit stealth bomber in the Pacific.
www.defenceconnect.com.au