PLA has finalized the design of new turbofan WS10/WS10A

[ANdrIod]

hello Pakistan bro, I am from China, :china Here's something new about J-10's Turbofan.
" Liming aeroengine company and 606 institute are coorporating on the technique details of mass producion of a new type of turbofan. Blah blah blah..........."

It was reported by a Half-official website www.china.com, unfortunately, in Chinese not English
http://military.china.com/zh_cn/news/568/20040919/11884899.html
the original source is "PLA Daily", official newspaper of PLA

Undoubtedly this "new type of turbofan" is WS10a. That means PLA has finalized the disign of WS10a. The possible unit cost is 1.5million$ and 1.1-1.2m$ after mass producion. That will heavily reduce the unit price of J-10. I think it make J10 a more competitive aircraft in market. I hope PAF will choose J-10. ak :china At least,PAF do not have to worry about the sanction. China is a reliable source :cheers : especially after we do not need Russian's AL-31F any more.


Sorry for my Chinese-English. Frogive me if I didn't express correctly and clearly.

Background

WS10/WS10a is totally different from Rassian AL-31F. I feel angry when some indians tell the lie that WS10 is a copy of AL-31F.

Let me introduce the history of WS10, a synthesis of officially open material,such as PLA Daily, PLA's company's website, published literature.

WS10 project started in early 1980's, named "high-TWR project". Core engine is from GE cmf56(the same as F101) Another plan named "mid-TWR project" started in 1984. The original target is to understand the basic principle of turbofan. It is intersting that the mid-TWR project designed a more capable core engine in 1992 WS1O's first test fly is fixed in the first J-10 in 1996. But exploded in 1997 and the plane crashed . At the same time, the mid-TWR project developed so quickly that PLA decided stop testing WS10. The new turbofan from mid TWR project was finally named WS10a. These two project merged into one. ws10a's first test fly is in 2002, in a Flanker with another engine still a AL-31F(It's stupid to test a new engine on a single-engine aircraft like china do in 1997 :mad )and succeed in june 2003. The AL-31FN in J10 at present is just like F404 in Indian LCA.

WS10 is a big family, including 4 types in project till now.

WS10a, for J10
b for civil aviation, for example: Chinese new 70-100 seats aeroplane ARJ-21(will test fly in 2005 or early 2006)
c for J11/Su27
d a enhanced edition for J10( At least WS10A+TVC, TVC for WS10A has been revealed on CCTV news in 2002 , together with our Chairman Jiang. He even manipulated TVC through a remote cotroller in hand)

The data of WS10A is only a conjecture, :? HeHe. Considering the open data of another turbojet Kunlun-II which is believed sharing the same core with WS10a.I think WS10a's capability is close to F110.TWR is about 7.5(f110 is 7.57 while AL-31F is 7.1).What do you think, my Pakistan bro?

 

[webmaster]

Welcome to DT! Thanks for the info.

 

[Pathfinder-X]

WS10's thrust is slightly lower than the Russian AL-31F, but does have a better fuel efficiency. Several Chinese produced J-11(Su-27) were fitted with this engine for trial in late 2002. As for WS10A, it is the same engine as WS10 but with thrust vector nozzle, aim to equip the later version J-10, giving the aircraft exceptional manoevurbility(I hate spelling this word : ).

For more info, please see the links below

http://log.flugzeugforum.de/forum/printthread.php?t=7406

http://www.janes.com/defence/air_forces/news/jdw/jdw021210_2_n.shtml

 

[umair]

The reason the thrust is low is (I read this at a chinese place) that the WS-10 is a static thrust(?) engine ie it will provide the same level of dry thrust at all altitudes.Therefore better allround performance at all altitudes when compared with normal turbofans which have their thrust highs and lows wrt the altitude they are at.India is also doing research work on a similar engine.
Well looks like the engine hitch has been solved and now with a decent package from the west PAF will go for the J-10 as it's medium end aircraft.

 

[ANdrIod]

WS10's thrust is slightly lower than the Russian AL-31F, but does have a better fuel efficiency. Several Chinese produced J-11(Su-27) were fitted with this engine for trial in late 2002. As for WS10A, it is the same engine as WS10 but with thrust vector nozzle, aim to equip the later version J-10, giving the aircraft exceptional manoevurbility(I hate spelling this word : ).

For more info, please see the links below

http://log.flugzeugforum.de/forum/printthread.php?t=7406

http://www.janes.com/defence/air_forces/news/jdw/jdw021210_2_n.shtml

I think maybe your words about WS10's thrust is right,(I cann,t denied it with any open resource).But WS10a is different from WS10. As I introduced in my post, WS10 's first test fly is in 1996 not 2002, and crashed in 1997(reported by western media). WS10 has been finalized in 2000. The turbofan you mentioned is WS10a whose first test fly is in 2002 and succeed in June 2003. WS10 is a derivation from F101 with High-TWR project by 606 institute.while WS10a's core is from Mid-TWR project of 624 institute. IN 1992, 624 give the core to 606 institute for further development. In 1998 WS10a's first test(on the ground) show more capability than WS10. So PLA choose WS10a not WS10 for J10. First mass production batch of WS10as are equipped without TVC, just for safety. Because TVC and corresponding software has not been tested in air.

These material is conclusion of official materials, I believe them

I didn't find any useful information in your links. :?

Here's some conjecture about WS10/WS10a's thrust in Chinese websites,

thrust(kg) TWR
WS10 12600 7.1
WS10a 13200 7.5
F110 13227 7.57
Al-31F 12500 7.1

 

[muslim282]

Congratulations to the chinese.

Hopefully we will soon see fully manufactured SU27 and SU30s from china as well, with nothing imported.
Don,t forget to hand a few over to pakistan
On a more real note:- l tink the J10 will be very soon going into full scale production as the engine was the stalling point for some time.
l,d like to see the J10 with the thrust vectoring capability being tested against the F16. Pakistan will lend you one. :
It will be a good test for the J10 and it,s engine.
l also hope PAF purchase this plane.

 

[adsH]

l,d like to see the J10 with the thrust vectoring capability being tested against the F16. Pakistan will lend you one.

Are you guys trying to get your selves in trouble!! first you want more F-16 then you start lending whatever is given to you to an arch rival!!

i need to see a source on the lending agreement before i would even believe the B*** C**P you came out with from that Flapping whole on your face !!!

 

[dabrownguy]

Is TC possible on a single engine jet?
Any ways the wz-10 is very much like the Al-31F exept more modern in its own way. Thats why the flanker can be powered by the wz-10. same thing that ge404 can power lca so can Kaverie which is different but still the same. the kaverie could power a f-18 hornet givin the changes. if the wz-10 was too much different from the Al-31F than the flanker airframe would need a lot of changing to work with the different weight etc... if the wz-10 was a completley independent project then it wouldn;t be the ideal engine to power the flanker.

 

[muslim282]

Adsh

Arch rivals to the indians, but friends to us pakistanis.
Now maybe your mother dropped you at birth, hence you talk rubbish and use bad language.

 

[Pathfinder-X]

Finally I found the article that mentions WS-10A engine from Kanwa.

Authoritative sources from the Chinese military aviation industry Group One told Kanwa that some major progress had been made in the development of the sub-systems used on the 4th generation stealth fighter, particularly the engine. The WS10A turbofan engines originally designed for J10A by Shenyang Liming Motor Company may very likely be installed on this 4th generation fighter for trial flight. The air test of WS10A had already been completed on SU27SK, including a total 256 test items.

The sources indicated to Kanwa's correspondent that the fundamental performance of the WS10A has already attained the standard of AL31F. The maximum augmented thrust power of AL31FN is 12500kgf, power consumption 0.67kg/kgf.h. Sources based in China also claimed that in streamlining the design, WS10A is even better than AL31FN as it focused on reducing the weight. Meanwhile, the upgrading work paid special attention to the reduction of consumption.

The research of the thrust vector control (TVC) technology has also been going on for a long time. The basic design idea is close to the Russian AL31F-TVN TVC engine. That is, China hopes to largely improve the maneuverability of the engine by adding a TVC nozzle on WS10A. Chinese Aviation experts emphasized that the Chinese version of TVC nozzle currently under development can perform 360 degree rotating. Earlier President Jiang Zemin inspected this project, which is one of the key aviation development programs during the "ninth five-year plan. Television images indicate this TVC nozzle can rotate at a range of +-15 degree, the source says that it has also been planned that the China-made TVC engine would be upgraded at appropriate time and installed on J10A in order to " improve the fighter's short-distance taking-off and landing performance and attain the maneuverability standard of F35.

Link: http://www.kanwa.com/free/2003/09/e0909a.htm