New SSBN for the RN

[LancerMc]

UAV on subs are quickly being developed. I have seen articles about a fast attack UAV designed to help SSBN's hunt attack subs on patrol. I am sure the newly modified Ohio's, that are tomahawk capable, with be later adapted to deploy UAV's to better help deploying special forces.

I am puzzled by the article's description of building surface vessels that are capable of launching missiles. While thats completely plausible I wouldn't do that because your nuclear forces would be completely in the open. Thats even more important since only 4 ships will be produced.

 

[mark22w]

I am puzzled by the article's description of building surface vessels that are capable of launching missiles. While thats completely plausible I wouldn't do that because your nuclear forces would be completely in the open. Thats even more important since only 4 ships will be produced.

The white paper considered other options including this, land basing D5's and even using 20 Airbus airliners to launch strategic missiles - all dismissed, for various reasons...my favourite was the map of the UK showing a comparable US land based missile site being larger than Wales

Three points concern me about the paper. Firstly the talk of three or four subs probably means 'three' - if the 4-5 Polaris, or 12, then 8, now 6 T45's are anything to go by. Can three provide one operational boat 24/7 - if so great and in full agreement. Interested to hear views.

The second point is it is easy to talk about a new sub some years off and with a 25 year life (the issue with the Vanguards unlike the Ohio's is they cannot be extended beyond this point...) - this is beyond the life of Trident and could mean the UK is out of step with the US and a new missile / sub type / strategic solution. Appreciate government to government agreements but come on - can you make an assurance for 2050 and beyond?

Thirdly, in 1998 this same government made a commitment to 2 new 50,000+ ton carriers. Still waiting...

A real shame the Vanguard's were not built with upgrade in mind. As to dual use I think as the only nuclear option for the UK this will not be considered at all. IMO these boats will have one purpose only.

 

[Galrahn]

Big-E.

I think you are talking about the Dry Dock Shelters (DDS) right?

The SSGN has the 2 lockouts and 22 silos. Silo 3-10 can be outfitted with 'special packages.' If the SSGN has a DDS, it will cover 2 silo's, either 3 and 5 or 4 and 6, depending upon which side it is on. So far in pictures I have seen, the SSGN is deploying with 2 DDS attached.

Special payloads are virtually guarenteed on silo's 7-10, whether they are UUV, UAV, or some other weapon system not a tomahawk. It is a reasonable expectation that the SSGN will rarely, if ever, deploy with more than 98 cruise missiles on a 6 month patrol.

The covered silo's, namely 3-6, are excellent for SOF storage, but also storage of smaller deployable systems like gliders, mines, and/or other innovative fixed sensor systems.

By fixed sensors, think in terms of 55 gallon drums with a localized passive sonar system attached. Several of these can be deployed by divers, disguised as typical ocean bottom debris, and spread out over a large area in a littoral. The SSGN can then stand off or patrol a completely different area yet cover that zone.

That type of sensor net doesn't need an open hatch, thus can be stored under the silo's blocked by the Dry Dock Shelters, after all, they have to be deployed by diver anyway and can be deployed through the same lockout chambor the divers use.


** Back on Topc **

Mark,

Does the RN currently use blue/gold crews like the US does for their boomers?

 

[RubiconNZ]

Does the RN currently use blue/gold crews like the US does for their boomers?

I thought the USN changed to a single crew as a result of decreased threat enviroment or something along that lines, if not yet do you have a date when that will happen?

 

[jlb]

About readiness: the French Navy has 4 SSBNs and they provide 3 operational boats 24/7 so with 3 boats you should certainly be able to get 2 24/7.

And you'd be much better off developping your own missiles. It's sure expensive, but if you decide on a nuclear deterrent, it makes a lot of sense not to depend on anybody else for it. The key event that decided France to build one was Suez, and it affected Britain just as much.

I wouldn't even be surprised if you got a full tech transfer on the M51 if you asked for it.

 

[Galrahn]

I thought the USN changed to a single crew as a result of decreased threat enviroment or something along that lines, if not yet do you have a date when that will happen?

I am unaware of any changes, in fact Blue/Gold is now used for SSGNs as well.

 

[RubiconNZ]

I am unaware of any changes, in fact Blue/Gold is now used for SSGNs as well.

Hmm perhaps they scrapped the plans, I'm sure I read it in a DOD document along the way, it would of been at least 18 months ago,I'll have a look for a source.

Interesting about the SSGN, clever idea to continue it.
Cheers