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Indonesian Aero News

Discussion in 'Air Force & Aviation' started by Ananda, Jun 19, 2009.

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  1. Ananda

    Ananda Well-Known Member

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    https://www.janes.com/article/90767/chinese-ch-4-uav-arrives-in-surabaya-for-demonstration-flight

    Chinese UAV arrived in Surabaya for demo or trial with TNI. Interesting it's arrived and will doing trial with Indonesian Navy (TNI-AL) airbase, eventough in the media, Mindef told that the users of MALE UAV will be the Air Force (TNI-AU).

    Both TNI-AU and TNI-AL Aviation operated MPA, and one of the usage of MALE being assessed by TNI is for maritime surveillance. Whether this mean TNI-AL Aviation in the end will operated some of their own MALE UAV or the MALE UAV will be operated jointly by TNI-AU and TNI-AL will remain to be seen.

    Chine CH-4 and Turkish ANKA is strongly rumoured as front runners for Indonesia MALE UCAV, as local manufacture also aiming for MALE Market but both Anka and CH-4 is rumoured being assessed not only on MALE capabilities but also UCAV ones.
     
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  2. ngatimozart

    ngatimozart Super Moderator Staff Member Verified Defense Pro

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    Call me paranoid (great Black Sabbath album) but I'd be somewhat concerned about operating a Chinese MALE especially in the SCS and adjoining areas. How secure would it be? How much data, both real time and stored, would be uploaded / transmitted to China? How much would the Chinese be able to control spoof what was being sent back to the Indonesian controllers?
     
  3. Sandhi Yudha

    Sandhi Yudha Active Member

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    Yes indeed, its like to use a 5G-network and CCTV surveillance systems provided by Huawei, you dont know what end up at the Chinese intelligence agencies...
    Lets hope also that these UAV are not from the famous Made-in-China quality and durability.

    Btw its remarkable that they sent the CASC CH-4 , i thought the air force ordered the Chengdu Wing Loong II UAV...
     
  4. Ananda

    Ananda Well-Known Member

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    I believe this is the questions that now related to all purchase on electronic system. Remember where Turkey try to convince US and NATO that they will have full control on all data that S-400 sensors and system. Thus Russia can't have access to what Turkey's S-400 has on NATO and US assests working in Turkish territory.

    Thus, I believe one of the aspects on trials also related to how secure TNI can control those UAV. Same consideration will also going to be applied to Turkish ANKA systems.
    Some time ago some local on line 'journalist' put rumours on local forum or Media on the matter of Israel has back door to IAI Searcher used by TNI-AU.
    If not mistaken, some source from TNI-AU already denied this on internet in local forums, but the suspicion on this still linggered with some local on line 'journalist'.

    My opinion on this is back on how far TNI will get access to the software 'codes' and algorithms. In fact even if you have local made UAV that using foreign 'vendors' on the software and systems, potential leak can still happen if you can't control all the codes. This thing can happen to all civilians and military systems.

    Is all back to how far the original vendors can gain access to the codes and how far the users in same time can control who can gain access to the software codes of their equipment.
     
  5. Sandhi Yudha

    Sandhi Yudha Active Member

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    Last week a single CH-4 UAV arrived in Surabaya. Here some photos from various sources. On the background a naval NC212 is clearly visible.

    But i actually still wonder why a CH-4 has arrived while the TNI-AU has ordered the Wing Loong II.
    DEFENSE STUDIES: Chinese CH-4 UAV Arrives in Surabaya for Demonstration Flight

    20190831_10.jpg FB_IMG_1568103807676.jpg FB_IMG_1568103810651.jpg FB_IMG_1568103813583.jpg
     
  6. Ananda

    Ananda Well-Known Member

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    There's no definite contract yet on what TNI-AU order as MALE UAV. The Wing Loong being talked like as what TNI-AU ordered only by some local forumers based on what one comment in local media a 'senior' official.
    Thus like I said in several post, I only treat what circulated in local forums and media only as 'rumours' until there's definitive contract and time table of procurement.

    Local media and forums full of circulating info on procurement from Iver, F-16V, Chinooks,etc..including MALE UAV as already a done deal. That's why I only put in here, if the deal already in definite contract or already arrived or in manufacture process.

    After all in this administration, even the one being said already a 'done' deal by one minister can still put in hold by another one. Look at Su-35 saga.

    Back to this MALE UAV, this is still according to the article on 'trial' basis. So we still do not know which Chinese UAV or Turkish ones, or even local ones that's going to end up as MALE UAV for TNI.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 4:50 AM
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  7. Sandhi Yudha

    Sandhi Yudha Active Member

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    Sad but true....the Su-35 saga....looks like the acquisition process is stuck/on hold.
    A400M....i dont believe in that anymore.....
    Iver Huitfeldt-class? From the beginning it felt like the imagination of fanboys went out of control after an Indonesian delegation visited one of the ships.
    The Klewang Class stealth trimaran 63 meter patrol boats....thats also a hopeless project.
     
  8. Ananda

    Ananda Well-Known Member

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    Drone CH4 ditampilkan dalam latgab TNI "Dharma Yudha 2019"

    Edit:
    Change the article to Antara News Agency one. Well for me Antara is more reliable as source.
    Base on this CH-4B is not just in trial, but already choosen as TNI first MALE UAV. According to this the TNI Chief says they are going to procured at least 6 MALE UAV of CH-4B with capabilities to be armed (as UCAV).

    The trial of CH-4 at least if I interpreted the content, related to the combine operation of UAV with Manned Aircraft. In such the Chief in media told about using more network centric capabilities on this exercise. I still not found more concrete source on how far the network centric scope that's been using. Thus I can only assume the network centric more on to network /data coordination on ground control level and not between aircraft yet.

    Not much more additional info on whether this CH-4B will be the only MALE UAV or not, considering previously DI seems shown their preference on Turkish ANKA.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019 at 4:09 AM
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  9. Sandhi Yudha

    Sandhi Yudha Active Member

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    "I still not found more concrete source on how far the network centric scope that's been using. Thus I can only assume the network centric more on to network /data coordination on ground control level and not between aircraft yet."

    Yes, i also think it was between the UAV and the control center in Surabaya, not between the UAV and other aircrafts. It would also be impossible that the CH-4B is compatible with the different F-16 versions and the Su-27/-30, its not like the Su-57 linked with the Okhotnik UCAV.

    But it stays unclear to which two squadrons the 6 CH-4B will be added, maybe SkU51 will be one of these two?
     
  10. Ananda

    Ananda Well-Known Member

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    51st squadron is the only squadron in TNI-AU that's created as being specialist in UAV. There are some talking by TNI-AU on building at least 2 UAV specialist squadron, however until now seems 51st is the only UAV specialist squadron.

    Some talk in media and local forum on State Owned Electronics company (PT. LEN) in planning develop Indonesia 'owned' network protocol thus will enable Western source system to talk with non western source system. However as far as I know, even India with much larger IT based then Indonesia still not able to make "all" their various sources system to talk to each other directly.

    I believe for Indonesia condition it is easier for network centric to be done through one centralised center that handle all data traffic. I have real doubt we can make all TNI's asset wich came from various sources originations to talk each other directly.
    Unless we can get the original source code from each system.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019 at 10:46 AM