European Union, member states and Agencies

KipPotapych

Well-Known Member
^ Are there no parties other than right in Hungary? Why is far-right singled out? Wouldn’t it be more appropriate to say right (opposition), further right but not by that much (Orban), and even further right (far-right)? The strangest country.

As for the celebration and cheering, all is good and fine. However…

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Hungary is an autocratic democracy, but it is still a democracy. I doubt anyone serious had ever doubted that. I also doubt anyone serious doubts that it is still an autocratic democracy today. Where the new leadership leans is waiting for the historic evidence. For now, of course, congrats to Hungarians, but lets not get carried away for the time being. Especially as far the “Ukrainian hopefuls” are concerned.

I also find it funny how there is a lot of talk about the political meddling by the outer forces from one side or the other while it is quite obvious everyone and their mom participated in the said meddling.
 

SolarisKenzo

Well-Known Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #322
A topic that is very controversial but I think extremely important especially today.
I don't have a particular simpathy for "banning" and/or such measures in general, but it would be wrong to not aknowledge the problems of social medias.

After introducing age verification for most adult websites (mandatory in most member states) now social media will also be required to comply with the european age-verification measure.


This is part of a broader strategy, which consists in a gradual ban (or block) of adult websites (already operational) and social medias (ongoing).


Some member states are also introducing a total ban on social medias.


 

Meriv90

Active Member
If the effect of keeping the kids away from Social Media is surely positive, the origin is simple that Marketing with so many bots going around cannot give real KPI of their effectivness. Introducing a way to legaly check for Humans means giving back Marketing efficiency.

As mentioned bringing home a better uprising for kids, is good enought, but the origin is pretty much profit for the platforms.
 

Ikimieli

Member
European Union agenda is of course enlargement and expansion.

Security Guarantees that come from EU, and not NATO would centralize power in EU more, and make it more desirable to join for any European nations who are not members at the moment.

European own Army Stockpile, and any Military Force Projection also goes well with this agenda.

EU is cleverly using any kind of crisis as opportunities for centralizing power to European Parliament.

What they ultimately want, is most likely a similar system than in the United States. The opinion on European countries for this kind of development is rising all the time. As a small country and small people you feel more vulnerable, and might start to wish to become part of a world power. And trough EU, you already have mechanism for that. It is just a question how far people are willing to lose their independence as an individual sovereign country.

But many people are most likely thinking that would we be strong militarily, would we have a one big unit that defends us all and this kind. Also in economy, many might wish more centralized, larger companies that have bigger impact on world stage.

People are starting to maybe feel more European now. It all started with huge opposition on the populace, and now we have arrived to a situation, where many people are thinking this kind of things seriously.

Euro currency was a big obstacle for many too, but more and more join and seem to see an advantage for their currency to have a bigger impact on the world economy than their individual currency would have.

The reason why other areas cannot establish this kind of systems can be strange to many Europeans. And especially for the US people. Their global position is because they are United States. Separate individual states would never have arrived on this position they are now. With all the good and bad that it does them.


What the current US Administration is doing with their NATO threats, is a complete bluff. They would never want to leave NATO. It is their project, and their creation and they have created it for their own sake, not for anyone else. In the past, it was not on their advantage to let Soviet Union control, or conquer all of Europe and then start to establish their kind of system there for the European future. And then it is very much in their benefit, that whatever they are doing world wide, their Force Projection is backed by NATO.

Portraying NATO as only using US, and US never having any gains from NATO is quite much. All the things NATO means for the US as an institution would become very clear, would many of the countries leave it suddenly, and dissolve NATO entirely. For example, when changing to an European centralized platform, that wont include the US. That would also free Europe from any obligations that they have on participating in US wars.

All in all. Whatever this current government does, is quite outrageous. But you need to understand one thing. They are Real Estate people. They are really quite the different kind of people and rarely hold many good qualities. The Real Estate and Construction Industry as a whole, is full of this kind of people who are running the US Administration at the moment. And Governments all around the world have a lot of very influental people, who have aspirations in the real estate business. You can basically go investigate almost any construction company in any country, and you see this kind of people running them there. With similar methods and aspirations than the current US Government have.

People in Real Estate business are often very rude, corrupt, dishonest people with extreme greed and no care in the world for anything that they do to other people, or their environment. Most likely one of the most corrupt industries there is, if not even the most corrupt.

You can for example see, what German Government is doing now. The moment they gain power, they immediately take loan restrictions away, start to take a lot of government loans, and pump it on Infrastructure Projects. What will the German people gain from it, is most likely next to nothing. If not even negative aspects in life. And these same patterns happens everywhere. They will wreck the public economy on purpose, and privatize all of the money trough private construction companies. Very often, the purpose is not to build anything, but to create a narrative to generate costs, which will then be paid with public funding, or at least by someone else than them.

You can see this also on how they think on European Defense. The moment they start to gain more funding, what do they do with it ? Channel hundreds of billions of public money to infrastructure projects within the central Europe. Wrecking good infrastructure that have nothing wrong in it, and building it again on some kind of Military Narrative they for most certainly, will never benefit at all. Some of those projects might be of use, but most of them most likely is not, and the whole reason they start to build them is not Military Effectiveness, but to generate a reason to channel that money to some privileged Private Citizens trough Private Construction Companies.


This is very similar on how they think the Weapon Production as well. It seems like no one of them is worried for real, and the whole military industry is only seen as a narrative to pump public money to some private citizens trough the weapons companies.


There is lots of this. But in Real Estate business, it seems to always be like this. So you let them run a country, this is what they do. They will rob the whole country and start to generate a lot of hate with their behaviour.


So is the priority Military Efficiency ? No.

Is the priority to acquire effective Military Equipment ? No.

Do they want to privatize as much public money as possible by any given narrative. Yes.

That is the priority. Or at least seems like.

So are they worried for their, or their national security. No.
 
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KipPotapych

Well-Known Member
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It’s funny how the “European family” expands and contracts based on political agenda. Really weird stuff. Saw a headline that now Slovakia is planning to block the “loan” (did not read the article though). Bulgaria is out of the family as well, I am assuming. All are equal but some are not as equal as the others, it appears.

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VDL went all nuts in with the European continent again:

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Hard to even guess what she is rumbling about. Is she implying that there should be no Russian influence in Russia and no Turkish influence in Turkey? Are these people as dumb as they appear or is it just a mirage?

Bonus:

Kajaq Kallas Considers Israel’s Expulsion from Eurovision a “Mistaken” Measure

EU to cut Venice Biennale funding over Russia’s participation, Kallas says

Another bonus:

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SolarisKenzo

Well-Known Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #326
Bulgaria's Radev is a fake anti-EU guy.

He's been President of Bulgaria (before running for Prime Minister) from 2017 to last january, giving his approval to most of EU initiatives and finally even allowing the Government to adopt the euro as Bulgaria's currency.
 

Ikimieli

Member
Russia lost a lot of their influence after attack on Ukraine.

Private citizens never even knew there is anything going in Ukraine, it had next to zero media cover and people were not interested in the slightest. Annexation of Crimea did not also interest anyone and did not basically affect peoples opinion on Russia.

Russian influence on Europe have probably never been lower than now. The media campaings they have had on Ukraine issue are so successful, that Russia is not very popular now in Europe.

US have lost its influence too, because of their current Administration and what they do and say, and how it is in formed in the Europe.

Pro-EU stance is growing among the European populace, and EU have never been this popular. First, US became very popular under Joe Biden because Russia lost its Influence because of what they do in Ukraine. Now US lost its influence and a lot of people are pro-EU.

When a person joins the European Parliament or any EU institute, they are pledging loyalty, and to advance the EU agenda. Not their national agendas. That is the purpose at least. EU is an institution that is outside of national governace, and as an institution, aims to grow in power. Of course many EU representatives have national agendas still. But this is all public information they state openly. That they demand loyalty to EU from their representatives over National loyalties. And that they aim to Expand. The newest additions will probably be Albania and Montenegro. North Macedonia wants in also but Greek is not letting them in, as you need the approval of all member countries. They have issue about their name, when Greek see Macedonia as their national heritage, and demand them to take the name Macedonia out of their country name. And North Macedonia will not, so they cannot join until this issue is resolved. Other than that, North Macedonia could be in already.

As for Euro, the more the member nations wreck their public economy, the more they are going to lose the independence on their economic policies because they do not control the central bank, but it is an EU institute instead. So the moment your public finances is seen as too bad, they have legal obligation to rein you in, and then you lose some of financial independence, which happened to Greek or example. The EU as an institute, and some pro-EU politicans within the countries might even want to see this happen. It centralizes power to EU over the national governments. Trough economic crisis you can centralize the power and this security situation is a fine addition too. Trough crisis EU as an institute, grows in influence and power, and trough hostile actions of other influental outside actors like Russia and US, their influence grows even more.

Georgia of course wants in, but its not much in the European area in the same way than others. Because they are expansionist, they have funded for a long time now some kind of support fund for Turkey membership transformation, but Turkey just takes the money in and is really not compatible with EU system and how i understand, is not even planning to be. They just want the transformation funding, but never plan to transfer, at least not this generation or maybe even the next. But for some reason they want Turkey in, which would seem rather a strange thought would they actually be a EU member country.


In case of Russia, there is not only the Russian influence on other areas. But other area influence on Russia as well. For example, i believe US have influenced Russian politics a lot. Russia started as a socialist or communist state under Soviet Union, but they have made a turn towards capitalism. Maybe on the influence of US. They started to privatize all of their national resources, privatized basically all of their oil infrastructure and so on with their "international partners" they later kicked out to nationalize most of them. The birth of Oligarchs came from the privatization, that they implemented in inside dealings for certain individuals, and then those individuals started to move away from Russia and spend their money elsewhere. The people were starting to want western products instead of Russian products, and Russian products have never been popular in Europe for example. Russian people used to come to Europe, and buy a lot of stuff because they like the European products more. So the western countries, EU and US had started to gain lots of influence in Russia. The situation might have now changed.

But i do understand, that US have affected Russia very strongly. And their capitalistic aspirations, privatization policies and so, are an appeasement to US and some kind of purpose to become a society that embraced the western capitalism. Russia after Soviet Union, have embraced capitalism very strongly, and that influence most likely does not come entirely from or within Russia. They have later tuned it down a bit, but it is still a capitalist system even now.

The modern Russians are capitalists. And their government is very capitalistic. Their origin is different. So also Russia have transformed. Probably more than US or EU. The one that have changed might be Russia, not the other way around. And Russia most likely is influenced way more by western countries than the other way around.

Russia understood very fast, that capitalism does not serve their interest. Because privatization leans to capital flight, their culture and products are not strong enough to compete with western ones and so on. They only deal with raw materials and for some reason, never succeed on producing anything that anyone want, other than raw materials and weapons. And the main selling point on weapons after the Soviet era have been that they are cheaper. Nowdays, they have a lot of more competition on their price point than in the past. In Soviet Era, there were basically two providers, US and Soviet Union, and the Soviet Union equipment was not necessarily worse, sometimes even better and more advanced. Now they have to compete with India, Turkey, China and so on. And more are coming, like Brazil, South Africa, North Korea and so on when they advance on technology. It also means, they lose these markets that in the past, bought from them. And China itself is maybe more advanced now than Russia and they are at the same price point, so people buy from there. Russia is losing big in one of their most important markets and no one ever even heard of other Russia products. So capitalism might not suit Russia well.

I do not know, how popular is the thought to join EU within Russian people ?

They at least have very similar system, and would be easy to transform to a member country if not taken in to account their military aggression and domestic militia type of aggression against their own populace, and political oppression of the opposition. Everyone does this in the EU, but there are rules on the way of doing it which Russia does not upheld. Suppressing any possible political opposition is of course the very first thing you want to do, but Russia methods on doing so are too open, direct and extreme for the EU. But the problem in that would be that no one wants them in anymore. In the past, many would have. Its a miracle if even 1 or 2 member countries would vote for Russian membership in the EU for many generations to come.

But would EU membership be good on Russia ? Maybe no. Because no one wants their product and they would need to open their market on stronger products, and their populace would learn to buy European, and not Russian products. Sanctions helped in this, but the populace still smuggle western products in because they want them very badly. They are seen as better, and people want them. If they are not better, at least they are marketed so, that people want them still.

Stronger culture and stronger product wins in open capitalism. Closed market and socialism, or communist type of system is better for those with weaker end products. And if you mostly sell raw materials, there is little reason to open your market. You only lose in doing so. And you cannot become a EU member without opening your market and establishing a free trade zone with other members.

The roots in Europe are socialistic, and many countries in the EU are very sosialistic on their ideologies even now. US have for decades tried to shift this towards capitalism, but many countries hold socialist systems and socialist political parties are very popular in many European countries. Some of them might even be more socialistic than Russia, and Russia might be leaning more towards capitalism than some of the EU member countries. So Socialism is not a problem on EU membership, almost all of the countries have strong Socialist support base already. In the US, they have none and they are pure capitalists. Most likely the only country in the world that is and a very successful one at that.

So the strange thing in this is, that if Russia or Soviet Union have wanted a more socialistic Europe. They forsake it, and turned to capitalism themself. So how can they influence others to become more socialistic, when they turn to capitalism themself ?

Even China is embracing Capitalism, but they are doing it in a way, that the US wont like. They want others to open their market to China, but want to more or less close their market for others. This is i believe, one of the things that the US is alarmed now. They want to start closing their markets for others at the same time, than trying to enforce markets for themself. But in my opinion, they are doing bad job on it, and will not achieve what they want in these methods that they use: Coercion, Blackmail and this kind. It will generate a response, and their influence and market pull will actually become lower.
 
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Ikimieli

Member
On Regarding for the Future of Europe, what i, and many others think they should aim for:

1. They would need to start their own domestic military industry chains. And they have started to do just this. This is all because of the current US Administration but many have wanted this even now. Some countries still have their military companies in government control, and ownership like in the socialist system you should. Some people do not like selling their military companies to foreign buyers. And some that have done so, might want to think about nationalizing them. Fully European owned, fully European produced, fully European Military supply, logistics and production chain. The way they do in Socialism, is more robust, than selling your strategic assets like Military Industry to foreign ownership. Last time i checked, in places like France and Italy the National Ownership of their Military Production is something like 1/3. In Poland its 100%. In Finland it was also 100% but since 2014 the Government Ownership from Patria dropped to 50,1% because they sold 49,9% of its stock to Koningsberg, which is also 50,001% Norway Government owned. So both of the companies are still at least Government Controlled, which you should have. But even in economical perspective, if you order military hardware, which are very expensive from a company you own yourself, all the revenue goes back to you and is available to be used on a new order. You order again and again and again when you own the company 100%, and the same money circulates in the system. There are no one outside the government to gain revenue, you only pay the salaries of workers and the maintenance of the factories and facilities. And if you control the raw material production as well, and have domestic ownership, it is very robust instead of a situation, where the majority ownership is foreign based, and the revenue is leaking outside your system, and thus cannot be used to order again. There is no surer way to bankrupt your country, than start to order military equipment endlessly from foreign suppliers. If your Government own and control it 100% this cannot happen. The reason why they have sold their Military Industries is probably, because they never thought they are needed anymore. That the whole security situation is so good, that the military industry is only a remnant of the past and if someone is stupid enough to invest in them, then let them. But how it turns out, their perspective have changed and the ones who kept their Military Industry 100% domestic owned, are happy that they did. And the ones that did not, are most likely thinking about Nationalizing them.

2. They would need to produce their own Information Technology and Surveillance infrastructure that is fully domestic, and in their own control. And especially transform away from Windows dependency with for example, something like domestic EuroSys that all of the public agencies and services, and the army use instead of the US systems. It is strange how they have used Windows based infrastructure when it is clear, that for a long time now, they have had their own alternatives as well, like Linux. Whose creator by the way, was how i am informed, contacted by some US agencies to install backdoors for them on the distributed system.

3. They should need to aim for Energy Independent and away from Fossil Fuel imports. This have also been clear for a long time, but they have their own interests in companies like Shell, BP and so on so even they wont have much of the resource in their area, they do control some production outside Europe. I think BP even controls some oil fields in the sovereign US territory. And then some big ones in Iraq.

4. They should produce their own Space Technology and Space Applications. Which they have started to do now.

5. Continue expanding, taking in more member countries. And then for example, try to undermine the Russian influence on White Russia, and keep in sights for them as a potential future member country. For example, not in the near future, but the generations yet to come. And the same for Serbia, Bosnia Herzegovina and so, as a potential member country for the future. And then try to give reason for UK to join back, and for Norway to join in.

And this kind.

In this way you can strengthen the EU supply chain, stop dependancies on other areas, and strengthen your market pull. US will lose in this in the long run, because they will lose the EU IT, Military, Energy markets and so would they do what is mentioned. People have start to want Strategic Independence, and it is a hot topic now among the world because of the sudden changes in the US policies. So people do not want to be so dependant on them anymore. They want their own supply chains. And then for example, once you have your own IT infrastructure up and running, you become their competitor on international level and other US export markets like Canada or even Japan might start thinking about switching to European Systems in Military, Information Techonology and so. Or even produce their own. In both countries, in Canada and Japan they are also speaking about getting rid of the US dependancies, and wanting to establish their own domestic supply chains. And in case of Japan, they are aiming to become the US competitors on international Weapons Exports. So in the future, i believe, not only Russia loses weapon export markets. Also US will lose when places like Japan and Europe will start to compete with them instead of being their customers.

The same thing than what is happening on Arms Industry, that there is more competition when in the past, there were basically 2 importers is probably going to happen in the IT infrastructure too. When there is now basically only one supplier. Then in the future, there might be many and the areas which were once your customer, become your competitor on the international level.


These goals should be maintained, even the Administration in the US changes, and their policies would change.

Strategic Independence and Energy Independence can only strengthen an area. And generate more civilian, cultural, and commercial pull.


So do you really want the US to control your IT Infrastructure, Surveillance Infrastructure, Security and Military Supply Chain ?

It is for most surely what they want. But is it what you want, if you would have domestic alternatives as well ?

And how is it Military Efficiency, if your logistic supply chain comes from another continent entirely ?


There is also a lot of lost opportunities in this. For example, would Europe made their own IT infrastructure instead of using the US one, they would now have it up and running, and had for long time already. And could for example, offer it to any areas that would now want to switch away from the US. But because they have not done this, they do not have a product to sell, but are only thinking about establishing their own systems.

Canada for example, would most likely switch away from US systems would you have a solid product to sell them now. As would maybe many countries in at least Latin or Central America.

Then, there is lost opportunities in Military Production as well. Would Europe have strengthened their production capacity even in 2022, they would be in much stronger position economically now, because they would be not so dependant on US imports on military matters.

There is lost opportunities in Energy as well, and the so called "energy crisises" might have been avoided entirely with more robust Energy Politics that favor Domestic Energy chains. And again, they would have not been so dependant on foreign imports.

Lots of bad choises in the past there for Europe. Choosing to be dependant on foreign imports too much, and being too lazy to establish or maintain their own infrastructure or production.

The biggest lost opportunity is probably the Information Technology, and especially the operating systems and similar platforms. There would have been strong potential for it from Europe trough Linux in the past, but all that potential was basically lost and not capitalized on.

In all of this, Europe is very late. And could have all of the mentioned up and running for 10 or 20 years already. There is no real reason or obstacles for it. Only a decision to establish your own infrastructure on your own area and all the necessary capabilities to achieve this have already been there for long time now, only waiting to be used or utilized.
 
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