Will Brahmos Supersonic Anti Ship Missile alters the balance ?

[Su_37]

India and Russian joit effort had produced the Brahmos, supersonic Antiship misslie will alter the future course of naval power ?

It has range of 300Km and 200 kg of warhead , it will nuturalize nay surface ship in the entire region from east to west and their is no defence avaliable again it.

India should now invest more then in it subs then surface ship becasue all surface ships can any country can be taken out one single min.

I think this will alter the balance of power when it will induct into indian Neavy in 2004.

Lsiten Mr Oqaab , put your glasses on , i havn't take any country name , and talking about balance, "balance will alter from east to west". and if you aware ,, and one more thing ,, start thinking board... not narrow.. and watch your brothers before pointing finger on me ,,, i know ,, you people watch your house before saying anything to me ...........

If this is PRO group then tell me that i can write to another forum where people are really broad minded and educated ,,, i am talking about other defence forums ,,, and you can have your PRO forum .. as usual ...


Warning, No more crap!!! Either follow the rules of the forum and have a peaceful discussion or go and flame in ur PRO forums.

Oqaab

 

[corsair7772]

It definitely will. Its a good missile and we dont have much 2 counter it.

 

[Awang se]

Speed and stealth, formidable combination.

 

[corsair7772]

U 4got 2 mention its got a 250kg warhead.

 

[Su_37]

Well as per my knowledge it has 200Kg of warhead for more then 300KM range .......But i will try to find more about its warhead ....

thanks fro informing me ,....

 

[corsair7772]

No problemo bro. While ur at it cud u tell me how bad it wud be if the Indians arm their subs and Stealth Frigs with this Misile and wether their gonna fit sum aircraft with it?

 

[umair]

No problemo bro. While ur at it cud u tell me how bad it wud be if the Indians arm their subs and Stealth Frigs with this Misile and wether their gonna fit sum aircraft with it?

Realy BAD! I mean with the Brahmos in service our ships would be pretty vulnerable.Option available : get inflight refuelers extend the range of and numerical strength of the PAF's anti ship squadrons so that they can hit the Indian navy before it hits us.

 

[Awang se]

Do they have submarine launch versions?

 

[gf0012-aust]

The Brahmos can carry a conventional warhead of up to 300 kg.

If you consider the fact that India has acquired some russian airborne, naval, submarine missile systems. the associated military technologies to interface with these systems, their own theatre tactical rockets, dual-capable ballistic and cruise missile systems then they do have a capability to adapt this to a sub launched solution

There will be dimension issues if the concept is to be adapted to a torpedo launch system, vlaunch capability will only be possible if they integrate these into a boomer platform.

Indias access to the SS-NX-27 family which are hybrid cruise and ballistic missiles means that they have the technology to build a sub launched solution. Their increasing relationship with Israeli may also provide technical opportunities to share missile technology solutions

 

[gf0012-aust]

Just to qualify my comments on the Brahmos being sub launched.

I cannot see (in its current iteration) how the Brahmos can be sub launched.

As an air launched missile the ramjet is picking up "ignition" from momentum. That means that to fire it from a static platform will require a booster to get it to an engine trigger speed.

Thats ok for a surface platform, it will be inherently more difficult for a sub launch, be it vlaunch or torpedo (eg subroc)

To launch it underwater will require a change to the head of the missile. it will also require a booster, it will also require a vlaunch cannister that operates the same as an ICBM launcher in a "boomer". Ie , the missile would need to be capped, the booster would have to be ejected with an air bubble and the booster would have to give sufficient accelaration to ignite the Ramjet.

Its more or less an underwater version of a US Talos missile.

On the basis of its current design (as in available photos) then it would appear to be a long time before it is available.

The other method is a torpedo launch (similar to SUBROC). The issues are similar in that the booster has to be ejected from a torpedo tube, the booster must work underwater and then rise to the top under its own power to break the surface, and then get sufficient speed to trigger the engine.

If the missile isn't tube or vlaunched, then the only other option is to cannister launch when the sub is on the surface. (Much like a Regulus).
If thats the case, then you have a noisy submarine as well, even streamlining the cannister will change the noise profile of the sub making it easier to detect when its under way.

 

[Awang se]

What if we put some explosive device at the base of the canister. when a quarter length of the canister is already out of the water, the explosive bolt will eject the nose cover and this base explosive charge then explode to give the missile a little boost out of the water before the rocket booster phase and then the missile own engine phase. what i mean is in the Vlaunch.

 

[gf0012-aust]

What if we put some explosive device at the base of the canister. when a quarter length of the canister is already out of the water, the explosive bolt will eject the nose cover and this base explosive charge then explode to give the missile a little boost out of the water before the rocket booster phase and then the missile own engine phase. what i mean is in the Vlaunch.

Nope, sub launched missiles are ejected with a "bubble" of water, very similar to the principle of a torpedo launch. You can't add a shaped charge to a cannister.

The main problem (as i see it) is that you can eject the missile, but its the 1st stage that needs to trigger the ramjet.

This has been done with an ICBM, but a tomahawk sized missile is a whole different ball game, especially when the 2nd stage (which in an air launch is the primary stage) is a ramjet.

There are more processes and problems to consider when vlaunching an airbreathing missile from under water. eg the ramjet protective cone needs to be discharged prior to the booster separating.

India would have been better off with a boomer launching MRBM's or SRBM's
Existing technology etc etc......

 

[corsair7772]

The Brahmos is actually just 2 gain experience with SSMs and all. But it is still a formidable missile. Range,speed and warhead. And we dont have proper gun and EW systems 2 counter them

 

[gf0012-aust]

The Brahmos is actually just 2 gain experience with SSMs and all. But it is still a formidable missile. Range,speed and warhead. And we dont have proper gun and EW systems 2 counter them

No you don't. That requires a number of things:

Infra red Sat detection capability to detect launches
AWACs and a Phased Array airborne monitoring capability
Integrated and overlapping progressive air defense systems
24 hour airborne AWACs capability coupled with "online" protection (eg a rotating CAP presence)

 

[corsair7772]

I didnt mean detection i meant downing the missile approaching the ship.

 

[gf0012-aust]

I didnt mean detection i meant downing the missile approaching the ship.

Corsair777, you need at least a semblance of what I posted to detect a supersonic incoming threat.

Killing it is made harder without the infrastructure to give you prior warning of the threat.

Selecting overlapping point defense systems are the easiest part of the equation.

Detecting the threat, progressively escalating the threat defense levels and then saturating the threat is only possible with the right equipment

 

[corsair7772]

No No amigo i know how important it is to have a detection capability but i only talked abt how imp it is 2 have kill systems 2.

Anyway, does the Brahmos have any export potential? I think Malaysia was interested but correct me if im wrong.

 

[gf0012-aust]

No No amigo i know how important it is to have a detection capability but i only talked abt how imp it is 2 have kill systems 2.

Anyway, does the Brahmos have any export potential? I think Malaysia was interested but correct me if im wrong.

Yes, you can kill it, but at this stage there are not too many weapons that could with a degree of confidence.

I'd say it does have export potential. I would assume that the chinese would be interested. Since GW1 and the last Iraqi conflict china realises that it must undergo rapid force transformation.

intelligent hypervelocity weapons are the next generation about to evolve.

 

[HAWK]

I dont think hina will have it. It is an Indo-Russain JV and as such, I dont think the Indians would take too kindly to Chinese interest in this missile.

 

[gf0012-aust]

I dont think hina will have it. It is an Indo-Russain JV and as such, I dont think the Indians would take too kindly to Chinese interest in this missile.

Yes, thats true enough, except India and China are already buying similar Russian platforms.

The Russians will sell to the highest bidder - they need the cash as their economy is in a mess.