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Old February 14th, 2017   #1
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German Navy

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Old February 14th, 2017   #2
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op-ed from gcaptain

Germany to Buy Six MKS Multi-Role Warships - Ministry – gCaptain
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Old February 14th, 2017   #3
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and a brave move.... (from a governance and oversight perspective?)

Germany to Skip Tender for 1.5 Billion Euro Warship Purchase – gCaptain
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Old February 16th, 2017   #4
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That adds up to six MKS-180 (F126?), four F125, three F124 & 10 K130/K131.
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Old February 16th, 2017   #5
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That adds up to six MKS-180 (F126?), four F125, three F124 & 10 K130/K131.
Not to mention the 8 submarines they plan to have by 2030.. Quickly going from a respectable small navy to one decent sized tough one.
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Old February 19th, 2017   #6
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and a brave move.... (from a governance and oversight perspective?)

Germany to Skip Tender for 1.5 Billion Euro Warship Purchase – gCaptain
Then again how much better off would Australia be if we had done similar and simply ordered an evolved FFG-7 instead of the ANZACs, or a second batch of AWDs without mucking around with long procurements? The FFGs are cheaper to sustain than the ANZACs while delivering greater capability and reportedly greater survivability and I can't help but wonder if we went straight from Newcastle to an evolved but still very similar ship if they could have been bought for the same price or less than an ANZAC.

Same with F100 now, we are going for a build of three DDGs, to two OPVs after running down the workforce, then will move to what may be a version of the DDGs they just completed, would it not have been cheaper and more sensible to get the AWD Alliance to simply quote and a second batch of ships while the teaming, work force and supply chain were still in place. The government knows how much the first ships cost, they know how much cheaper the second repeat was, it's not rocket science to calculate a fair price for a new batch with specified upgrades, etc.
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Old February 20th, 2017   #7
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It looks like the navy was nearly as surprised as the public with all the anouncements of additional ships. It's also interesting with the recent shift back to a focus on conventional warfare in the east. The navy plays second fiddle compared to the army and air force in such an event.

But they are happy to grab the chance. Manning will be difficult though.
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Old February 24th, 2017   #8
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Not to mention the 8 submarines they plan to have by 2030.. Quickly going from a respectable small navy to one decent sized tough one.
The additional 2 submarines are being fasttracked. They were originally announced for 2030 but will now be procured faster as part of a joint German-Norwegian submarine procurement contract.

If we want to be technical, the force multipliers are more important though. Three A702 AORs plus two A704 AOs (to be replaced around 2021, also new contract), six A404 multipurpose tenders and the three A423 surveillance ships (also up for a replacement contract that no one talks about yet). Plus the recently new rights to use the Dutch Karel Doorman JSS (which isn't just a "renting space" agreement - the navy is setting up a 70-man support unit for this) and the sealift ship flotilla set up with Denmark (including purpose-built Ark Germania and Ark Danica).

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The navy plays second fiddle compared to the army and air force in such an event.
And compared to CIR, the newest service of the Bundeswehr that is planned to have as many soldiers as the navy in five years. At least if it goes as currently envisioned.
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Old April 2nd, 2017   #9
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and a brave move.... (from a governance and oversight perspective?)
Contract for those additional K130 should be negotiated within the next two weeks. And will likely amount to €2 billion instead of €1.5 billion.
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Old April 17th, 2017   #10
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First offer by TKMS on the contract for K130 has been rejected by the government as too pricey.

Assumption is that since Privinvest, the Lebanese owners of GNYK, are trying to fight the fact that a tender process was skipped the government does not want to hand TKMS much more than on the agreed budget (the 1.5 billion) to preclude people pointing out that a GNYK offer - and hence an open tender - could be considerably cheaper.
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Old April 19th, 2017   #11
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The German frigate FGS Brandenburg ran aground whilst departing the Greek port of Piraeus. There appears to be to her rudders and propellers. She is at the Greek Naval base in Salamis undergoing damage assessment.
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Old April 19th, 2017   #12
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Got to stop one liners, no?
One liners by newbies are not acceptable. When a Mod or a senior member starts a thread, as in this case, with a one liner it is generally for an obvious reason.
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Old April 19th, 2017
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Old June 23rd, 2017   #13
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Contract for those additional K130 should be negotiated within the next two weeks. And will likely amount to €2 billion instead of €1.5 billion.
Funding for the five additional K130 corvettes was signed off by the budget committee on wednesday.

End price per ship is 398 million Euro plus 94 million worth in equipment that the Bundeswehr will contribute for re-use (e.g. RAM launchers, guns etc).

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Not to mention the 8 submarines they plan to have by 2030..
Budget committee also got an information package that wednesday on the planned U212CD procurement. Planned cost on the German side is 1.85 billion Euro, although - within the "cooperation package" - that also includes procurement of NSM missiles for 17 ships. Construction funding for the submarines will be requested from the committee in 2019, first delivery planned in 2027.
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Old June 23rd, 2017   #14
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A question on the F-123 Brandenburgs.

Does anyone know what length VLS they have, i.e. point defence, tactical, or strategic, and also l noticed in photos there appears to be space for another two eight cell modules forward of the current pair for a total of 32 cells, is this the case?

I am curious as I recall the F-123 being discussed as a possible successor to the Perth Class DDG and the original for Adelaide Class FFGs during the mid 90s as the ANZAC, even stretched, was realised not to be suitable for the role. I also wondered if the design could have been adapted to a mix of SM- 2 and NSS/ESSM, as well as Harpoon canisters to suit the RAN. Obviously these discussions were before the FFGUP and AWD plans.
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Old June 23rd, 2017   #15
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They're ASW frigates built for Sea Sparrow, replaced by ESSM. I doubt if they have more than self-defence length.
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