Comparing PLAN to Indian Navy

powerslavenegi

New Member
aaaditya said:
hdw has been cleared of all charges,as far as the s1000 is concerned ,it is to be based on the amur design ,but will be fully modular and mission adaptable in construction and would be available in different displacements.
Yeah legally I guess,However I see the deal going to the Russians for In is very particular about Brahmos SSAshm to be integrated to it's Submarines,specially when Scorpenes will be armed with ordinary Exocets.
 

tphuang

Super Moderator
powerslavenegi said:
Yeah legally I guess,However I see the deal going to the Russians for In is very particular about Brahmos SSAshm to be integrated to it's Submarines,specially when Scorpenes will be armed with ordinary Exocets.
The Exocets are not bad missiles. Especially the latest batch of them. They are also proven.
 

Big-E

Banned Member
tphuang said:
The Exocets are not bad missiles. Especially the latest batch of them. They are also proven.
What would REALLY be nice, if India could domestically improve her Brahmos to match the longer range of the Russian version to get around ToT pitfalls. That would be one **** of an AShM.
 

aaaditya

New Member
Big-E said:
What would REALLY be nice, if India could domestically improve her Brahmos to match the longer range of the Russian version to get around ToT pitfalls. That would be one **** of an AShM.
according to dr sivathanu pillai the director of the brahmos corporation india is developing the brahmos2 missile ,this missile is claimed to have a range of 1000kms and a speed of mach8-10,however i think that this missile would be too heavy to used as an airborne missile system and would be available only in submarine and land launched versions.
 

kams

New Member
aaaditya said:
according to dr sivathanu pillai the director of the brahmos corporation india is developing the brahmos2 missile ,this missile is claimed to have a range of 1000kms and a speed of mach8-10,however i think that this missile would be too heavy to used as an airborne missile system and would be available only in submarine and land launched versions.
AAditya, Mach8-10 missile is long way off and it's not Pillai who said it but a unnamed scientist of Brahmos corp. Hypersonic missile will require Scramjet and the technology is still developing. I know about reports of DRDO carrying out ground test of a model but we don't have the tunnel to carry out the further tests. Please leave out the hypersonic stuff.
 

aaaditya

New Member
kams said:
AAditya, Mach8-10 missile is long way off and it's not Pillai who said it but a unnamed scientist of Brahmos corp. Hypersonic missile will require Scramjet and the technology is still developing. I know about reports of DRDO carrying out ground test of a model but we don't have the tunnel to carry out the further tests. Please leave out the hypersonic stuff.
nal has a the computer simulation software for hypersonic testing while the isro has both the software and a wind tunnel.
 

kams

New Member
aaaditya said:
nal has a the computer simulation software for hypersonic testing while the isro has both the software and a wind tunnel.
ISRO does not have a wind tunnel to test full scale model.
 

zoolander

New Member
I strongly doubt that India with a minusclue defence budget and a fedgling missile industry can beat the americans, EU, russians and the chinese to a hypersonic missile. It just dont seem probable. The concept might be there but paper and material form is a big difference.
 

kams

New Member
zoolander said:
I strongly doubt that India with a minusclue defence budget and a fedgling missile industry can beat the americans, EU, russians and the chinese to a hypersonic missile. It just dont seem probable. The concept might be there but paper and material form is a big difference.
Well Indian hypersonic project is more than a paper concept, but its not a high priority project. Limited model testing were carried out you may find some details if you google. One will not see anything come out of it for next 15 years. Thats what I meant in my reply to aaditya. The focus is on increasing the range of Brahmos, not Speed:)
 

aaaditya

New Member
well the scramjet engine has been ground tested ,the prototype is to be tested late next year,it would be launched by a rocket(as a payload),would perform experimants and would return back on its own power.there are two versions under development the avatar for the isro and the hstv for the drdo(i have already posted the image of the hstv design on this forum).
 

qwerty223

New Member
Thought this might help for the topic...:)
China launches Russianised Jiangkai-class frigate

By Yihong Chang JDW Correspondent
Hong Kong

Huangpu shipyard launched the Chinese People's Liberation Army Navy's (PLAN's) third Type 054 Jiangkai-class frigate on 30 September, a modified 'Russianised' version of the class known as the Type 054A.

The Guangzhou-based shipyard has started outfitting the ship with the Russian Mineral-ME (NATO: 'Band Stand') radar system, a Fregat M2EM ('Top Plate') search radar and two MR90 Orekh ('Front Dome') targeting radars. As a result, the new frigate has much stronger Russian characteristics than its earlier sister ships.

Both Mineral-ME1 active and Mineral-ME2 passive radars have been fitted to the ship to provide target designation for the YJ-83 'Saccade' anti-ship missile. Mineral-ME1 works in I-band and is capable of simultaneously tracking 30 targets out to 250 km, while ME2 can track 50 targets working across I, G, E, F, and D-bands up to 450 km. With the targeting function engaged, the system can work up firing solutions for 10 different targets.

137 of 340 words
© 2006 Jane's Information Group
[End of non-subscriber extract]
Anyone whom subscribe for Jane's could share us technical speculations which are missing here?:)
 

contedicavour

New Member
since it incorporates russian radars, could this mean a russian SAM too. what is the range for the yj-83?
Jane's prints that YJ-83 / CSS-N-8 Saccade SSMs have a range of 160km and a speed of Mach 0.9, warhead 165kg, sea skimmers.
These missiles are on the 051C, 052B and 051B destroyers, though there is a higher performance SSM on the 052C, the YJ-62 with 280km range and 300kg warhead.

cheers
 

tphuang

Super Moderator
since it incorporates russian radars, could this mean a russian SAM too. what is the range for the yj-83?
My opinion is that most of that article is incorrect. It is written by Yihong Chang, aka, Pinkov from Kanwa.

the top plate look-alike radar is not top plate and the one that look like bandstand is not bandstand either. Not sure about the Orekh radar, that's probably the only thing Russian on the ship.
 

aaaditya

New Member
well here is an update of the indian navy's additions over the next 10 years .

according to the indian naval chief sureesh mehta ,india would be commissioning 8 more destroyers ,8 more frigates,6 submarines,12 corvettes and 1 aircraft carrier ,in the years to come.

i believe these will be in the following order from 2010-2015:

8 p15a stealth missile destroyers(multirole).

5 p17a stealth frigates and 3 additional project1135.6 krivack class of stealth frigates(multirole).

12 indigenously designed p28 class of stealth corvettes(multirole but with greater emphasis on anti submarine warfare).

6 scorpene submarines

1 admiral gorshkov (aircraft carrier).

these are capital ships .

indian navy would also be commissioning a number of secondary warships:

1 austin class of amphibious vessel (the uss trenton).

8 mine counter measure vessels (most probably based on the italian or us design).

2 super dvora mark2 fast attack gun crafts.

3 landing ship tanks large(already launched).

of these currently 1 destroyer,3 frigates,1 corvette and 3 lst(l) are already in construction(i havent included the indigenous aircraft carrier and nuclear attack submarine ,since i do not expect them to be operational by 2010).

indians are also researching on foil based catamarans(the foilcat2000) and surface effect ships and uuv's(prototypes of all three have been tested).

added to these indian navy would be acquiring 6 sikorsky helicopters for the trenton,upto 16 surveillance helicopters (as a replacement for the sea kings),8 maritime patrol aircrafts(i personally believe that boeing p8i will be selected),upto 40 mig29k's,advanced light heliciopter dhruvs,and advanced jet trainers (indian navy is interested in the t45 goshawk) and the indian navy is also expected atleast 3 more squadron of uav's (most probably the herons).

added to this the indian coast guard would be inducting 2 sankalp class of extra large patrol vessels,and 3 pollution control vessels.

i believe these new additions along with the existing naval vessels would considerably enhance the security of the indian ocean region.

besides these 30 more warships are awaiting approval (provisional approval has been granted by the governement ,but final approval is still awaited) as part of the second tier of upgradation.
 

wp2000

Member
Apparently not, the SAM is a HQ-7 CSA-N-4 local copy of French Crotale, with 13km range and speed of Mach 2.4

cheers
HQ7 is used on 054.

This is 054A, which uses VLS HQ16. If you have access to Kanwa, which is the real author of the article, you should see.

Last week, the third 054A ship's picture is available.
 

contedicavour

New Member
My opinion is that most of that article is incorrect. It is written by Yihong Chang, aka, Pinkov from Kanwa.

the top plate look-alike radar is not top plate and the one that look like bandstand is not bandstand either. Not sure about the Orekh radar, that's probably the only thing Russian on the ship.
How come JDW relies so much on a source which is apparently not reliable ? I'm surprised, for European or American data JDW is extremely reliable.

cheers
 

wp2000

Member
How come JDW relies so much on a source which is apparently not reliable ? I'm surprised, for European or American data JDW is extremely reliable.

cheers
It's better than nothing, isn't it. If they don't use Kanwa, they probably don't even know China is building a new friget.

If you look at the 054A model or the real ship, there should be 4 Orekh radars, but Janes/Kanwa said there are 2 Orekh radars.:confused: Well, at least that's better than 0.
 
Top