No-fly zone over Libya

G

Grand Danois

Entertainer
kato said:
There aren't any Reapers in the theater, and it's unlikely any would be diverted from other theaters. There's a whole wing of Global Hawks at Sigonella though. Gotta use them for something.

As for the cruise missiles, the US just pretty much lobbed off about one-third of the CM arsenal they have in-theater. Also, btw, local radio here in Germany claimed earlier that "British ships" fired missiles too. Any British subs down there?
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UK DOD says a Trafalgar class sub fired Tomahawks. They also said that Tornado GR4s flew 3500 miles to deliver a volley of Storm Shadows. The French fired 12-14 Scalps earlier today. No French fighters have been lost according to the AdlA.

Currently we are witnessing the 6-12 hour cycles of the traditional roll-back of air defences as opposed the 10-20 minute cycles as per the US CONOPS.

Other stuff: Official Norwegian sources claim their 6 F-16 will deploy to Sicily with the Belgians, but they're already operating from Patras?!
 
B

bd popeye

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
I imagine that in this forum and other forums if the Libyan forces loyal to Gadhafi had managed a counter strike or shot down an aircraft the discussion would certainly be more lively.

As it stands right now we have to wait for battle damage assessment.
 
t68

t68

Well-Known Member
Unconfirmed reports that a French aircraft has been shot down over Tripoli by Sky news on fox, not sure if it’s a beat up by Libyans officials or not time will tell.

I do believe the action to be an act of war on behalf of the UN, I personally do not like Gaddafi’s way of doing thing but it does not give others the right to deploy military force against a sovereign country in an attempt to facilitate a change of government.
I did have to have a small laugh when it appears that the good Colonel is blaming Al-Qaeda for a lot of his internal problems and it appears Al-Qaeda have come out in support of the rebels.

Al-Qaeda and the west seem to be on the same wavelength on this, now see if they can make a compromise on the Afghanistan question.

Al Qaeda offers aid to rebels in Libya - Washington Times
 
K

kramxel

New Member
t68 said:
Unconfirmed reports that a French aircraft has been shot down over Tripoli by Sky news on fox, not sure if it’s a beat up by Libyans officials or not time will tell.

I do believe the action to be an act of war on behalf of the UN, I personally do not like Gaddafi’s way of doing thing but it does not give others the right to deploy military force against a sovereign country in an attempt to facilitate a change of government.
I did have to have a small laugh when it appears that the good Colonel is blaming Al-Qaeda for a lot of his internal problems and it appears Al-Qaeda have come out in support of the rebels.

Al-Qaeda and the west seem to be on the same wavelength on this, now see if they can make a compromise on the Afghanistan question.

Al Qaeda offers aid to rebels in Libya - Washington Times
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That's the absolute irony!
Al Quaeda working torwards the same goals as the western powers....

BTW, the french aircraft shot down report came from Libyan national television.... so it's pretty hard to believe in...
 
A

Aussie Digger

Guest
sgtgunn said:
First wave of allied assault: 112 cruise missiles - Yahoo! News

AP article seems to imply that the US may not fly aircraft in support of a No-Fly zone, but might limit itsef to other roles like cruise missile strikes. Another article mentions Global Hawk overflight to do BDA on the 112 tomahawk strike.

I'm skeptical that US aircraft won't ultimately become involved. Does anyone think that the US/NATO might start operating armed UAV over Libya like the MQ-9? Or would they be too vulnerable to AAA/SA-7?

Adrian
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AP might think that, but it ignores the buildup of US airpower in Italy over the last 36hrs...

Growlers for instance arriving 18 March 2011...

AP :: Images :: Enlarged View :: 11031917781 - Italy NATO Libya
 
D

destructivetouch

Member
sturm said:
iraq's integrated network, kari, was done by the french. Saddam had lots of soviet sourced radars and if i'm not mistaken, small number of chinese radars.
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Iads design was known in detail to u.s. Intelligence...

Some key Iraqi antiair weapons were either quite old, well understood
by U.S. intelligence, or limited in range and capability...

Another advantage that the coalition had in attacking the IADS is
that all internal designs of the KARI computer system that controlled
it [DELETED].. (what do you think was here and deleted ..;))

BASIC STRUCTURE OF THE IRAQI INTEGRATED AIR DEFENSE SYSTEM Appendix VI Operation


KARI was very hierarchical, so that when the SOCs or ADOC were destroyed, the IOCs were unable to operate effectively

Iraqi Air Defense - Introduction
 
F

Firn

Active Member
The built-up of allied sea- and airpower was not exactly kept secret, as it was also meant as a strong signal to Mr. Gaddafi, perfectly in line with the political goals.

There is a considerable amount and broad array of intelligence sources available, especially after the allied effort in this direction has been greatly increased over the last weeks. I'm pretty sure that due to the allied effort and the Lybian carelessness most important nodes of the IDAS very pretty well known and have been already been targeted.
 
D

DarthAmerica

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
Feanor said:
Well it looks like the African Union is not on board with the operation.
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Consider the stated purpose of the UN mandate. How could they be when you think about how African governments treat their own populations? They'd be setting themselves up for similar uprisings. When the dictators and tyrants in charge move to suppress it they would have to wonder if the media and then "sky people" would soon be after them as well...

-DA
 
A

A4kscooter

Member
I remember seeing pictures of a RAF Sentinel aircraft in one of the newspapers.
Are they been used in this conflict as I would have thought this an ideal scenario for which their capabilites to be used?
 
C

Cailet

Member
According to the Beeb they're being used/will be used. There's no good reason not to use them that I can think of.
 
G

ghanz

New Member
I still fail to understand what would no fly zone and bombing will achieve in the long run? Rebels need arms and man power if they have any chance of toppling Gaddafi over. Otherwise this will just split Libya into 2 different states. Are the French and British prepare to send troops on the ground?
 
A

Aussie Digger

Guest
ghanz said:
I still fail to understand what would no fly zone and bombing will achieve in the long run? Rebels need arms and man power if they have any chance of toppling Gaddafi over. Otherwise this will just split Libya into 2 different states. Are the French and British prepare to send troops on the ground?
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I suspect this will resolve into a regime change mission eventually.

In terms of large numbers of troops I can't see it, but a specwarops led effort to train, equip and direct local forces and ensure co-ordination with air and naval assets engaged in this operation?

Definitely. In fact I suspect it has already started...

;)
 
S

STURM

Well-Known Member
ghanz said:
Are the French and British prepare to send troops on the ground?
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I think it's very significant that Obama announced that U.S. troops will not be deployed. No doubt this was intended mainly for a domestic audience but also I think a message to the Arabs and U.S. allies.
 
K

kato

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
ghanz said:
Rebels need arms and man power if they have any chance of toppling Gaddafi over.
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Providing either of those would be a violation of S/RES/1970. Just saying.

Neither S/RES/1970 nor S/RES/1973 support a regime change mission. And from a legal viewpoint, S/RES/1973 mandates that any rebels firing on loyalist troops need to be stopped. Permanently.
 
G

ghanz

New Member
So in a way this is a good opportunity for Nato and allies to test their new toys, while no one is really committed on stopping Gaddafi. Why not just kill Gaddafi and get over with it? Save money and lives...
 
H

harms

New Member
bd popeye said:
I imagine that in this forum and other forums if the Libyan forces loyal to Gadhafi had managed a counter strike or shot down an aircraft the discussion would certainly be more lively.
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Well, they have not downed any jets, but they do have italian tug boat with 8 italians on board in custody.
 
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