Kim Jong-Il is dead

jasonmarz930

Banned Member
Kim Jong-Il, the Supreme Leader of North Korea who has been their absolute leader for the past 37 years, has died of sudden heart attack, according to DPRK Central News officially reported.

Kim Jong-Il inherited his father's power as a 33 year old in 1974, and since Kim Il-Sung's death in 1997, he has been a leader with an absolute authority with his "military-first politics", "the march of suffering", "The Father Leader's North Korean Laws", and "The Strongest Nation philosophy" for decades.

As expected, the international community is taking this news of his death with a distanced reaction.

Certain Internet users and Chinese users are expressing doubt and cynicism towards his death. And there are many rumors about possible coup d'etat or internal fight for power, since the power transfer from the father to the son has not been completed yet.

No nation should use this confusion to their advantage and try to take over the regime. North Korea must use this opportunity to give up nuclear weapons and become more cooperative with the international community to calm its politics and social confusion.
 

Global Scree

New Member
Kim Jong-Il, the Supreme Leader of North Korea who has been their absolute leader for the past 37 years, has died of sudden heart attack, according to DPRK Central News officially reported.
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No nation should use this confusion to their advantage and try to take over the regime. North Korea must use this opportunity to give up nuclear weapons and become more cooperative with the international community to calm its politics and social confusion.
So are we getting Kim Jong-un or do we have Chang Sung-taek as regent? Has the succession been announced officially yet? I cant say I know much of Chang's politics, was he totally complicit with Jong-il's methodology, is he more anti-western, more sympathetic? lots and lots of questions....
 

colay

New Member
Can't say I'll miss him. With his death, at least there's a chance for change and maybe for the better. There's uncertain times ahead as we wait to see who will fill the power vacuum.. hard to imagine things getting worse than they were under KJI.

If the son is the new leader, I don't expect him to rock the boat too much at the start. Once he has solidified his power base, then we will have a better idea what kind of future lies in store for NK.
 

Musashi_kenshin

Well-Known Member
Good riddance to a horrible man. If there's any justice in the universe, he'll spend eternity somewhere very hot.

I agree with colay, it will take some time to see what sort of a leader his son is. I hope he doesn't do something stupid to look tough.
 

PCShogun

New Member
Hopefully the son will lack his fathers sense of paranoia and can bring to bring his people out of their backwater status. Time will tell.
 

Shilo2010

New Member
Hi. New here. Australian male 39 ( for 3 more days!) Non Military but relitively informed and always interested in learning and hearing other peoples points of view.

Im worried about Kim Jongs death on several levels. I am no admirer of Jong-un and feel he is every bit as dangerous as his sire. The uncomforatable status Quo reached with North Korea over the past 39 years has become volatile and unpredictable with the death of Kim Jong.
Reccent US announcments of renewed interest in the Pacific and Pacific rim culminating in an increased budget and an increase in US defence personel stationed throughout the region including Okinawa and a new agreement with Australia to station US defence personel in Darwin has me a little edgy. As well as this Australia has just announced the conversion of an entire regiment to an "amphibious assult" regiment ( historicaly the realm of the US Marines, especialy in the pacific ) and an esculation of joint US / Aus training (flex) exercises. I am sure Washington has been watching Kim Jongs health very closely over the past 12 months and am concerned by their apparent concern.
Am I over reacting?
 

My2Cents

Active Member
Good riddance to a horrible man. If there's any justice in the universe, he'll spend eternity somewhere very hot.
Unless you read Dante’s Inferno, in which case he may end up somewhere very cold.
I agree with colay, it will take some time to see what sort of a leader his son is. I hope he doesn't do something stupid to look tough.
Hopefully the son will lack his fathers sense of paranoia and can bring to bring his people out of their backwater status. Time will tell.
Time will tell, but the change in leadership may allow them to break with the past without losing face. In which case things could happen very fast. Dumping the nuclear program in return for a huge amount of food aid from the west could cement Kim Jong-un hold on power.
 

Shilo2010

New Member
Hi. New here. Australian male 39 ( for 3 more days!) Non Military but relitively informed and always interested in learning and hearing other peoples points of view.

Im worried about Kim Jongs death on several levels. I am no admirer of Jong-un and feel he is every bit as dangerous as his sire. The uncomforatable status Quo reached with North Korea over the past 39 years has become volatile and unpredictable with the death of Kim Jong.
Reccent US announcments of renewed interest in the Pacific and Pacific rim culminating in an increased budget and an increase in US defence personel stationed throughout the region including Okinawa and a new agreement with Australia to station US defence personel in Darwin has me a little edgy. As well as this Australia has just announced the conversion of an entire regiment to an "amphibious assult" regiment ( historicaly the realm of the US Marines, especialy in the pacific ) and an esculation of joint US / Aus training (flex) exercises. I am sure Washington has been watching Kim Jongs health very closely over the past 12 months and am concerned by their apparent concern.
Am I over reacting?
 

colay

New Member
I'm no psychologist but I wonder how much KJI actually influenced his son in terms of his future role as leader? We know the son only got in the spotlight quite recently but before that we really have no idea. KJI, OTOH, was under Kim Il jung's tutelage from a very early age and was very much molded in the latter's image.

This gives me some hope that maybe the grandson will turn out to be different and in a better way. Maybe his brief exposure to the west while schooling in Switzerland made some sort of impression on him. I read an account by a westerner who befriended him at school and maybe that relationship has influenced his outlook as well.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
The structural factors will be more important then personal ones in this transfer of power. It's not a matter of whether the new guy will be better, it's a matter of whether the group supporting the new guy wants to change things.
 

colay

New Member
The structural factors will be more important then personal ones in this transfer of power. It's not a matter of whether the new guy will be better, it's a matter of whether the group supporting the new guy wants to change things.
I agree though at some point down the road I expect him to start stretching his wings and initiatee his own agenda, whatever it is.
 

PCShogun

New Member
Time will tell, but the change in leadership may allow them to break with the past without losing face. In which case things could happen very fast. Dumping the nuclear program in return for a huge amount of food aid from the west could cement Kim Jong-un hold on power.
You are right. Asian culture sets great emphasis on "Face". I really do hope this is a turn for the better future for these people. When we say someone is our enemy, we usually refer to their government, not the general people, who, like the rest of us, simply wish to live their lives in peace with everyone else.
 

colay

New Member
There's speculation that he was involved somehow in the sinking of that SOKOR corvette and the artillery shelling of that island last year, probably in a hasty effort by his dad to establish his bona fides with the military.

The guy is said to admire Michael Jordan and James Bond, plays video games and basketball.. so maybe the xenophobia doesn't run quite as deep. Too bad NK won't be entertaining foreign delegations to the funeral; a missed opportunity to get a better feel for the guy but that's just like them to keep everyone guessing.
 

Shilo2010

New Member
I found this particularly entertaining.
Taken from Frum Forum and composed by Peter Worthington.

It was the noted atheist Christopher Hitchens who remarked in a debate before his untimely death last week, that if indeed there was “all-seeing god” watching over us, “it would be like living in North Korea.”

And now the latest in the family of hereditary dictators of North Korea has died at age about 69 – Kim Jong-il, leaving his third and youngest (known) son , Kim Jong-un, as heir to impoverished country at age 28.

Although North Korea is a paranoid state where the regime keeps an “all-seeing eye” on everyone to make sure citizens aren’t subversively listening to Voice of America on pre-set radios, it’s difficult to take the country seriously.

Yes, the Kims have been adept at intimidating the world – first with Kim Il-sung, placed in power by Stalin and known as “Great Leader” who attacked South Korea in 1950, followed by his heir in 1994, Kim Jong-il, known as “Dear Leader” who threatens neighbors with nuclear weapons, and now by his son Kim Jong-un who is an unknown factor and dubbed for the moment “Successor Leader.”

Put bluntly, North Korea is a fruitcake regime. Without anything in the way of resources–except soldiers and nutbar leaders who threaten and bluff–North Korea has a first strike potential to do considerable damage to South Korea, but then would be obliterated If America retaliated.

Russia and China have to be embarrassed by North Korea, whose propaganda machine depicted Kim Jong-il as a jet fighter pilot, a composer of operas, a movie producer with a photographic memory, and a golfing phenom who in his first attempt at the game scored 11 holes in one.

Nuclear arsenal or not, how does one take this guy and his regime seriously?

That’s part of the trouble. There’s no guarantee the country will act sanely with the current leadership it must worship on pain of death.

While the new “Kim” on top — Kim Jong-un — is unknown, odds are he’s as nutty as his dad. On second-thought, maybe not. He’s got generals around him who’ll curb (or try to curb) any excessive loony tunes emerging. Dear Leader dad was one for the ages.

Reality is, we know more about the dark side of the moon than we do about the inner workings of North Korea. What we do know is that every year there is starvation, as crops fail and the country’s budget is dedicated to the military. Appeals for foreign aid are invariably answered (mostly by generous South Korea) and food aid goes to the army.

It’s been noted that the Kims may be the only fat people in North Korea – papa being addicted (we were told) to imported lobsters and cognac. When he was in school, Kim Jong-il was one of those rare students who allegedly could repair motor cars, or sewing machines while fine tuning electric motors and inventing electronic wizardry. Smart kid.

American presidents are particularly vulnerable to appeals of hunger – as well as being susceptible to gestures of blackmail: Give us aid or we’ll test nuclear weapons. That sort of stuff that U.S. administrations take more seriously than they should.

Japan is vulnerable to nuclear blackmail. North Korea missile and rocket testing that goes astray, periodically threatens Japan.

All in the name of gaining respect for North Korean bellicosity.

While threats of war are nonsense – terrorism is very real.

Last year North Korea torpedoed a South Korean warship, killing 43 sailors. As if to refute South Korea’s accusations of aggression, North Korea bombarded a South Korean island. That’s the sort of country it is, under the Kim dynasty. If you say we don’t want peace–we’ll kill you.

In the past, the late and now lamented (in the streets of Pyongyang) “Dear Leader” was credited with a 1983 bombing in Myanmar that killed 17 South Korean officials negotiating with the Burmese. And then blowing up a Korean airline, killing 115. All when Kim Jong-il headed North Korea’s espionage service, before succeeding his dad.

Some years ago, around the time that Kim Il-sung was fading, South Korea’s Institute for North Korean Studies published a book: The Son Also Rises which documented the family’s history, noting that uncles, aunts and offspring “are all in the gravy up to the elbow.”

As if to enhance North Korea’s goofiness, when Kim Il-sung died, he was declared “President for Life,” which would have been more accurate it if it had been for “afterlife.” Anyway Kim Jong-il never took the title “President,” but preferred to be “chairman,” and Supreme Commander.”

What happens now that he world has a young “sole leader” in North Korea is anyone’s guess. Likely nothing – for a while. We’ll know soon enough it Kim Jong-un is as nutty as his dad – who, although crazy, was not stupid, witness how he persuaded the West to leap through hoops. What chance does the kid have with a dad like his?

One thing certain – China will do what it can to harness North Korea not to be foolish and do something provocative that may jeopardize China’s commercial dealings with the developed world.

That’s the good news. The bad news is another Son is also rising…
 

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
There's speculation that he was involved somehow in the sinking of that SOKOR corvette and the artillery shelling of that island last year, probably in a hasty effort by his dad to establish his bona fides with the military.

The guy is said to admire Michael Jordan and James Bond, plays video games and basketball.. so maybe the xenophobia doesn't run quite as deep. Too bad NK won't be entertaining foreign delegations to the funeral; a missed opportunity to get a better feel for the guy but that's just like them to keep everyone guessing.
It is also so said that he has a ruthless streak. He is being portrayed by the North Korean media as the "Great Successor". Hopefully a peaceful and orderly transition of power without recourse to the creation of extreme international incidents by Pyongyang to divert attention domestic attention from what is happening at home.
 

colay

New Member
It is also so said that he has a ruthless streak. He is being portrayed by the North Korean media as the "Great Successor". Hopefully a peaceful and orderly transition of power without recourse to the creation of extreme international incidents by Pyongyang to divert attention domestic attention from what is happening at home.
He's going to need some ruthlessness to survive in that environment, I think ruthlessness is a trait common to all great leaders whether in the military or business arenas. Think Bill Gates or Steve Jobs. Or your boss waiting for you at the office. Your wife, maybe?:D
 

jasonmarz930

Banned Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #19
What is North Korea's future under Kim Jong-Un?

After Kim Jong-Il's death, the whole world's attention has now shifted to his heir, Kim Jong-Un.
Accordingly, North Korean media is putting all effort into advertising Kim Jong-Un as the official heir to the Great Leader of North Korea.

However, it remains unclear whether Kim Jong-Un will have an absolute authority as his father did. Kim Jong-Il began from scratch, and took 16 years to become an heir. Kim Jong-Un on the other hand, took only 2 years to become the heir, therefore he has a weaker power base.

Kim Jong-Il also had a political battle with his uncle Kim Yong-Joo, to prove his political skills. Kim Jong-Un on the other hand, has had no opportunity to prove himself yet.

It is ironic to see North Korea giving the whole nation's fate unto the hands of a young, inexperience man in his 20s. Perhaps this will bring doom to North Korea's cruel legacy after all.
 
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