Whats new with the M9 9mm Pistol?

F-15 Eagle

New Member
I know the M9 9mm pistol is the standard sidearm in the U.S. Military but is there any news on this weapon? I thought they were going to replace it with a new .45 caliber pistol, are they still working on it or did that get canceled?
 

Atilla [TR]

New Member
I know the M9 9mm pistol is the standard sidearm in the U.S. Military but is there any news on this weapon? I thought they were going to replace it with a new .45 caliber pistol, are they still working on it or did that get canceled?
It is on and off again, some of the competition is the Springfield XD the new one with the thumb safety, or the HK 45. The project is on and off and on and off.
 

buglerbilly

Defense Professional
Verified Defense Pro
The M9 has just been re-ordered in large quantities, whilst the .45's appear to stay with SpecFor and Private Buyers only......even IF you own one privately, as I understand it you have to get permission to wear it.
 

Atilla [TR]

New Member
The M9 has just been re-ordered in large quantities, whilst the .45's appear to stay with SpecFor and Private Buyers only......even IF you own one privately, as I understand it you have to get permission to wear it.
In military or for personal defense? Military in U.S you only get what they issue you as I hear, for personal in U.S you can own one if you have permit.
 

F-15 Eagle

New Member
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  • #5
The M9 has just been re-ordered in large quantities, whilst the .45's appear to stay with SpecFor and Private Buyers only......even IF you own one privately, as I understand it you have to get permission to wear it.
I don't know if this is true or not but I read that the Marine Force Reccon units retired all of their M1911A1s and replaced them with the M9 because it is in large scale use by the military. Again I have no idea if that is true or not.
 

Cutaway

New Member
If this issue is serious, Im glad they are considering a .45 sidearm. I hated it when they replaced the M1911 with the Beretta M92F. Only good thing about the 9mm weapons is the magazine capacity.

They should go for a derivative of the M1911, Preferably the Strayer-Voight Infinity but modified for military use.
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
If this issue is serious, Im glad they are considering a .45 sidearm. I hated it when they replaced the M1911 with the Beretta M92F. Only good thing about the 9mm weapons is the magazine capacity.

They should go for a derivative of the M1911, Preferably the Strayer-Voight Infinity but modified for military use.
You are kidding right, I carried M1911A1 for years as a tanker and it was the happiest day of my iron chariot leader life to get rid of that piece of crap and go with a M92F. For what the standard soldier carries as a projectile type in his sidearm, the 45 cal offers no real advantage. The U.S will never go with the 45 cal again for normal carry with standard soldiers.
 

F-15 Eagle

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One of the reasons why some enemy combatants don't go down after taking several 9mm hits...or 5.56mm and 7.62mm for that matter is because a lot of the insurgents can take so many bullets is because they are usually doped up on heroin. It allows them to feel little or no pain after being shot multiple times...though this is hard to prove.
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
One of the reasons why some enemy combatants don't go down after taking several 9mm hits...or 5.56mm and 7.62mm for that matter is because a lot of the insurgents can take so many bullets is because they are usually doped up on heroin. It allows them to feel little or no pain after being shot multiple times...though this is hard to prove.
And where did you here this, trust me, if you can take a hit from a 7.62X39 and shake it off then you are not going to have a issue shrugging off a hit from a 45 cal 185 grain hard ball projectile. You can take that same 45 round and shoot at a old fully soaked U.S Army wool blanket at a distance of a hundred meters and it will not penetrate it as to where a standard 9mm round, which I believe is still a 115 grain hard ball will achieve full penetration. In a world case scenario where the average soldier has to rely on a hand gun for a means of primary protection he most likely is in a last ditch attempt to save his life, and the 9mm is fully capable of handling the task.
 

winnyfield

New Member
Also take into account that neither the .45 nor 9mm are able to penetrate modern (or even rudimentary) body armor - center of mass shots. In future it'd be question of either the 5.7mm vs 4.6mm debate.

Frankly unless you're SF/CT trained and tasked on CQB missions (h.shot point blank ranges), sidearms are a pretty low priority.
 
A

Aussie Digger

Guest
One of the reasons why some enemy combatants don't go down after taking several 9mm hits...or 5.56mm and 7.62mm for that matter is because a lot of the insurgents can take so many bullets is because they are usually doped up on heroin. It allows them to feel little or no pain after being shot multiple times...though this is hard to prove.
It's hard to prove because it's a load of rubbish. If you're hit in the "T" (draw between ear to ear and down to your chest) you are going to drop. No matter what substance you've taken. Simple as that. Whether it's 9mm, .40cal, .45cal, 5.56mm whatever. Heroin ain't going to keep you alive (let alone fighting) if your heart, lungs, spine or brain has been hit.

Pistols are inaccurate weapons at the best of times and are a low priority for a soldier. They are designed as a last resort for military purposes and their ineffectiveness is recognised by the fact that many "traditional" pistol users in the military (tankers, pilots etc) are starting to carry carbine rifles (M4's, F-88C Steyrs etc).

People have also allegedly complained about these rifles performance in Afghanistan etc and about the "effectiveness" of 5.56mm rounds in general.
Anecdotal evidence is that 5.56mm rounds are less lethal in reality because they tend to "over-penetrate", meaning that if they don't hit bone or a vital organ they don't do as much damage as other calibres. (That they tumble but go straight through without causing a particular severe wound, is the allegation).

The requirement for the SS109 round was to penetrate 12mm of plate steel at 500m's. Any round that can do that is plenty powerful enough to be lethal against a human being.

What is lacking is marksmanship ability... M4's don't help this at long range because of the shorter barrel length. If they are being employed in a role for which they weren't really designed, then what's to blame? The tool or the user of the tool?
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
To elaborate a little more on what AD posted:

The Herion rumor is a bunch of rubbish, with the enemy combatants amount of Islamic faith that the majority of them have, also the preferred substance in that part of the world is Hashish and the majority of the younger crowd do not seem to be in to it until they are a little older. Seeing someone that has been just shot is not like the movies, it is a very ugly experience that will never ever leave your memory for the rest of your life and I hope that our younger crowd will never have to experience that, life is a challenge enough. A bullet is very unpredictable and it really doesn`t matter with the caliber size that you get hit with, it will do massive amounts of damage if it hits any type of vital organs, also you have to understand the shock factor when someone is hit, I had a very close friend as one of my many examples that was killed in South Korea on a tank gunnery range because of shrapnel from a dud projectile that some idiot picked up and threw back onto the ground because he thought it was a cool looking projectile, my friend was only hit in the arm but he still died because of shock, the wound wasn`t very big and it had alot of us asking why. The moral of this reply is do not underestimate and type of pistol or rifle cartridge that is fielded, they are all quite capable of inflicting a loss of life.
 
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