What is this UAV ?
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http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/0,1518,396450,00.html
Luftwaffe examines secret flight drone
The business lures arms companies with unmanned flight drones, as it uses the CIA for the terrorist hunt. Now Air Force boss stieglitz visited for the first time the secret flier, with whom the European EADS wants to make the American competition.
Hamburg - strict shielded from the public presented the arms company EADS of Luftwaffe the secret forerunner model of an unmanned reconnaissance drone. After information MIRROR was allowed Air Force boss lieutenant general Klaus-Peter Stieglitz past week in the Bavarian Manching, where EADS builds the "Eurofighter" and a test site maintains the German Federal Armed Forces, which secret fliers visit named "Barracuda".
The remote controlled equipment serves for the time being the testing of new technologies and might start already in February - at a separated place on the iberischen peninsula - to the first flight. "Barracuda" is developed as reconnaissance aircraft, could be high-prepared later in addition, for the fighter plane. Model are US drones like the "Predator", a reconnaissance airplane, which is equipped with "Hellfire" rockets and used by the secret service CIA for attacks on presumed terrorists.
The EADS sees so far from the USA and Israel dominated business with unmanned aircraft as promising growth market and the project "Barracuda" therefore to a large extent financed. Swiss the defense department made a small contribution. Because the Air Force would like to replace their well 20 years old "Tornado" Aufklaerungsjets by unmanned fliers, the company hopes now for larger money gene from Berlin.
Luftwaffe examines secret flight drone
The business lures arms companies with unmanned flight drones, as it uses the CIA for the terrorist hunt. Now Air Force boss stieglitz visited for the first time the secret flier, with whom the European EADS wants to make the American competition.
Hamburg - strict shielded from the public presented the arms company EADS of Luftwaffe the secret forerunner model of an unmanned reconnaissance drone. After information MIRROR was allowed Air Force boss lieutenant general Klaus-Peter Stieglitz past week in the Bavarian Manching, where EADS builds the "Eurofighter" and a test site maintains the German Federal Armed Forces, which secret fliers visit named "Barracuda".
The remote controlled equipment serves for the time being the testing of new technologies and might start already in February - at a separated place on the iberischen peninsula - to the first flight. "Barracuda" is developed as reconnaissance aircraft, could be high-prepared later in addition, for the fighter plane. Model are US drones like the "Predator", a reconnaissance airplane, which is equipped with "Hellfire" rockets and used by the secret service CIA for attacks on presumed terrorists.
The EADS sees so far from the USA and Israel dominated business with unmanned aircraft as promising growth market and the project "Barracuda" therefore to a large extent financed. Swiss the defense department made a small contribution. Because the Air Force would like to replace their well 20 years old "Tornado" Aufklaerungsjets by unmanned fliers, the company hopes now for larger money gene from Berlin.
Well, the Barracuda breaks cover at last.
Its an EADS project, obviously under cooperation of Germany and Spain. Note that apparently its intented to be a Recce UAV, although it shows strong resemblance to current UCAV efforts in the US and Europe.
It remains to be seen wether Barracuda is really going to be a Recce craft. Another possibility would be that EADS intends to develop an unmanned platform that suits several applications, much like a multi-role aircraft.
Also the current demonstrator might incorporate changes to its appearance later on, therefore we really just can wait and see where this goes.
Its an EADS project, obviously under cooperation of Germany and Spain. Note that apparently its intented to be a Recce UAV, although it shows strong resemblance to current UCAV efforts in the US and Europe.
It remains to be seen wether Barracuda is really going to be a Recce craft. Another possibility would be that EADS intends to develop an unmanned platform that suits several applications, much like a multi-role aircraft.
Also the current demonstrator might incorporate changes to its appearance later on, therefore we really just can wait and see where this goes.
Cootamundra
New Member
No reason why a recce bird (if the designers think about it) couldn't be built to work as a strike bird as well. I would think that with a good sensor suite the Barracuda will just need to be fitted with EW and targeting systems and it would make an excellent long range striker. At least that's what I'd like to see happen. UCAV's are the way of the future, we will see many more to come.turin said:
No, it's a UCAV - not a UAV. It does have an attack role.zoolander said:
I think it's still safe to call it a "UAV." Just because something has a slightly different designator in a different country doesn't mean that they're wrong for calling it something else. In the US, for example, I haven't heard anyone diferenciate between "UCAV" an "UAV," regardless if it has Hellstorm missiles or not, but that's just my experience.gf0012-aust said:
That thing sure is crazy looking, though! I'd hate to be on the receiving end of it!
I'd have to say that within the USAF or any military circles the distinction is certainly made.Gray_R said:
A UCAV is an unmanned combat aircraft - it is by its design tasked for combat and carrying weapons such as Hellfire.
UAV's are fundamentally ISR platforms, they may be theatre supportive, but they don't and can't carry warloads.
The average newspaper journalist OTOH wouldn't know a UAV from a Kite, or a UCAV from a Hercules.
although, I shlould add that the USAF has started to complicate things by referring to armed UAV's/TUAV's as "Armed RPA's" - so sometimes they are their own worst enemy as far as persistent naming goes.
Its far safer for people to see UAV's as distinct weapons inert platforms and UCAV/TUAV's as spear carriers.
edit. modified original text.
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I think people are getting a little confused since the USAF has modified the Predators to fire Hellfire missiles. The Predator was designed initially as a UAV and was later modified into a UCAV.
Normally the easiest way to tell the difference is that many of the UAV's have long thin wing spans for long duration flying, while the future UCAV's will more resemble fighter and attack aircraft with the exception of the Predator B and C.
Normally the easiest way to tell the difference is that many of the UAV's have long thin wing spans for long duration flying, while the future UCAV's will more resemble fighter and attack aircraft with the exception of the Predator B and C.
Yeah, it makes sense, and I'm not trying to destroy any credibility, but I didn't just read about it in the paper, either. Granted it's not my field (Infantry) and my experience with them is limited, but personally, I've never heard it. My unit is in Alamogordo, NM, near the White Sands Missile Range, "Birthplace of America's Missile and Space Activity," and still, I've never heard "UCAV."
Anyway, my point is, outside of specialized cliques, like a unit that works specifically with UCAVs, I think "UAV" is okay, since [most] people know they're capable of carrying weapons.
*Hellfire - I must have confused it with the gloves...
Anyway, my point is, outside of specialized cliques, like a unit that works specifically with UCAVs, I think "UAV" is okay, since [most] people know they're capable of carrying weapons.
*Hellfire - I must have confused it with the gloves...
With the current U.S.A.F. force structure the current units that operate the UAV predators also operate the UCAV versions. It does get confusing because every branch initially had different names for them. In the U.S. we're trying are best to call them by those two names to simplify identification.
Grand Danois
Entertainer
Btw. Scratch one Barracuda.
Crashed into the sea off Spain Sept. 23.
Crashed into the sea off Spain Sept. 23.
I saw it few times already, and I still thinks the same.
As UAV is part of my day-day life, I just don't see myself, using this aircraft in any operation.
It is no secret that the IDF for example is operating UCAV's, and I'm even allowed to confirm you that, and nothing we use is similiar to that, because of a simple reason.
They decided to go on a structure that fit for human to sit in, and they just closed their minds for new options, which in Israel atlist prooved to work much better.
Such body of an aircraft limits you with the amount of weapon, time in the air, and the goals this aircraft will be able to do in a single flight.
Such aircraft wont give you the benefits you get from the fact that there is no one inside, besides of course, human lives.
Naturally, I'm not allowed to say how those looks in Israel and in the US. and no i'm not talking about the dear Predator :] , but on new designes and technologies that gives the UCAV abillities that a manned aircraft just can't have.
As part of my job, myself and many others UAV's operator, working with people on developing new things, and we donate from our experience of actually flying those things, so they will know what are the problems, and what to focus on, and without beeing arrogant, I just don't think they done it on this specific model.
And don't get me wrong, we work in Israel with EADS and we have joint projects with them ( not as many as with Boeing and Lockheed Marting but we have ), and I know there're great minds and ideas in there, but I don't think this one will work.
As UAV is part of my day-day life, I just don't see myself, using this aircraft in any operation.
It is no secret that the IDF for example is operating UCAV's, and I'm even allowed to confirm you that, and nothing we use is similiar to that, because of a simple reason.
They decided to go on a structure that fit for human to sit in, and they just closed their minds for new options, which in Israel atlist prooved to work much better.
Such body of an aircraft limits you with the amount of weapon, time in the air, and the goals this aircraft will be able to do in a single flight.
Such aircraft wont give you the benefits you get from the fact that there is no one inside, besides of course, human lives.
Naturally, I'm not allowed to say how those looks in Israel and in the US. and no i'm not talking about the dear Predator :] , but on new designes and technologies that gives the UCAV abillities that a manned aircraft just can't have.
As part of my job, myself and many others UAV's operator, working with people on developing new things, and we donate from our experience of actually flying those things, so they will know what are the problems, and what to focus on, and without beeing arrogant, I just don't think they done it on this specific model.
And don't get me wrong, we work in Israel with EADS and we have joint projects with them ( not as many as with Boeing and Lockheed Marting but we have ), and I know there're great minds and ideas in there, but I don't think this one will work.
So we have a true blue UAV operator here... cool!
What kind of training do you get to run IDFs UAVs? Many of ours have actual pilots behind the controls.It depends, there're many many kinds of UAV's in the IDF, if I remember correctly 3 times more models than in the US Army \ airforce which is the next in the list after the IDF.So we have a true blue UAV operator here... cool!
Each of our UAVs have specific mission goal that in most cases, it will do this mission only, as opposed to the US army when they use the Predator for example for everything it can do ( attacking ground targets, high altitude surveillance, low altitude, short range missions, medium and long ).
In Israel we see it as a waste, the Predator costs too much for doing it all, so we use different types of UAV's for each mission.
Since I'm not a regular UAV operator, but a UCAV operator, means that most of my training was attacking ground targets, with pin points missiles, and some with other types of ammunition.
I'm not allowed to say any type of ammunition we use obviously.
My job doesn't include observation on targets, which this part is belong to other UAV squadrons that we communicate with, but as part of the regular UAV training that I passed I've also learned to do it.
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Unmanned and Unveiled
EADS has unveiled a new concept for a multi-national, modular unmanned air vehicle at the Association of Unmanned Vehicle Systems International conference in Cologne. The firm is showing two configurations of the updated vehicle, a short-winged, high-subsonic tactical reconnaissance model (carrying an electro-optical/infrared payload), and a long-winged endurance system carrying a radar sensor as well. The fuselage and payloads would be common. Twin engines could ease concerns over operations in national airspace.
Target requirements: replacing Germany's reconnaissance Tornados and tactical drones, and meeting the French-led EuroMALE requirement. (In the past, EADS has proposed a version of Israel's Heron II, seen here yesterday, for EuroMALE, but this effort has lost steam.) The system could be in service by 2011.
What this system is not, EADS says, is a substitute for the Barracuda demonstrator, which rejoined its fishy friends on an early test flight last September. A follow-on to the stealthy, combat-capable Barracuda may be in the works at EADS.
Link: http://aviationweek.typepad.com/ares/2007/05/unmanned_and_un.html#more
EADS has unveiled a new concept for a multi-national, modular unmanned air vehicle at the Association of Unmanned Vehicle Systems International conference in Cologne. The firm is showing two configurations of the updated vehicle, a short-winged, high-subsonic tactical reconnaissance model (carrying an electro-optical/infrared payload), and a long-winged endurance system carrying a radar sensor as well. The fuselage and payloads would be common. Twin engines could ease concerns over operations in national airspace.
Target requirements: replacing Germany's reconnaissance Tornados and tactical drones, and meeting the French-led EuroMALE requirement. (In the past, EADS has proposed a version of Israel's Heron II, seen here yesterday, for EuroMALE, but this effort has lost steam.) The system could be in service by 2011.
What this system is not, EADS says, is a substitute for the Barracuda demonstrator, which rejoined its fishy friends on an early test flight last September. A follow-on to the stealthy, combat-capable Barracuda may be in the works at EADS.
Link: http://aviationweek.typepad.com/ares/2007/05/unmanned_and_un.html#more