Future of Russian Military
- Thread starter Wall83
- Start date
I consider China more South of Russia than it is East. Well, it's debatable.
By the way, does anybody here have a picture of a T90 without it's ERA?
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But it is of limited degree coverage? Does this type of radar more expensive to build compared to the type being built in Czech?
The 77th Caspian Marines brigade has been disbanded. It will be replaced by two separate battalions. With the new 33rd and 34th Mountain Brigades, it will no longer be necessary, as it was essentially used as a regular motor-rifles unit in the 2nd Chechen, and from there on. The two separate btlns will be based in Astrkhan and Dagestan.
http://arms-tass.su/?page=article&aid=67402&cid=25
Also rian.ru published the requirements for the future Russian aircraft carrier project. Apparently the PAK-FA will have a carrier-based version of it, as will the FGFA.
http://arms-tass.su/?page=article&aid=67396&cid=25
http://rian.ru/defense_safety/20090227/163391834.html
The new ship will not a heavy cruiser. It will be a pure aircraft carrier. The airwing will have a convetional take off and landing variant of the PAK-FA, and a number of naval UAVs currently being developed by Vega. There will be three ships at least, with one in the NF, and one in the PF. A third one on maintenance. In the long run there is a possibility for up to 6 ships of that class. There is a competition for the production between SevMash and Baltiyskiy Zavod.
Unfortunately no word on the size of the airwing, or on AEW. Possibly UAV AEW?
http://arms-tass.su/?page=article&aid=67402&cid=25
Also rian.ru published the requirements for the future Russian aircraft carrier project. Apparently the PAK-FA will have a carrier-based version of it, as will the FGFA.
http://arms-tass.su/?page=article&aid=67396&cid=25
http://rian.ru/defense_safety/20090227/163391834.html
The new ship will not a heavy cruiser. It will be a pure aircraft carrier. The airwing will have a convetional take off and landing variant of the PAK-FA, and a number of naval UAVs currently being developed by Vega. There will be three ships at least, with one in the NF, and one in the PF. A third one on maintenance. In the long run there is a possibility for up to 6 ships of that class. There is a competition for the production between SevMash and Baltiyskiy Zavod.
Unfortunately no word on the size of the airwing, or on AEW. Possibly UAV AEW?
Correct. From what I understand currently there is one array. It's operational. The other is still under construction. The one finished with 120 degree arc, covers the two radars in Ukraine.
There is 1 link which shows a navalised new fighter project. At first I thought it was just navalised PAK FA. But on closer look, I noticed it is a jump jet design. With swiveling nozzles and also a lift fan right behind the cockpit. So I feel that that is just some wild speculation, coz I dont think Russia nor the design OKB's have any money left to RnD a wholly new plane for this purpose.
So, the radar was built with array's to have the desired coverage. So This radar probably is more expensive than the full coverage 1 being built in Czech.
I don't know enough to comment on that.
It's all conceptual at this point. It may just be an artists opinion.
It is in service already - but test service - all building is completed.
A second S-400 regiment has been put on active duty in the Leningrad Region.
http://www.arms-expo.ru/site.xp/049057054048124055048057050.html
This is at least a few months late, and indicates that the current production rates for the S-400 don't even allow the production of a single regiment per year.
I'm wondering if this is because the Almaz-Antey plants are incapable of it, or if the funding isn't there (which seems unlikely) or if it's simply a new product and as a result production is still being ramped up. Any thoughts?
Oh and also, what exactly is a regiment of S-400s? I'm finding conflicting info. MDB says that a regiment is two btlns, which is the smallest tactical unit of these SAMs. However the Arms-expo article claims that the original deployment at Elektrostal was also a regiment, when it was only a bltn from what I know. It also proceeds to list the contents of an S-400 "regiment" as those typically attributed to a btln.
http://www.arms-expo.ru/site.xp/049057054048124055048057050.html
This is at least a few months late, and indicates that the current production rates for the S-400 don't even allow the production of a single regiment per year.
I'm wondering if this is because the Almaz-Antey plants are incapable of it, or if the funding isn't there (which seems unlikely) or if it's simply a new product and as a result production is still being ramped up. Any thoughts?
Oh and also, what exactly is a regiment of S-400s? I'm finding conflicting info. MDB says that a regiment is two btlns, which is the smallest tactical unit of these SAMs. However the Arms-expo article claims that the original deployment at Elektrostal was also a regiment, when it was only a bltn from what I know. It also proceeds to list the contents of an S-400 "regiment" as those typically attributed to a btln.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #212
Time for an update in the russian rearment program.
Airforce.
Well not much is happening. The Su-34 isnt produced in large numbers yet, no more then 5-10 built. The PAK-FA should fly this year, hoppfully later by the end of the summer. Some bad quality MiG-29s has been announced to be joining the air force, have they done so? Also in 2007 it was announced that one new Tu-160 Blackjack would be joining the airforce every second year...so where is the 2009 plane?
Army.
Dont relly know much about it. The T-95 is still no were to be seen. Read somewhere that alot of older tanks is going to be scraped.
Navy.
The first Borei submarine is in sea trials....yeah! However the new SLBM, Bulava, is continuing to fail and the whole program has been delayed again. So the first submarine probably wont be in service until late 2010.
One new graney SSN submarine has been laid down in July and the first one could be launced be the end of the year.
Rocket forces.
65 Topol-Ms has now been put in service. 6 more are to be activated in 2009, three of them should be of the new RS-24 model. This is an lower number if compared with 2008 when 11 ICBMs was deployed.
Airforce.
Well not much is happening. The Su-34 isnt produced in large numbers yet, no more then 5-10 built. The PAK-FA should fly this year, hoppfully later by the end of the summer. Some bad quality MiG-29s has been announced to be joining the air force, have they done so? Also in 2007 it was announced that one new Tu-160 Blackjack would be joining the airforce every second year...so where is the 2009 plane?
Army.
Dont relly know much about it. The T-95 is still no were to be seen. Read somewhere that alot of older tanks is going to be scraped.
Navy.
The first Borei submarine is in sea trials....yeah! However the new SLBM, Bulava, is continuing to fail and the whole program has been delayed again. So the first submarine probably wont be in service until late 2010.
One new graney SSN submarine has been laid down in July and the first one could be launced be the end of the year.
Rocket forces.
65 Topol-Ms has now been put in service. 6 more are to be activated in 2009, three of them should be of the new RS-24 model. This is an lower number if compared with 2008 when 11 ICBMs was deployed.
T-90 production was the most I think last year for the T-90... if not 2008 I think in 2007. That was about 150+ tanks. 60+ of those entered service with the Defense Ministry while the rest went to India and Algeria. Currently, 900+ have been built and a further 300+ T-72Bs have been modernized to the T-90 standard. I distinctly remember reading this in some source, and since I have long forgotten what that source was anyone else is free to find it. If not, then correct me if I'm wrong.
Regarding the T-95... I think the Russian's won't say anything about it until it rolls down the Parade Ground next year or in the future... assuming that the Russian Government has already ordered any or whether or not it's development phase is done at all. Rumors are that the tank will be produced next year. But, we all know that rumors can sometimes be false.
I do however, find the T-100 Ogre from Tom Clancy's EndWar to be a the closest thing to a depiction, albeit it's 125mm gun still makes me wonder whether or not Ubisoft was actually basing the thing on the T-95 itself. Perhaps they were going for more of the Ob 640 look. The Ogre seems to have various traits of a T-72, T-80 and T-90 mashed together. Shtora, ERA, and a really interesting Anti-Aircraft mount that can be seen on a T-72M4CZ are examples of such traits. Funnily enough, Ubisoft sources are often vague in describing the specifications of the tank.
Regarding the T-95... I think the Russian's won't say anything about it until it rolls down the Parade Ground next year or in the future... assuming that the Russian Government has already ordered any or whether or not it's development phase is done at all. Rumors are that the tank will be produced next year. But, we all know that rumors can sometimes be false.
I do however, find the T-100 Ogre from Tom Clancy's EndWar to be a the closest thing to a depiction, albeit it's 125mm gun still makes me wonder whether or not Ubisoft was actually basing the thing on the T-95 itself. Perhaps they were going for more of the Ob 640 look. The Ogre seems to have various traits of a T-72, T-80 and T-90 mashed together. Shtora, ERA, and a really interesting Anti-Aircraft mount that can be seen on a T-72M4CZ are examples of such traits. Funnily enough, Ubisoft sources are often vague in describing the specifications of the tank.
It is fairly easy to describe future Russian military capabilities:
- Russian Navy is in state of complete collapse. No shipbuilding program exists in Russia for twenty years. Only several very old post-Soviet vessels enter service after dozen or so years spent in shipyard. Even planned ship modernizations take enormously long time and often end in ship's scrapping. It is believed Russian Navy spends all money for naval nuclear deterrence force (new SSBNs and failed Bulava program) so other Navy branches are constantly without any real financial resources. Russia probably lost capability to build modern surface ships and now there is discussion in Russia whether or not to buy older ships abroad.
- Russian aviation (RuAF) now has less than 500 combat ready military aircrafts. Almost all of them are twenty years old now outdated platforms. Possibly in the next decade all post-Soviet planes will be withdrawn from service. Now there are only marginal signs of improvement: Russian Aviation wants to buy 48 Su-35 fighters up to 2015. About thirty or so MiG-29SMT fighters entered RuAF a year ago (these planes were dropped by Algeria due to their poor physical condition - not very attractive piece of equipment for RuAF, I think). Anyway ridiculous fighters in comparison with contemporary F-22 and F-35 jets especially PAK-FA project future is uncertain. Su-34 acquisition program is very slow so old Su-24 bombers are still the main striking force. Only 80 Su-25 planes are airworthy platforms now being modernized to Su-25SM standard. New Mi-28N helicopter gunships have to enter service because all Mi-24s simply rust but this platform is very vulnerable because of outdated fire-control system and weapons. All in entire RuAF is now less powerful than IAF, THK, ROKAF not mention about USAF.
- Russian ground forces: as you probably know they will have 2000 older tank models (T-90, T-72B, T-80B). I don't expect so called T-95 to be fielded in the near future. Besides this is very expensive toy (maybe even several times more costly than T-90) so Russia will be able to buy them only in deplorably small numbers. After military reform Russian Army will consist about 7 Soviet-style divisions equivalent force and 250 thousand ground troops without mobilization base. Of course such low numbers, taking into account Russia's vast landmass, means very weak forces present on each strategic direction. In sum Russia will not be in position to wage war with Ukraine, Turkey, Iran, North Korea not mention about antire NATO and China. Only small and weak post-Soviet republics will be prone to Russian military pressure.
- Russian nuclear forces now are in process of reduction even up to French level. Recently announced START III Treaty is a misunderstanding. Simply US will remove their nuclear warheads from launchers and place them in depots. On the other hand Russia will have to destroy all very old post-Soviet delivery vehicles not being capable to replace them in adequate numbers. Adding overwhelming US superiority in conventional PGMs able to destroy Russian nuclear targets and broad American anti-missile effort there will be no strategic parity between both sides but US nuclear supremacy, instead. We shall see if China greatly enlarge its strategic potential in the next decade. Chinese SSBN program suggests so because several brand-new 094 Jin boomers enter service equipped with JL-2 MIRV-ed intercontinental missile and there are rumors that 096 Tang SSBN project is under consideration, too.
Overall Russia will become second rank nuclear power and meaningless conventional power in the next decade. It is a "great" achievement as for former military superpower!
- Russian Navy is in state of complete collapse. No shipbuilding program exists in Russia for twenty years. Only several very old post-Soviet vessels enter service after dozen or so years spent in shipyard. Even planned ship modernizations take enormously long time and often end in ship's scrapping. It is believed Russian Navy spends all money for naval nuclear deterrence force (new SSBNs and failed Bulava program) so other Navy branches are constantly without any real financial resources. Russia probably lost capability to build modern surface ships and now there is discussion in Russia whether or not to buy older ships abroad.
- Russian aviation (RuAF) now has less than 500 combat ready military aircrafts. Almost all of them are twenty years old now outdated platforms. Possibly in the next decade all post-Soviet planes will be withdrawn from service. Now there are only marginal signs of improvement: Russian Aviation wants to buy 48 Su-35 fighters up to 2015. About thirty or so MiG-29SMT fighters entered RuAF a year ago (these planes were dropped by Algeria due to their poor physical condition - not very attractive piece of equipment for RuAF, I think). Anyway ridiculous fighters in comparison with contemporary F-22 and F-35 jets especially PAK-FA project future is uncertain. Su-34 acquisition program is very slow so old Su-24 bombers are still the main striking force. Only 80 Su-25 planes are airworthy platforms now being modernized to Su-25SM standard. New Mi-28N helicopter gunships have to enter service because all Mi-24s simply rust but this platform is very vulnerable because of outdated fire-control system and weapons. All in entire RuAF is now less powerful than IAF, THK, ROKAF not mention about USAF.
- Russian ground forces: as you probably know they will have 2000 older tank models (T-90, T-72B, T-80B). I don't expect so called T-95 to be fielded in the near future. Besides this is very expensive toy (maybe even several times more costly than T-90) so Russia will be able to buy them only in deplorably small numbers. After military reform Russian Army will consist about 7 Soviet-style divisions equivalent force and 250 thousand ground troops without mobilization base. Of course such low numbers, taking into account Russia's vast landmass, means very weak forces present on each strategic direction. In sum Russia will not be in position to wage war with Ukraine, Turkey, Iran, North Korea not mention about antire NATO and China. Only small and weak post-Soviet republics will be prone to Russian military pressure.
- Russian nuclear forces now are in process of reduction even up to French level. Recently announced START III Treaty is a misunderstanding. Simply US will remove their nuclear warheads from launchers and place them in depots. On the other hand Russia will have to destroy all very old post-Soviet delivery vehicles not being capable to replace them in adequate numbers. Adding overwhelming US superiority in conventional PGMs able to destroy Russian nuclear targets and broad American anti-missile effort there will be no strategic parity between both sides but US nuclear supremacy, instead. We shall see if China greatly enlarge its strategic potential in the next decade. Chinese SSBN program suggests so because several brand-new 094 Jin boomers enter service equipped with JL-2 MIRV-ed intercontinental missile and there are rumors that 096 Tang SSBN project is under consideration, too.
Overall Russia will become second rank nuclear power and meaningless conventional power in the next decade. It is a "great" achievement as for former military superpower!
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You can't blame the Kremlin for lying.Absolutely not, Comrade!
Read more about real state of Russian Army and MIC in professional press both Western and Russian instead of buying Kremlin's military propaganda bullshit all the time.
No sane government would go out there and admit that it's army is basically a crippled and dying old man. That would give it a very bad political and military impression throughout the world.
Recent announcements about new Russian combat aircraft acquisition plan up to 2015:
- 48 Su-35
- 4 Su-30M2
- 12 Su-27SM
- 32 Su-34
- 12 Ka-52
- a few dozen Mi-28N
In sum VVS will get 64 fighters, 32 tactical bombers, about fifty gunships and that's all. Almost all of these platforms are old designs and not on par with modern Western weapons. Above data also suggest modernization of Su-27 fighters is over after about 30-40 of them upgraded to now very primitive SM standard. It means all remaining post-Soviet planes will be scrapped so VVS will have more than a hundred fighters (Su-35, Su-27SM, MiG-29SMT) built or modernized after 1991, thirty such bombers and about eighty Su-25 upgraded to SM variant. Simply tactical aviation in Russia will disappear!
- 48 Su-35
- 4 Su-30M2
- 12 Su-27SM
- 32 Su-34
- 12 Ka-52
- a few dozen Mi-28N
In sum VVS will get 64 fighters, 32 tactical bombers, about fifty gunships and that's all. Almost all of these platforms are old designs and not on par with modern Western weapons. Above data also suggest modernization of Su-27 fighters is over after about 30-40 of them upgraded to now very primitive SM standard. It means all remaining post-Soviet planes will be scrapped so VVS will have more than a hundred fighters (Su-35, Su-27SM, MiG-29SMT) built or modernized after 1991, thirty such bombers and about eighty Su-25 upgraded to SM variant. Simply tactical aviation in Russia will disappear!