If you want something in the C-130J weight class (actually, a bit more load capacity both in weight & dimensions) there's also the KC-390, & the engines are on thousands of commercial aircraft.
Indonesian Aero News
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Ananda
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Yes, Embrear KC-390 on paper will be good alternative for J. As just you said, using commercialy common engine class, also make it attracitive package.
However somehow from what I know, TNI-AU did not considered it as alternative for C-130 J. As TNI-AU already used Embrear product (Super Tucano), my suspicions is more on KC-390 it self and not Embrear as TNI-AU seemingly reluctance.
Got some uncomfirmed info (other word on unofficial talked), that TNI-AU from start only want to have more advance C-130 series for this class. As KC-390 considered simmilar class, then it's hard for KC-390 chances on being even considered.
For smaller one they go with CN-235 and latter C-295. Again talked shown C-27 is prefered by some brass, but with Airbus military close connetion with DI, it's politically hard to defeat Airbus Military products in Indonesia. Look at AW-101 fiasco..as long as DI involved with Caracal production ecosystem, then airbus product more likely will be choosen.
A400M is not C-130 replacement, it's for heavier and longer range transport. Despite talked officially that IL-76 and C-17 also being considered as running candidates in that class, for reasoning that I've mentioned before all indication will shown direction to A400M.
Just like official sellection candidates for smaller transport stated C295 and C27, rumored say even Alenia people only come once to demo C27, and not bother much caused they know odd in Indonesia will strongly favoured C295.
Boeing is one supplier that rumored have relative simmilar strength as Airbus, on lobbying Indonesian decission makers. Thus it will be interested to see when selection on Tanker KC-330 MRTT and KC-46 (or 767 commercial based Tanker variance) being contested.
However somehow from what I know, TNI-AU did not considered it as alternative for C-130 J. As TNI-AU already used Embrear product (Super Tucano), my suspicions is more on KC-390 it self and not Embrear as TNI-AU seemingly reluctance.
Got some uncomfirmed info (other word on unofficial talked), that TNI-AU from start only want to have more advance C-130 series for this class. As KC-390 considered simmilar class, then it's hard for KC-390 chances on being even considered.
For smaller one they go with CN-235 and latter C-295. Again talked shown C-27 is prefered by some brass, but with Airbus military close connetion with DI, it's politically hard to defeat Airbus Military products in Indonesia. Look at AW-101 fiasco..as long as DI involved with Caracal production ecosystem, then airbus product more likely will be choosen.
A400M is not C-130 replacement, it's for heavier and longer range transport. Despite talked officially that IL-76 and C-17 also being considered as running candidates in that class, for reasoning that I've mentioned before all indication will shown direction to A400M.
Just like official sellection candidates for smaller transport stated C295 and C27, rumored say even Alenia people only come once to demo C27, and not bother much caused they know odd in Indonesia will strongly favoured C295.
Boeing is one supplier that rumored have relative simmilar strength as Airbus, on lobbying Indonesian decission makers. Thus it will be interested to see when selection on Tanker KC-330 MRTT and KC-46 (or 767 commercial based Tanker variance) being contested.
Sandhi Yudha
Well-Known Member
Thank you for your explanation Ananda!
Here some IPTN news
I didn't know Nepal ordered a CN235 from IPTN....well, they ordered it in Juni 2017.
Here an article about the livery of some NC212i to foreign costumers.
PTDI Kirim Pesawat NC212i Pesanan Vietnam dan Filipina
Jumat 08 Juni 2018, 16:53 WIB
Redaksi Oleh : Desy Viani
Foto Oleh : PTDI
BANDUNG, (PRFM) - Pesawat terbang NC212i buatan PT Dirgantara Indonesia (Persero) (PTDI) kembali diakui di kancah internasional. Pada 15 Mei 2018 lalu, Angkatan Udara Vietnam telah menerima 2 (dua) unit, dan 6 Juni 2018 kemarin kembali dikirimkan 1 unit pesawat NC212i dari total 3 unit pesanan pesawat NC212i.
PTDI melakukan ferry flight 2 unit pesawat terbang NC212i untuk Angkatan Udara Filipina dari Bandara Internasional Husein Sastranegara Bandung menuju Bandara Internasional Clark, Filipina, Jumat (8/6/2018). Rute yang dilalui mulai dari Bandung – Banjarmasin – Tarakan – Bandara Internasional Clark, Filipina.
Complete article at http://prfmnews.com/berita.php?detail=ptdi-kirim-pesawat-nc212i-pesanan-vietnam-dan-filipina
So in total five NC212s will be delivered this month. I wonder what actually the difference is between the standard NC212-400 and the NC212i.
Here some IPTN news
Complete article at RI Akan Ekspor Pesawat Militer ke Nepal dan Senegal
I didn't know Nepal ordered a CN235 from IPTN....well, they ordered it in Juni 2017.
So it seems the production of a CN235 needs 12 months... :-D
Here an article about the livery of some NC212i to foreign costumers.
PTDI Kirim Pesawat NC212i Pesanan Vietnam dan Filipina
Jumat 08 Juni 2018, 16:53 WIB
Redaksi Oleh : Desy Viani
Foto Oleh : PTDI
BANDUNG, (PRFM) - Pesawat terbang NC212i buatan PT Dirgantara Indonesia (Persero) (PTDI) kembali diakui di kancah internasional. Pada 15 Mei 2018 lalu, Angkatan Udara Vietnam telah menerima 2 (dua) unit, dan 6 Juni 2018 kemarin kembali dikirimkan 1 unit pesawat NC212i dari total 3 unit pesanan pesawat NC212i.
PTDI melakukan ferry flight 2 unit pesawat terbang NC212i untuk Angkatan Udara Filipina dari Bandara Internasional Husein Sastranegara Bandung menuju Bandara Internasional Clark, Filipina, Jumat (8/6/2018). Rute yang dilalui mulai dari Bandung – Banjarmasin – Tarakan – Bandara Internasional Clark, Filipina.
Complete article at http://prfmnews.com/berita.php?detail=ptdi-kirim-pesawat-nc212i-pesanan-vietnam-dan-filipina
So in total five NC212s will be delivered this month. I wonder what actually the difference is between the standard NC212-400 and the NC212i.
Ananda
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It's marketing gimmic. NC212-400 is NC212i. From what I see, since AIRBUS moved all C212 production facilities from Spain to DI facility in Bandung, DI then decided to call all C212-400 as NC212i, as marketing gimmick for DI product image.
That's not quite correct. There has been some incremental improvements. Internal space has been rearranged with some components moved to the nose, resulting in increased passenger space (28 vs. 25 in the commercial passenger airline config). Indonesian Aerospace also says the avionics have been updated, though they didn't provide details. However, we know from the delivery delay that the autopilot has been changed, because otherwise there wouldn't need to wait for certification. It's likely that there are other changes to the avionics.
None of the changes are major, but neither it is just a rebranded C-212-400.
EDIT: Way back in 2013 there's a press release from Airbus Military announcing the joint development of the NC-212i. Underlining mine.
Ananda
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Latest Indonesia News - ANTARA News
Stronger signal that they want J as replacement for older C-130. I suspect's for B replacement.
Seems despite some work has been done in improving the B's to H's standard, age finally catching up.
Stronger signal that they want J as replacement for older C-130. I suspect's for B replacement.
Seems despite some work has been done in improving the B's to H's standard, age finally catching up.
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Ananda
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This picture being uploaded to local Defense Blog. Seems it's models of KC-46 and Wedgetail that's part of previous discussion between Boeing team and Indonesian Mindef team.
TNI-AU chief was being stated in media on their intention to replace 3 existing B-737 2X9 Surveilance from the 80's, with simmilar class aircraft but with more updated in technology survailance aircraft.
Simmilar aircraft tend to indicate they want another 737 based survailance aircraft.
On other occasion TNI-AU sources in media talk the survailance capabilities must have better radar capabilities than present AN/APS 135 SLAMMR in 2x9 Survailance. They also indicating asside having AEW capabilities the new survailance aircraft also still maintain surface and maritim survailance capabilities that present 2X9 has.
KC-46 is being indicated by Air Force chief as one of two multirole tankers beside A-330 MRTT, that being considered by TNI-AU.
Local MRO capabilities in Indonesia by Garuda seems shown A-330 based aircraft will have advantages over 767 based aircraft (alltough Garuda's MRO also being reported has license on 767 MRO).
Still if I have to speculate, if the Airbus military got contract for A-400 from state own enterprise ministry (which reported also will have air refueling capabilities), then to keep balance order between Airbus and Boeing, it's potential KC-46 will get the conttact.
TNI-AU chief was being stated in media on their intention to replace 3 existing B-737 2X9 Surveilance from the 80's, with simmilar class aircraft but with more updated in technology survailance aircraft.
Simmilar aircraft tend to indicate they want another 737 based survailance aircraft.
On other occasion TNI-AU sources in media talk the survailance capabilities must have better radar capabilities than present AN/APS 135 SLAMMR in 2x9 Survailance. They also indicating asside having AEW capabilities the new survailance aircraft also still maintain surface and maritim survailance capabilities that present 2X9 has.
KC-46 is being indicated by Air Force chief as one of two multirole tankers beside A-330 MRTT, that being considered by TNI-AU.
Local MRO capabilities in Indonesia by Garuda seems shown A-330 based aircraft will have advantages over 767 based aircraft (alltough Garuda's MRO also being reported has license on 767 MRO).
Still if I have to speculate, if the Airbus military got contract for A-400 from state own enterprise ministry (which reported also will have air refueling capabilities), then to keep balance order between Airbus and Boeing, it's potential KC-46 will get the conttact.
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Ananda
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Indonesia develops gunship variant of CN-235 aircraft | Jane's 360
Seems DI/IAe has green light to develope CN235 gunship that's being talked for some time. Jordan already developed their own version of CN235 gunship. Local talked unconfirmed report that some involvement on DI's technicians on previous Jordan CN235 project.
The concept of CN235 gunship has been put by DI from IPTN era in the 90's.. previous concept put old bofors 40mm as primary and 20mm gun as secondary...
Now the concept being put to 30mm DEFA with no secondary gun (being replace with more targeting sensors)..
Seems DI/IAe has green light to develope CN235 gunship that's being talked for some time. Jordan already developed their own version of CN235 gunship. Local talked unconfirmed report that some involvement on DI's technicians on previous Jordan CN235 project.
The concept of CN235 gunship has been put by DI from IPTN era in the 90's.. previous concept put old bofors 40mm as primary and 20mm gun as secondary...
Now the concept being put to 30mm DEFA with no secondary gun (being replace with more targeting sensors)..
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Ananda
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Latest Indonesia News - ANTARA News
Further development on C130 J. Indonesian Minister of Defense in Washington during talk with secretary Mattis.
Other transport items being talked speculate as Chinook heavy transport helicopters..as this already being talked as Indonesian Army interest for some time.
Further development on C130 J. Indonesian Minister of Defense in Washington during talk with secretary Mattis.
Other transport items being talked speculate as Chinook heavy transport helicopters..as this already being talked as Indonesian Army interest for some time.
John Fedup
The Bunker Group
I guess Airbus can't be very surprised by this decision. Airforces with limited funding just don't need the risk. In a few years, after proven service, the A400M may get a second chance in non-Euro markets but by then other contenders may have working planes, some of them cost effective.
Ananda
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Well, as I have post it before..A400M is never being considered by TNI-AU with their own budget. So far the only possible interest for A400M coming from State owned enterprises ministry for their owned Air Bridge commercial operation.
In sense the ministry sees potential logistics''commercial" operation by state owned companies to eastern Indonesia isles. The rational is that commercial logistics to those area are more economical using large transport aircraft with STOL capabilities to handle smaller airports in the area.
So "if" it coming to fruition, those aircraft will not be proccure using defense Budget but will used state owned enterprises (SOE) budget...thus commercial money and will run also commercially.
Airbus proves out A400M’s humanitarian relief capabilities in wake of Indonesian quakes | Jane's 360
Airbus still doing their proved of concepts with the latest using French AF A400M that being transit in Jakarta after participating in Australian Pitch Black.
The concept is not new, again as I mentioned on previous posts..during Soeharto era..one of SOE (Pelita Air) which is subsidiary of State Owned oil company Pertamina, procurred C-160 Transall for similar commercial needs in Eastern Indonesia isles. The number is not clear, but safe to say between 3 to 6 aircraft.
In reality, those aircraft also being used to supplement AF C-130 if needed during military operation in East Timor and Papua.
Those C-160 never used AF budget on operation and maintenance, thus not burden AF infrastuctures for the need on maintaining other transport aircraft outside C130..
This similar concept which seems being pondered now by SOE ministry for A400M "if" they decided to procurred this commercial air bridge operation.
Just to add, the concept of using SOE to procurred transport aircraft that latter being used for AF need or even later transferred to AF inventory also happen with L-100 (civilian version of C130) procurement. Around 4 to 6 L-100 being procurred by Pelita and Merpati air for commercial operation also mostly in eastern Indonesia. Those aircraft now all being transferred to TNI-AU inventory to augment their C-130 fleet.
In sense the ministry sees potential logistics''commercial" operation by state owned companies to eastern Indonesia isles. The rational is that commercial logistics to those area are more economical using large transport aircraft with STOL capabilities to handle smaller airports in the area.
So "if" it coming to fruition, those aircraft will not be proccure using defense Budget but will used state owned enterprises (SOE) budget...thus commercial money and will run also commercially.
Airbus proves out A400M’s humanitarian relief capabilities in wake of Indonesian quakes | Jane's 360
Airbus still doing their proved of concepts with the latest using French AF A400M that being transit in Jakarta after participating in Australian Pitch Black.
The concept is not new, again as I mentioned on previous posts..during Soeharto era..one of SOE (Pelita Air) which is subsidiary of State Owned oil company Pertamina, procurred C-160 Transall for similar commercial needs in Eastern Indonesia isles. The number is not clear, but safe to say between 3 to 6 aircraft.
In reality, those aircraft also being used to supplement AF C-130 if needed during military operation in East Timor and Papua.
Those C-160 never used AF budget on operation and maintenance, thus not burden AF infrastuctures for the need on maintaining other transport aircraft outside C130..
This similar concept which seems being pondered now by SOE ministry for A400M "if" they decided to procurred this commercial air bridge operation.
Just to add, the concept of using SOE to procurred transport aircraft that latter being used for AF need or even later transferred to AF inventory also happen with L-100 (civilian version of C130) procurement. Around 4 to 6 L-100 being procurred by Pelita and Merpati air for commercial operation also mostly in eastern Indonesia. Those aircraft now all being transferred to TNI-AU inventory to augment their C-130 fleet.
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Ananda
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Indonesia akan beli Hercules dan Helikopter Chinook - ANTARA News
Further confirmation from Indonesian minister of defence after another session with US secretary Mattis on procurement for C-130J and batch of Chinnok.
In this communique, it's confirmed by him, the J's is to replace the B's in TNI-AU inventory with first batch of 5 first.
Further confirmation from Indonesian minister of defence after another session with US secretary Mattis on procurement for C-130J and batch of Chinnok.
In this communique, it's confirmed by him, the J's is to replace the B's in TNI-AU inventory with first batch of 5 first.
Ananda
The Bunker Group
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Renegotiations for Jet Fighter Project Aim to Ease Burden on State Budget
It's been few days old. Don't have times to put it before.
Not really surprising..since the sign for negotiation has been there for few months.
I already put in previous posts on my own opinion of this project in Indonesia's side.
Politically in my opinion the present admin doesn't have enough 'grid' or 'push' for this project cause it:s developed by previous admin. Thus if something happen on economics side, this kind of project can be sacrifice..
Although they already put initial investments in term of building infrastuctures in DI for fast jets line..but those investments can still be used for other projects. That's lead to other potential being forwarded, such as Airbus for Eurojets assemble and part manufacturing..and SAAB with similar scheme they are offering to Brazil for Gripen.
The laungeges on this coominique also bit 'hazy' in my oppinion..is it negotiation on payment, or manufacturing or export rights they after ?
I mean if you only put 20% then how you expect to have same manufacturing, and export rights as Korea that put 80% ?
I do feel more on political face saving in here..some factions in present admin don't want to continue the project..thus try come out with negotiation scheme that in the end will gave them reasoning to left the project..
The project it self being used by some factions in opposition side..to see if This administration has enough support for local defense industry development..
I might be wrong..but we'll see..
It's been few days old. Don't have times to put it before.
Not really surprising..since the sign for negotiation has been there for few months.
I already put in previous posts on my own opinion of this project in Indonesia's side.
Politically in my opinion the present admin doesn't have enough 'grid' or 'push' for this project cause it:s developed by previous admin. Thus if something happen on economics side, this kind of project can be sacrifice..
Although they already put initial investments in term of building infrastuctures in DI for fast jets line..but those investments can still be used for other projects. That's lead to other potential being forwarded, such as Airbus for Eurojets assemble and part manufacturing..and SAAB with similar scheme they are offering to Brazil for Gripen.
The laungeges on this coominique also bit 'hazy' in my oppinion..is it negotiation on payment, or manufacturing or export rights they after ?
I mean if you only put 20% then how you expect to have same manufacturing, and export rights as Korea that put 80% ?
I do feel more on political face saving in here..some factions in present admin don't want to continue the project..thus try come out with negotiation scheme that in the end will gave them reasoning to left the project..
The project it self being used by some factions in opposition side..to see if This administration has enough support for local defense industry development..
I might be wrong..but we'll see..
Why does Indonesia have so few helicopters?
Ananda
The Bunker Group
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Flight Global World Air Force balance put overall Indonesian armed forces helicopters in 150+. That's slightly ahead of overall Vietnam armed forces helicopters and below Thailand armed forces helicopters that put Thailand in term of quantity as #1 in SEA/ASEAN region.
Both Thailand and Indonesia have majority of helicopters in Army Aviation.
However in term of quality.. Singapore armed forces helicopters even tough only rank #4 in quantity..but no doubt can be rank #1 in quality in SEA region.
So with that number probably only less than 20 nations in the world that have more helicopters than Indonesia. So I don't think Indonesia have too few helicopters..it should have more, considered the area it has to covered..but not too few either..
Both Thailand and Indonesia have majority of helicopters in Army Aviation.
However in term of quality.. Singapore armed forces helicopters even tough only rank #4 in quantity..but no doubt can be rank #1 in quality in SEA region.
So with that number probably only less than 20 nations in the world that have more helicopters than Indonesia. So I don't think Indonesia have too few helicopters..it should have more, considered the area it has to covered..but not too few either..
Sandhi Yudha
Well-Known Member
Any more new recent newsarticles or information about the EH-101 saga?
This is the latest info i could get.
Mantan KSAU Curigai Agenda di Balik Kasus Heli AW-101
Kamis, 07 Juni 2018 – 02:46 WIB
jpnn.com, JAKARTA - Mantan Kepala Staf TNI Angkatan Udara (KSAU) Marsekal (Purn) Agus Supriatna menyatakan, penanganan kasus dugaan korupsi pengadaan helikopter AW-101 sebenarnya tidak perlu diwarnai kegaduhan. Pria kelahiran Bandung, 18 Januari 1959 itu menegaskan, masalah helikopter buatan AgustaWestland itu sebenarnya bisa diselesaikan jika pihak-pihak yang terkait bisa duduk bersama.
Menurut Agus, harusnya menteri pertahanan, Panglima TNI Marsekal Hadi Tjahjanto dan pendahulunya, Gatot Nurmantyo bisa duduk bersama. “Kita pecahkan bersama," ujarnya usai menjalani pemeriksaan sebagai saksi bagi tersangka atas nama Irfan Saleh di gedung Merah Putih KPK, Jakarta Selatan, Rabu (6/6).
Agus mengatakan dirinya tak menginginkan kegaduhan sejak awal persoalan helikopter AW-101 mengemuka. Sebab pengadaan helikopter helikopter itu mengikuti mekanisme di UU APBN.
Complete article at: Mantan KSAU Curigai Agenda di Balik Kasus Heli AW-101