Indonesia: 'green water navy'

madokafc

Member
Jane's article detailed the specifications of the DRU OPV. The CMS is confirmed to be the Advent combat system from Havelsan. The ships will come with a 76mm SuperRapid with FFBNW provisions for 2x 20mm cannons amid-ship, a 35mm CIWS, 8x AShMs, variable depth sonar, and decoy launchers.

I wonder if they intentionally left out provisions for VLS missiles and MANPADS. Seems a bit dumb to not a equip a ship of this size with missiles for self-defense. Even the Parchims that these OPV's are supposed to replace are equipped with 2x SA-N-5's MANPADS.



I think that was the intention from the get go. But again it slightly feels inadequate in the sense that the 35mm CIWS is the only form of self-defense that the class has.
Combo of strales fired from Super Rapido Oto Melara 76 mm gun and 35 mm CIWS is more better compared to those Parchim self defense measure. Not to mention they are getting European ESM and decoy system
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

Jane's got confirmation from PAL that their agreement with Babcock related to Two Iver based Frigates that they signed preliminary contract in early 2020. This Two Iver based Frigates were using those funding that originally going to be used for PKR SIGMA #3&4.

This is answer the question why only for Two Frigates license agreement with Babcock so far. Because it is still related to previous Iver Based contract they have with Odense. Seems Odense now working with Babcock on finalising design on anyone that want to use Iver based design.

This is also means it coming from last term program, and no present term frigates program commencing yet. Well, unless those FREMM (which definetely originate for this term program), actually already been finalised.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

The tweet of Indonesian negotiations with TKMS for 214. (Although seems there's typo on 212) being rumours create more anxiety for Frenchie sales agent (Tweeter guy) as Naval Group already lost in Frigates and now potentially in Submarine too. Again all of this just put as grain of salt.

I put that tweet not as reliable source of information, however more to shown how the 'noise' on Indonesian defense procurement are getting louder closer to the time on Political commitment need to shown results. Just like below articles.


While one of Jokowi's chief minister talk in media that all new defense equipment will begin to come on the next two years. Shown how defense procurement tightly related to Political Agenda as I have put in Indonesia AF Thread.

So whatever the choice, it will be compromise balance between users (TNI) need and which one provide 'better' benefits for Political Image toward next election, and off course budget availability.

Again all of information on Indonesian Defense procurement deals will always can be change at moment notices. Nothing is certain until the payment is delivered and production commencing.
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member

The tweet of Indonesian negotiations with TKMS for 214. (Although seems there's typo on 212) being rumours create more anxiety for Frenchie sales agent (Tweeter guy) as Naval Group already lost in Frigates and now potentially in Submarine too. Again all of this just put as grain of salt.

I put that tweet not as reliable source of information, however more to shown how the 'noise' on Indonesian defense procurement are getting louder closer to the time on Political commitment need to shown results. Just like below articles.


While one of Jokowi's chief minister talk in media that all new defense equipment will begin to come on the next two years. Shown how defense procurement tightly related to Political Agenda as I have put in Indonesia AF Thread.

So whatever the choice, it will be compromise balance between users (TNI) need and which one provide 'better' benefits for Political Image toward next election, and off course budget availability.

Again all of information on Indonesian Defense procurement deals will always can be change at moment notices. Nothing is certain until the payment is delivered and production commencing.
Oh no, not again a new candidate for defence equipment ....
But wait....isn't this old news from begin this year?
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
Yes, that's what I meant. The closer the Administration must meet their decision time, the Political Establishment begin talking more, the restless the sales team become, and more 'noise' getting out.

All of this shown how Defense Procurement in Indonesia in this Administrations very interconnected with Politics and Business opportunities. Just hoping the real need of the users (TNI) does not become back seater. That's where 'sanity' check is needed.

TKMS, DSME, NG are all contenders on Indonesian Submarine programs. The closer the time they need to make decision, the more 'noises' that come out. Afterall Defense is big business, many interest play.

Why it's closer to decision time, because they commit in two years time new assets shouls begin to come as Mahfud put it in media. Why two years ? It's election time.
 

madokafc

Member

Ananda

The Bunker Group
Defense corps is dubious source
Agree on that. It is put before to highlight this point:

The closer the Administration must meet their decision time, the Political Establishment begin talking more, the restless the sales team become, and more 'noise' getting out.
They (this administration) have to make decisions soon (on defense procurement Projects), as it's getting closer to election time. They need it to gain some Political capital for next election. Especially for Prabowo's or even any wannabe candidates from current ruling coalition.

This's the time where many conflicting information will circles around.
 

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Netizens millennials generation 'alay'. I'm sure 99% of those netizens don't even knows what's the purpose of an LHD anyway. Why don't they demand for budget to equipped all current Frigates and Corvettes with ASW helo before talking on LHD/Carrier.
They'd be wanting to put 16in guns on it and operate the F-22 off it. :D
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

There's no demand yet for LHD from TNI-AL not only from cost to build, procured and operating. However also because for Archipelago operation more LPD or more LST will be preferable.

As like Kris FB shown more LST will come as they are providing more appropriate amphibious and transport need for outlying islands within archipelago. 1LHD equivalent on operating 3-4 LPD or 5-6 LST (at least on capacity wise), but for Archipelago operations more amphibious hulls have more merit than one large hull.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group

Put it in here, as this is the gun that veing choose for KCR 60 #1&2. Bofors already talk that their 57mm Mk3 already choosed as main gun for KCR #3-#6. However knowing Indonesian procurememt, anything can change.
 

Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member

Put it in here, as this is the gun that veing choose for KCR 60 #1&2. Bofors already talk that their 57mm Mk3 already choosed as main gun for KCR #3-#6. However knowing Indonesian procurememt, anything can change.
Are those 4 Bofors 57 mm Mk3 guns already officially ordered?


Here are some interesting photos of KRI I Gusti Ngurah Rai 332 and KRI Bontang 907.
Including a close-up of the MICA VL launcher.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
those 4 Bofors 57 mm Mk3 guns already officially ordered?
Haven't found anything official that say the definitive contract already sign, or Bofors already building the assets ordered. So far only the 2019 Bofors announcement that announced preliminary contracts for 4 Bofors 57mm Mk3 for KCR 60.

That's why I still say anything can happen. Eventough considering KCR 60 #3 to #6 are using Western standard sensors suits, it's likely Bofors is the preferred choices.
 

deadlast

New Member
Haven't found anything official that say the definitive contract already sign, or Bofors already building the assets ordered. So far only the 2019 Bofors announcement that announced preliminary contracts for 4 Bofors 57mm Mk3 for KCR 60.

That's why I still say anything can happen. Eventough considering KCR 60 #3 to #6 are using Western standard sensors suits, it's likely Bofors is the preferred choices.
http://instagr.am/p/CT1z9qHl3ld/
That's the only one I can find, PT PAL in the process of installing Bofors 57mm Mk3 and 20mm gun for KRI Kerambit and probably the rest of the class.
 
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Sandhi Yudha

Well-Known Member
http://instagr.am/p/CT1z9qHl3ld/
That's the only one I can find, PT PAL in the process of installing Bofors 57mm Mk3 and 20mm gun for KRI Kerambit and probably the rest of the class.
Thank you for sharing!

It seems that the two 20 mm guns (the South-African Denel GI-2 ones?) are already placed. We just have to wait for the Bofors 57 mm Mk.3.

Btw, can this be the AU-220M 57 mm gun on the first of KCR-60 class?
 
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