European Union, member states and Agencies

SolarisKenzo

Active Member
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Wilders will need allies to form a Government, and as always in politics... he will need to make compromises.
All other political parties are more moderate and "europeists" to say the least.
He is and will be a problem for the EU, but I wouldn't worry so much about him.
Democracies tend to have a very solid "continuity" in their life.

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Fredled

Active Member
I agree with @SolarisKenzo The success of the Right Wing is essentially the consequence of pro-immigration policies and of the fact that this immigration is mainly Muslim. Muslim immigration is very special because it adds to the problem of Islamism existing in Muslim population from previous immigration waves and born in Europe. There is a real problem with the rise of Islamism and radicalisation of Islam in Europe because Islam is a civilisation incompatible with the western civilisation. For example Muslims don't accept non-Muslim authority. They can live with it, because they have to, but in their mind, European governments are not legitimate authorities to rule on Muslims. They don;t see themselves as equal to non-Muslims.

Far Right parties are more and more popular because other parties ignore this problem and encourage immigration without seeing the problem. Of course people react.

Why Far Right parties are Euro-skeptics, if not anti-EU is a complicated question.
1/ They are influenced by Russia either by direct financial aid or simply by ideology or sympathy. The RN in France has received €21 million form Russia in 2017. The Brexit has been influenced by Russia but it's not clear if there were fund transfer involved.
Putin is regarded by Right Wing supporters as sort of a guardian of traditional christian values, as an opponent to Islam and an opponent to LGBT movements, seen as decadent.
By contrast the EU is seen as promoting decadent values, the destruction of the traditional family. There is part of truth to this, but only a part of truth.

2/ There is a belief that the EU is responsible for immigration and Islamisation. That restoring internal border would limit immigration. This is false because the big immigration from Muslim countries started before the EU open border treaty. And restoring EU internal borders physically would be madness.

3/ They think the the EU is stealing sovereignty and that their country is ruled by Brussels. This is also false because the EU only reflects the will of local governments. Those who rule at the EU are the same people as those who are in local governments. You see exactly the same faces.

The war in Ukraine is adding complexity to this. There is sympathy for Putin among some, but not all, Right Wing supporters. And this can be dangerous if Right Wing politicians oppose military aid to Ukraine. Russian propaganda is often relayed by Right Wing bloggers.
 

swerve

Super Moderator
... / There is a belief that the EU is responsible for immigration and Islamisation. That restoring internal border would limit immigration. This is false because the big immigration from Muslim countries started before the EU open border treaty. And restoring EU internal borders physically would be madness. ...
Yeah, look how well it's working for us in the UK . . . .:(
 

Fredled

Active Member
@SolarisKenzo To some extent, I understand Orban: The EU withheld €30B in development fund for Hungary, but decides to donate €50B to Ukraine. He agreed to abstain from voting against accession talks the day after the EU transfer €10B to Hungary.
If the EU wants Orban to agree with the funds for Ukraine, it should give the entire sum.
The good thing is that Sholtz humiliated him by asking him to leave the room during the vote. Maybe also because an abstention can only exists if the person is not present (I don;t know). It's humiliating because it brings Orban out of the decision process.

Hadn't Orban spoken almost openly in favour of Putin, and hadn't he blocked weapon transfer to Ukraine, he would have had more friends at the EU. Notably Poland which was Orban's best ally on several matters prior to the invasion.
Peskov publicly expressing his admiration for Orban's resistance to EU pressure doesn't help his reputation.

Ultimately, the EU will give the money and Hungary will come back in line with the EU common policy.
 

Ananda

The Bunker Group
Wilders will need allies to form a Government, and as always in politics... he will need to make compromises.
All other political parties are more moderate and "europeists" to say the least.

Take some time for me to get back on Wilders, because his accession on Political fortune seems like it or not going to give flavours to EU political colours in foreseable future. This article studies shown on how Wilders doing very hard job to hide his Indisch/Indo background. Try to shown that he is genuine "white" Dutch credentials.

His Indisch background shown his hatred to Islam/Muslim as deep trauma on his part of family and communities facing being kick out from Dutch East Indies. His hatred to Islam being directed to Moroccan or Turks as practically no Indonesian Muslim want to migrate to Netherlands. Unlike ex UK colonial population, most Dutch East Indies population that still want to migrate to Netherlands only mostly the Indo/Indisch or ex KNIL soldiers that are mostly Christian/Protestant. Even Indonesian Catholics are seldom want to work in to Netherlands.

Netherlands is not popular in Indonesia, and the political standing of Wilders party has cost Netherlands some business. At least Damen loosing on further business from Indonesia seems attribute to their (Netherlands Right Wingers) attitude for defense Industry co-op with Indonesia. Wilders attitude for Pro Papua independence is also attributes toward historically West Papua being plan to be new country for the Indisch/Indo to rule over. Loosing again West Papua to Indonesia just increase their deep hatred toward Indonesian that mostly Muslim.

So colonial past is matter for some Right Wingers in Euro. Muslim Immigrants just part of what they see potential influx from ex colonials that going to threaten Euro balance. The talk to delay accepting Turkey for EU seems legit in beginning. Turkey has to reform better to be accepted. However become questionable when EU accepting Bulgaria or Rumania even Hungary that basically no better or even slightly worse then Turkey in economics or bureaucracy infrastructure.

Turkey can be argue not really Euro nation. However there's other two genuine Euro nation with large Muslim population that wants be EU members, Albania and Bosnia. Will Ukrainian and Georgian which are basically more corrupt then Albania and Bosnia will be accepted? On the cost of Albania, Bosnia or Kosovo? Again not saying Albania and Bosnia are definitely much better then Ukrainian and Georgia, but certainly not worse. Just like Turkey is not better but certainly not worse then Rumania, Bulgaria or Hunggary.

So EU just tell the truth, and not hiding on the bush. Immigrants are mostly come because there're opening for immigrants from host countries for work force or asylum acceptance. Indonesia and Malaysia now also facing problem with Rohingya refugees. They're being accepted first as part of accepting fellow Muslim in troubles. However soon they're shown not able to be integrated well toward existing society.

Just tell the immigrants that want to come (whether Muslim or Hindus or even Christian) from poorer countries, that they are only temporary there. At least that's what ROK, Japan and Taiwanese told workers from South Asia and Southeast Asia that come to work there. Yes they can be opening becoming PR, but with strictest requirements. Thus most workers understand, and mostly going back after several years there. They know they only work in Japan and ROK as part of finding experiences and money. Most are not expect to have long future live there. Many of them back and work with Japanese and ROK companies in their own countries.

Perhaps the situation dynamics are different on inter Asian relationship compare to Euro and ME-Africa relationship (which's where most Euro Immigrants coming from). Perhaps Euro should not messing with ME and Africa in the beginning. NATO involvement with Khadafi removal, French involvement in their ex colonies or EU support with Syrian civil war just adding attraction for more immigrations.
 
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