Winter uploads cool Gulf War pics!

nsdap_id

New Member
Webmaster,

If I ain't no mistaken, the second ones is Land Rover, but I dunno exact variant. Is it Defender??
Thanks anyway :smokingc:
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
We have Landrovers but not Defender 90's. I was involved with the project to modify these Landrovers in the mid to late 1990's. The SAS versions are nothing like a normal landrover. Wider bodies, longer chassis, different engine, and with the larger units that do have a windshield, it is one piece and not a split screen. The Aussie ones also use Isuzu diesels, not Landrover V8's.

The Landrovers in that pic are USMC - the grille is the identification "give away" The only other US forces that use the Landrover are the Rangers and a detachment of the US Airforce which are under the US Specops umbrella . All other US forces use Hummers.
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Winter said:
Really? I thought they were British TUM WMIKs...

I stand corrected.
Unless the Brits are sharing US vehicles... ;) The other things is the camo gear etc being worn, it isn't Brit. Check out the head gear. (helmet and sloppy hat, and the dust goggles)
 

Winter

New Member
I don't really see it...They still look like Brits to me....

For example, I believe in the image at least two soldiers can be seen clutching British SA-80 assault rifles.

Their gear appears to match up:

Helmet / sloppy hat 'BA Desert Bush Hat:'
http://www.militarykit.com/hats.shtml
http://www.allthingsmilitary.co.uk/ishop/800/shopscr1727.html
http://www.allthingsmilitary.co.uk/ishop/800/shopscr339.html

Then there is:

United States Marine Corps desert fatigues:
http://www.usmc.mil/marinelink/image1.nsf/Lookup/2003320114449/$file/ExitingBunker2_low.jpg
http://www.usmc.mil/marinelink/image1.nsf/Lookup/200415144724/$file/OIF8low.jpg

British Army desert fatigues:
http://www.transworldsurplus.co.uk/images/products/british_army_desert_smock_front.jpg
http://www.ets-news.com/images/Saif_Sareea1.jpg
http://images.usatoday.com/news/gallery/terr1018/brits.jpg

The two camoflague schemes remain markedly different, but only one matches ;)....Does the US Marine Corps use General Purpose Machine Guns on land rovers anyway?

I leave you to decide and do excuse me for the extremely poor links. I believe the image in question was obtained from the UK Ministry of Defence website...You may find more adequate images there...
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
The bottom left gun certainly looks like an SA-80. The grille on the Landrover is identical to the USMC expeditionaries. They do use the GPMG's on theirs. The helmet looks like the standard US stack hat. The brits are a bit averse to wearing US head gear.

I could be horribly wrong here... but from my database they were listed as MF Recon units.
 

Winter

New Member
Hmm...I believe there are several sub-variants of the WMIK Wolf, and certainly I have seen some with different grilles...

The most recent British Gulf WMIK's all share the same grille however, still:

http://www.operations.mod.uk/veritas/img/veritas/45cdogp/snipe_wmik.jpg
http://www.totalmodel.com/military/pages/military_25.shtml
http://www.militaryrover.34sp.com/modrov0003.html
http://www.militaryrover.34sp.com/modrov0005.html

I have also managed to back-track the photo in question, though unfortunately not from it's original MoD site:...

http://www.militaryrover.34sp.com/modrov0023.html
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
I'll have to defer to what you're saying on this, I only have one source - so there is no guarantee I'm right.

It would be interesting to get a confirmation on this, but that bottom left hand corner shot of what appears to be an SA-80 is probably the clincher.
 

Winter

New Member
I myself am seeking further comfirmation (the original source photo would be ideal but I'm having trouble finding it) but couldn't find anything at all except a stroke of look (I was not looking for this): The ear muffs appear to be Peltor Ear Defenders, which I believe are also issued to the British Army.
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
hmmmm, they don't look exactly like the displayed model... , but while you're on your sherlock holmes thing, what about the US Stack Hat, MF floppy hat, the MG's (brits were fielding Minimis like the Aussies)
and the ski goggles, which tend to be favoured by the US and Aussies..

you have a heck of a lot more patience than me... ;)

the SA-80 could be a brit assigned to the unit, the US, Aust, New Zealand and UK regularly spend time in other nations forces as part of cross training. US personnel spend a 2 year tour when they cross over to the Aust SAS. I woould assume that the Brit rotation time is the same.

Theres a lot of contradictions in that shot. I have established that its unlikely to be US Rangers though, their vehicles have been dark green in the past - so thats definitely not european green... ;)

The WMIK cage is actually an american design request that the UK then retro bought for their own SAS vehicles. It was design based on the Australian WMIK which uses a fatter roll of tuve steel.

The LH Gun mount is also the same type and in the same position as the Ranger RSOV Landrovers.
 

Winter

New Member
gf0012 said:
but while you're on your sherlock holmes thing
:frosty

gf0012 said:
I only have one source - so there is guarantee I'm right.
*raises virtual eyebrow

Right...After that last comment I pulled up every single bloody photo I could find to locate this dang controversial concotion and very nearly expiring my 56k...

...I couldn't find it.

I *think* (stressed) it is a located within the photographic galleries of the Op.Telic Index of the UK MoD site:

http://www.operations.mod.uk/telic/photo_gallery.htm

You can search for it youself if you want, browse to your heart's content, or even admire the mass incursion of Marine Force Recon commandos commencing their daring raid of stealing the entire British carpool of TUM WMIK Wolves whilst posing for the odd photo & imitating a cheeky cockney accent.
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
oops.... lol, it was supposed to say - "there is no guarantee I am right"

phat phingerz.... lol
 
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