Iran Nuclear Ambitions

toastonrye

New Member
With Iran's ongoing defiance of the UN's sanctions on there nuclear program and there continuation of implying that there nuclear program is for medical purposes only. What do you guys think America + the UN/NATO will do to stop Tehran's nuclear goals and to re-stabilize the region. Do you think with israel being threatened by a nuclear iran they will launch a preemptive strike on Iran's nuclear facilities? If Israel does, do you think israel will succeed in a war against iran and do you guys think Israel would have the worlds (if anything americas) support in ending iran nuclear program and/or a war with iran?

-thanks in advance for your input
 

toastonrye

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #2
if israel was to destroy or attack iranian nuclear facilities what do you guys think will ensue? a all-out war? if a all out war was to occur how do you guys think it will turn out.

input is greatly appreciated
 

justone

Banned Member
if israel was to destroy or attack iranian nuclear facilities what do you guys think will ensue? a all-out war? if a all out war was to occur how do you guys think it will turn out.

input is greatly appreciated
I dont want to sound too harsh but Israel will demolish Iran. Let just pray that this don't happen because there will be hell in the Middle East thousands of deaths U.S will support Israel they have strong ties that a fact. Iran will strike back and that a fact. Iranian have some internal problem also so things wont get to far but If the youth in Iran change and its energy move toward Israel that will be a problem. They feel that the Cleric or Supreme leader has turn to a crazy person or have total power The thing that scared me the most is that Iran have some underground sites and unknown sites. Seem like they are prepared for an air attack on some of there sites and have taken steps to have unknown area of nuclear activies. If attacked by Israel they will intenfied there nuclear weapons quest. It could be peaceful now but it could change if Israel attack them.
 

toastonrye

New Member
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #4
do you think that if israel takes out iran they will have a committed troop presence there to seek out hidden nuclear facilities or do you think after israel strikes there known nuclear sites that they will be atleast satisfied with that and allow foreign powers to come in and take care of the nuclear sites iran has?
 

justone

Banned Member
do you think that if israel takes out iran they will have a committed troop presence there to seek out hidden nuclear facilities or do you think after israel strikes there known nuclear sites that they will be atleast satisfied with that and allow foreign powers to come in and take care of the nuclear sites iran has?
I dont think Israel will committed troops on Iran soil there is no need to. The U.S. will do that they have best military and overall force to do it. And U.S. want revenge for what Iran has done to them from 1979 to present. Remember the real boys (blank) " dont want to said who that is" always get back when you do something to the U.S. Always remember what happen in Iraq when Sadden put U.S. pilots on TV and beat them up and show them off to the world. Now look at 2003 the invasion of Iraq they did the same on the Iraqi prisoners. Everyone always said Israel is tough they forget about the U.S. they dont play around either. But the fight in Iran will be different and will be worser with Israel troops on the ground. That when you have mad (cats)soldiers from other places joining the fight.
 
Last edited:

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
I've resurrected this thread because of an article I read in Defence News. Rep. Hunter: US Should Use Tactical Nukes on Iran if Strikes Become Necessary He's a member of the House Armed Services Committee so not just back bencher who is there to make up the numbers. Now I know he's a pollie and as a general rule it could be assumed that one saltwater croc has a higher IQ than a parliament, senate or a congress full of pollies.

The recent agreement between the US and Iran to talk and negotiate about a peacful Iranian nuclear is a breakthrough and even though some do not like it, it is far better than war. However this fulla Hunter calling for nukes to be used if a strike is needed goes well beyond the pale. I realise that the US has a no first nuke strike policy, but this fullas call is absolutely senseless and I would deem it warmongering with WMDs. If this call was made by a country that the was e.g., non Christian the US would be all over this like a rash. WMDs are nothing to be trifled with and I strongly feel that Hunter should be pulled aside by his peers and taught the error of his ways before he causes more trouble. The ramifications, if his call gets out of hand, could be very deleterious for a lot of people and not just political careers.
 

Ocean1Curse

Member
Well to be fair the stunt Iran pulled during Obama's successful pursuit of increased sanctions probably falls into the category.

TO refresh memory during Obama's inital 'year of non interference' with Iran (Which was a brilliant FP play as it effectivily neutered Iran's favored card 'the US is being unreasonable' for over half a decade), in the middle of summer there was a curious event. Namely Russia announced it had brokered a deal to enrich Iran's urnaium itself and ship the finished product into countries.

This was the sort of deal that even Neocons in the US admitted they could live with concerning Iran (Albiet through gritted teeth).

And then Iran reneged on the agreement at the 11th hour before implmentation.

But that alone doesn't end the saga.

After Obama's year was up he pursued increaseing Sanctions. Iran had the idea of presenting a alternative nuclear enrichment deal with Brazil instead of the increased sanctions... A deal that was essentially a duplicate of the oen they had brokered with Russia and then reneged on NOT 6 MONTHS EARLIER....

You can pretty much imagine the glee in the state department... not only was Irans proposed altenrative have a direct, not even a year old, precedent to indicate they weren't serious... but by pursuing the exact same plan they essentially SLAPPED Russia in the face.... which meant the US only had to focus seriously on convincing China to support the increased sanctions.

(Sadly Brazil was the big loser here as this 'deal' was supposed to be its big splash entering international politcs... but they chose... poorly...)

however... despite the above incident showing Iran isn't exaclty trustworthy...

The US have to play ball here for a simple reason... the US can't support Iranian sanctions on its own.

The fact is US sanctions on Iran reached peak efficiency back in W's day... oh they can probably crank a little more here and there, but they are well into dimishining returns on the finiancial costs to Iran from US sanctions alone.

And US sancitons alone jsut isn't enough to cut the mustard here.. oh its painful for Iran, no doubt... but hardly a mortla threat... and arguably on the razor edge of being crippling.

It's other nations sanctions that are applying the real pressure here. So they have to cater to the other nations if Iran seems willing to deal and they want to give it a shot.

They let Iran make the renege/break the trust.... They can't act first... because to do so means the US threaten being cast as the 'bad guy' and the coaltion of sanctions may break apart ... at which point IRan can start doing business with other countries freely with NO preconditions attached.

About the only good thing here is the GOP Neocons (Who are notorious for dancing to IRans fiddle on the international stage... just what we DON'T need right now... ) have little influence over this. Because the majority of sanctions are being held by other countries.... which the GOP has no direct influence over..

and very little indirect influence (even less thanks to the Shutdown... thanks Defence news for painting the GOP as nutjobs to the international community) :rolleyes:
 

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
If wasn't so serious, the call to use nukes, it'd be almost as good as a Dad and Dave show. Or maybe the Wiggles. The US federal politics has provided a fair amount of comedy over last two or so years at the expense of their own people.

Mind you we do have a political party leader here who has visions of being in Parliament and in Cabinet as a minor party. He has publicly stated he doesn't believe that the moon landings were real and that he believes in chem trails.
 

Ocean1Curse

Member
LOL. Chemtrails. That guy of ours. But when the minorities vote. The minorities rule. Yeah.

There's a lot of elements to this, including ones unrelated to Iranian nuclear industries, such as the knowledge that oil and natural gas reserves are running out and the fear that given climate change/global warming the Iranians will need to have something else they can sell.

Given the US's conduct it's a testament of Iran's restraint and the Obama administration's diplomacy that they're prepared to talk to at all. I'm not a huge fan of large parts of Obama's foreign policy but I think he really does deserve props here for bringing Iran to the table at all. They have every reason to tell him to shove it after the various American bad faith.

I think we should really take a moment to congratulate both parties on even getting this far despite their difficulties.
 

Feanor

Super Moderator
Staff member
There was some info in Russian media that Iran wants a second nuclear power plant, and is in negotiations with Russia for it. If this pans out, it could mean a fat contract for Russia, and 4 thousand megawatts for Iran.

Ð*оÑÑÐ¸Ñ Ð¼Ð¾Ð¶ÐµÑ‚ начать поÑтройку второй иранÑкой ÐÐ*С - Правда.Ð*у

Also, a reminder guys. Politics are against the forum rules. Lets keep the discussion focused on the subject.
 

My2Cents

Active Member
The US federal politics has provided a fair amount of comedy over last two or so years at the expense of their own people.
US federal politics not a comedy, it is a farce.

farce (färs) n.
  1. A light dramatic work in which highly improbable plot situations, exaggerated characters, and often slapstick elements are used for humorous effect.
  2. A ludicrous, empty show; a mockery
 

Ocean1Curse

Member
There was some info in Russian media that Iran wants a second nuclear power plant, and is in negotiations with Russia for it. If this pans out, it could mean a fat contract for Russia, and 4 thousand megawatts for Iran.



Also, a reminder guys. Politics are against the forum rules. Lets keep the discussion focused on the subject.
Iran has two reactors: a nuclear power station in Bushehr on the Gulf coast that was built with Russian help and uses Russian-supplied fuel rods; and a research reactor in Tehran that uses 20%-enriched uranium fuel and produces isotopes for medical, agricultural and other scientific uses. Iran has built a plant to make heavy water (deuterium oxide) in Arak and is building a reactor there that would use natural uranium fuel in the heavy water for its fissile reaction.

An article by The Guardian.com

Iran nuclear agreement: Q&A
Iran has struck a deal with six world powers over its nuclear programme, but what exactly has been agreed and how effective will it be in preventing Tehran from developing atomic weapons?

What nuclear technology does Iran have?

Iran has an almost complete nuclear fuel cycle – the infrastructure to manage the entire process from digging the uranium out of the ground to generating power with it. That includes uranium mines and processing plants to refine the ore into yellowcake. In Isfahan it has a uranium conversion facility that turns the yellowcake into uranium hexafluoride, a gas that can be enriched with the use of centrifuges. It has about 16,000 centrifuges in a big enrichment plant in Natanz and an underground facility at Fordow, and they produce both low-enriched uranium (LEU) and 20%-enriched uranium. The enriched uranium is taken to a fuel fabrication plant in Isfahan to be turned into oxide pellets, which are put in metal tubes to make fuel rods.

Iran has two reactors: a nuclear power station in Bushehr on the Gulf coast that was built with Russian help and uses Russian-supplied fuel rods; and a research reactor in Tehran that uses 20%-enriched uranium fuel and produces isotopes for medical, agricultural and other scientific uses. Iran has built a plant to make heavy water (deuterium oxide) in Arak and is building a reactor there that would use natural uranium fuel in the heavy water for its fissile reaction.

It does not have a reprocessing plant, the last link in the fuel cycle, which would extract plutonium from the spent fuel from the Arak reactor. That is important as plutonium is an efficient fuel for making a warhead.

How does the Geneva deal restrict it?

The deal would stop Iran making any uranium enriched to above 5% purity. It would dilute its roughly 200kg stockpile of 20%-enriched uranium, the most immediate proliferation concern, or convert it to oxide which is harder to turn back into the hexafluoride gas, which can in turn be enriched further to make weapons-grade fuel. Iran undertakes not to build a plant for re-converting uranium oxide back to uranium hexafluoride.

It would also not be allowed to increase its stockpile of 3.5%-enriched uranium, so any that is produced during the six months of the interim agreement would have to be blended down or converted to oxide.

Iran would also have to freeze its enrichment capacity. It would not be allowed to install any new centrifuges and would be able to use only the roughly 8,000 which are currently being used for enrichment. The other 8,000 that have been installed but are not being fed with uranium hexafluoride would have to be "left inoperable".

Major development work at the Arak heavy water reactor would be suspended for six months. No fuel could be put into the reactor and it could not be turned on. Furthermore, no more fuel rods can be made for the reactor and no major reactor components could be introduced.

What is the significance of enrichment levels?

The percentage enrichment refers to the concentration of the fissile isotope U235 in uranium. Low enriched uranium (LEU) is defined as under 5%. Highly enriched (HEU) or weapons-grade plutonium is considered to be over 90%-enriched. Because of the technical aspects of centrifuge enrichment, the manufacture of 20%-enriched uranium is considered to be nine-tenths the way along the road to HEU in terms of difficulty.

Does the deal recognise Iran's right to enrichment?

This is hotly contested. The US says it does not. But the text does suggest that the comprehensive settlement to be hammered out in the next six months would involve at least acceptance. It says: "This comprehensive solution would involve a mutually defined enrichment programme with practical limits and transparency measures to ensure the peaceful nature of the programme." Washington put emphasis on the "mutually defined" phrase, suggesting Iran would require negotiated consent.

Why did Iran build an enrichment plant underground?

The plant carved into the rock under a mountain at Fordow was discovered by western intelligence in 2009. Iran reported its existence to the International Atomic Energy Agency just days before Barack Obama revealed it at the UN general assembly in September of that year. Western states said Fordow demonstrated Iran's desire to cheat and develop a covert weapons programme. Iran said that it needed a protected facility because of the threats from the west and Israel to bomb the Iranian nuclear programme. The Iranian government said it was only required to declare its existence to the IAEA six months before it intended to put radioactive material in it. However, the IAEA argues that is an old rule. It says Iran should inform the agency of new nuclear facilities as soon as they are designed.

Could Iran still develop a nuclear bomb under these conditions?

It would be hard to develop a bomb in secret, particularly because the deal involves some uniquely intrusive inspections, including daily visits to the enrichment plants at Natanz and Fordow, and for the first time inspections of centrifuge assembly workshops and rotor production facilities. Those inspections are especially important as IAEA experts would be able to check if any extra centrifuges were being made for an undeclared plant. Because the nuclear fuel cycle is checked by the IAEA all the way along, any yellowcake or uranium hexafluoride that was diverted to a parallel programme would be noticed. To escape detection, the Iranians would have to construct an entire covert fuel cycle – which would be very difficult The chances of being caught and the penalties involved would be great.

The other way to way make a bomb would be to "break out" – to race to build a warhead before inspectors find out and raise the alarm. But by taking away the 20% stockpile and curbing the number of centrifuges, this deal would double the break-out period Iran would need. It would take about three months to make enough HEU for a warhead, but it would take more than that to turn that HEU into uranium metal and shape it into a perfect core for a warhead and then assemble the weapon, let alone test it. Iran would almost certainly be caught before it had made a single weapon.

What is likely to happen now?

Worst case scenario: The deal falls apart almost immediately in the face of hardliners in Washington and Tehran. A congressional vote now for more sanctions, for example, would almost certainly derail it. Iranian conservatives would see such an act as American perfidy and it would make it extremely hard ever to seal another agreement. Iranian conservatives would be likely instead to accelerate Iranian nuclear development, bringing a conflict closer.

Best case scenario: The interim deal holds and the comprehensive settlement is negotiated on time, laying to rest the Iranian nuclear crisis once and for all. The prompt lifting sanctions leads to an economic boom in Iran, strengthening moderates. The end of isolation would strengthen liberals and weaken the hold of the clerical and military elite.

Most likely scenario: The interim deal more or less holds despite squabbles, but negotiations over the comprehensive agreement are dogged by disagreements and delays, requiring an extension to the stopgap measures and an erosion of trust. Success would require another vast investment of effort and political capital from relatively weak presidents, and would be hostage to developments elsewhere, such as Syria.

On another note. I have had two clips around the ears for pushing forum rules. One by Ngati. And now I find out that I can not post links cause I'm to much of a green horn and need to post 5 more posts before I can do so. So I copy an pasted instead. The article was written by Julian Borger The Guardian, Monday 25 November 2013.
 

ngatimozart

Super Moderator
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
Iran has two reactors: a nuclear power station in Bushehr on the Gulf coast that was built with Russian help and uses Russian-supplied fuel rods; and a research reactor in Tehran that uses 20%-enriched uranium fuel and produces isotopes for medical, agricultural and other scientific uses. Iran has built a plant to make heavy water (deuterium oxide) in Arak and is building a reactor there that would use natural uranium fuel in the heavy water for its fissile reaction.

An article by The Guardian.com

On another note. I have had two clips around the ears for pushing forum rules. One by Ngati. And now I find out that I can not post links cause I'm to much of a green horn and need to post 5 more posts before I can do so. So I copy an pasted instead. The article was written by Julian Borger The Guardian, Monday 25 November 2013.
A small trick is just to post the article heading and where you got it from then people can google it or go straight to the site in this case the Guardian. Anyways you've only got four posts to go & then you're into posting links. Your input is just as important as anyone elses on here and this is a great learning space.
 

Twain

Active Member
I've resurrected this thread because of an article I read in Defence News. Rep. Hunter: US Should Use Tactical Nukes on Iran if Strikes Become Necessary He's a member of the House Armed Services Committee so not just back bencher who is there to make up the numbers. Now I know he's a pollie and as a general rule it could be assumed that one saltwater croc has a higher IQ than a parliament, senate or a congress full of pollies.

.
I'll try not to stray too far into politics on this, but saying he's on the house armed services committee isn't really saying much. IIRC the that committee has about 60 members. Every member of the house is on multiple committees whether they deserve it or not. Being on a committee in the house isn't a measure of past achievements, competence or influence. Just google the guy, in 5 years in congress this is about the only time he has actually made news headlines.

Now that said, he's a blithering idiot
 

2007yellow430

Active Member
I've resurrected this thread because of an article I read in Defence News. Rep. Hunter: US Should Use Tactical Nukes on Iran if Strikes Become Necessary He's a member of the House Armed Services Committee so not just back bencher who is there to make up the numbers. Now I know he's a pollie and as a general rule it could be assumed that one saltwater croc has a higher IQ than a parliament, senate or a congress full of pollies.

The recent agreement between the US and Iran to talk and negotiate about a peacful Iranian nuclear is a breakthrough and even though some do not like it, it is far better than war. However this fulla Hunter calling for nukes to be used if a strike is needed goes well beyond the pale. I realise that the US has a no first nuke strike policy, but this fullas call is absolutely senseless and I would deem it warmongering with WMDs. If this call was made by a country that the was e.g., non Christian the US would be all over this like a rash. WMDs are nothing to be trifled with and I strongly feel that Hunter should be pulled aside by his peers and taught the error of his ways before he causes more trouble. The ramifications, if his call gets out of hand, could be very deleterious for a lot of people and not just political careers.
It's my understanding that one of the provisions of the NPT is that those with nuclear weapons promised never to use them on those that did not as an inducement to sign. Breaching that treaty would be a disaster because it would tell those signatories that our word is not good.

I don't want to get politics in here but that would be a major disaster.

Art
 

Ocean1Curse

Member
There are plenty of moderates in Iran, several chat on the /K/ board of 4chan every so often.

I found a copy of THE TREATY ON THE NON-PROLIFERATION
OF NUCLEAR WEAPONS ( NPT ) at UN.org

Oh hey guess what the US does recognize the right for uranium enrichment and nuclear power (not bombs) to all.
Want know the difference between neutron spallation reactors and a bomb?
BEAM STRENGTH!!
Guess what the treaty that the US hold like a used tampon says the issue of nuke tech is it is inherently dual use.

Next up trustworthiness, :rolleyes:
 

My2Cents

Active Member
I'll try not to stray too far into politics on this, but saying he's on the house armed services committee isn't really saying much. IIRC the that committee has about 60 members. Every member of the house is on multiple committees whether they deserve it or not. Being on a committee in the house isn't a measure of past achievements, competence or influence. Just google the guy, in 5 years in congress this is about the only time he has actually made news headlines.
There is also a much smaller select group within the committee that are the only ones to hear the really classified stuff. If they briefed all 60 politicians at least 1 would be sure to leak it.
Now that said, he's a blithering idiot
Embarrassingly so. Bet he gets re-elected next year too.
 
Top