Iranian F-14 fighter crashes, two dead

Snauman

Banned Member
TEHRAN (AFP) Jun 21, 2004

An Iranian Air Force F-14 fighter plane has crashed during a training flight, killing the two crew on board, the official news agency IRNA reported Monday.
The jet, bought from the the United States prior to the 1979 Islamic revolution, crashed while it was trying to land at a base near the central city of Isfahan.

Most of Iran's commercial and military planes are of US origin, and the country has a hard time finding spare parts due to a US embargo.

The report said the crash was being investigated.


http://www.spacewar.com/2004/040621123352.qir2y8ys.html
 

mysterious

New Member
Obviously the lack of spare parts will begin to highlight itself much more in the coming years with such type of crashes and technical failures becoming more frequent if Iran doesnt do anything to cure the problem. Its an old US tactic to flood another country with equipment of US origin and then use the spares as a tool of fiddling with that country's political and social structures. ;)
 

adsH

New Member
i doubt its spare parts but i think its probably Training it was a two seater, it was probably on a training mission. what kind of sub or trans sonic trainers do they have.
Londo Molari said:
For sure. Sad to hear about the Irani air force's loss though :(
i was looking at your Stills amimated stuff, i like what you did to the escort class but the but youve sort of made it look abit weerd but i can see you like Babilon 5, yeah it was a great show, i just wish Andromida could of hired you to do there graphics have you seen some of there episodes it looks good sometimes and then suddenly they just mess everything up!!
 

highsea

New Member
Adsh, as far as I know all f-14's are 2 seaters.

I notice Myst throwing another spear at the US again. Why am I not surprised. So this was just all part of the US's master plan, huh?

Let me see now, we sell F-14's to Iran when the Shah was in power, because we knew he would be overthrown, and then 25 years later the planes would start crashing because we refuse to sell them parts. Right. Boy, we sure do think ahead, don't we. :?

-CM
 

adsH

New Member
lol good thinking!! I think they teh Iranians can maintain there AC, but they don't have quality trainging platforms. An F-14 is an amazing Platform But to Master it is a lifetime Job, something only the USNAVY Air arms i would say has been able to do.
 

highsea

New Member
adsH said:
An F-14 is an amazing Platform But to Master it is a lifetime Job, something only the USNAVY Air arms i would say has been able to do.
The Iranians may be able to maintain them, but I kind of doubt it. The guys flying them today are not the same pilots we trained in the late 70's, that's for sure.

As you say, the F-14 is a bad ass airplane, but is a big complicated machine, and you don't just hop in and go. That is one reason we have pretty much retired them in favor of F-18's. They are a hell of a lot cheaper and easier to fly and maintain. Can't wait for the JSF's to come online.

-CM
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
All Tomcats are 2 seaters, the backseater was a RIO or WSO (depending on the decade we look at)
 

Pathfinder-X

Tribal Warlord
Verified Defense Pro
i think the crash may be due to several factors

-Quality of Iranian pilot

-Lack of spare parts

-Aircraft Ageing (1978-present)

F-14 itself is a very formidable AC, but requires proper upkeep and highly trained pilot to put it into its full potential. There are several report that indicates only about 1/3 of the F-14 the Iranian have can still fly.
 

adsH

New Member
Hey Guys i was watching this Program on Discovery Wings Channel, and they Had a program Dedicated for the VTO Lift AC the Harrier, they showed its Development and its Failures, it'a an amazing design, but i wonder if the VTOL in the JSF is going through the Same problem, Briton spent alot of time just perfecting the controls of this complicating Jet and now its just a mint example of British ingenuity. I am quite Proud of it, a Concept that actually other countries could not come up with or couldn't perfect. apparently the First prototype was in air being tested 3 years from its concept was developed. :uk
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
adsH said:
but i wonder if the VTOL in the JSF is going through the Same problem, Briton spent alot of time just perfecting the controls of this complicating Jet and now its just a mint example of British ingenuity.
The VTOL concept for the JSF uses a different concept. The Harrier IIRC was a bypass system. The JSF uses a direct and geared duct. BAe has primary responsibility for the F-35B
 

The Watcher

New Member
Whats iranian airforce like in today's term? any good or just like Iraqi airforce? Are they planning to acquire any jets?

:iran
 

gf0012-aust

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Verified Defense Pro
The Watcher said:
Whats iranian airforce like in today's term? any good or just like Iraqi airforce? Are they planning to acquire any jets?

:iran
Not as good as they used to be. They have a substantial number of ex Iraqi combat aircraft which they didn't give back after Kuwait (IIRC they claimed war reparations for the Iraq-Iran war)
 

mysterious

New Member
highsea said:
Adsh, as far as I know all f-14's are 2 seaters.

I notice Myst throwing another spear at the US again. Why am I not surprised. So this was just all part of the US's master plan, huh?

Let me see now, we sell F-14's to Iran when the Shah was in power, because we knew he would be overthrown, and then 25 years later the planes would start crashing because we refuse to sell them parts. Right. Boy, we sure do think ahead, don't we. :?

-CM
US didn't sell its home-made equipment to Shah's Iran just 'cuz it had a premonition that the Shah would be thrown and the spares used as a tool. It sold American equipment to Iran because Shah was a 'great ally' of the US and so the US decidede to let the Shah have some American toys as a sign of friendship (plus, it always is a good idea to sell American equipment 'cuz it acts as a 'tool' in unforseen circumstances if they go bad - against US interests), and obviously after the Islamic Revolution in Iran, US withdrew its bed-sharing feelings for Iran for good. :smokingc:
 

Londo Molari

New Member
adsH said:
i doubt its spare parts but i think its probably Training it was a two seater, it was probably on a training mission. what kind of sub or trans sonic trainers do they have.
i was looking at your Stills amimated stuff, i like what you did to the escort class but the but youve sort of made it look abit weerd but i can see you like Babilon 5, yeah it was a great show, i just wish Andromida could of hired you to do there graphics have you seen some of there episodes it looks good sometimes and then suddenly they just mess everything up!!
All F-14s are Two-Seaters. And I love Babyon 5 :D Escort class? Which one is that? I don't remember anything like that.... And Andromeda is a good show... but they have one major problem... they are made by the people who made Star Trek... and so obviously they ruin it... they show all battles from inside the ship, instead of showing the amazing graphics and action... and yeah, they don't texture their ships with image maps... they use just reflection... and that looks bad sometimes.
 

The Watcher

New Member
Some of you might have read this but oh well here goes

---------------------------------

Iran Airforce

The shah's air force had more than 450 modern combat aircraft, including top-of-the-line F-14 Tomcat fighters and about 5,000 well-trained pilots. By 1979 the air force, numbering close to 100,000 personnel, was by far the most advanced of the three services and among the most impressive air forces in the developing world. Reliable information on the air force after the Revolution was difficult to obtain, but it seems that by 1987 a fairly large number of aircraft had been cannibalized for spare parts.

Before the Revolution, the air force was organized into fifteen squadrons with fighter and fighter-bomber capabilities and one reconnaissance squadron. In addition, one tanker squadron, and four medium and one light transport squadron provided impressive logistical backup. By 1986 desertions and depletions led to a reorganization of the air force into eight squadrons with fighter and fighter-bomber capabilities and one reconnaissance squadron. This reduced force was supported by two joint tanker-transport squadrons and five light transport squadrons. Some seventy-six helicopters and five surface-to-air missile (SAM) squadrons supplemented this capability.

Air force headquarters was located at Doshan Tapeh Air Base, near Tehran. Iran's largest air base, Mehrabad, outside Tehran, was also the country's major civil airport. Other major operational air bases were at Tabriz, Bandar-e Abbas, Hamadan (Shahroki Air Base), Dezful (Vahdati Air Base), Shiraz, and Bushehr. Since 1980 air bases at Ahvaz, Esfahan (Khatami Air Base), and Bandar Beheshti have also become operational.

Throughout the 1970s, Iran purchased sophisticated aircraft for the air force. The acquisition of 77 F-14A Tomcat fighters added to 166 F-5 fighters and 190 F-4 Phantom fighter-bombers, gave Iran a strong defensive and a potential offensive capability. Before the end of his reign, the shah placed orders for F-16 fighters and even contemplated the sharing of development costs for the United States Navy's new F-18 fighter. Both of these combat aircraft have been dropped from the revolutionary regime's military acquisitions list, however.

When the Iran-Iraq War started in 1980, Iran's F-14s, equipped with Phoenix missiles, capable of identifying and destroying six targets simultaneously from a range of eighty kilometers or more, inflicted heavy casualties on the Iraqi air force, which was forced to disperse its aircraft to Jordan and Oman. The capability of the F-14s and F-4s was enhanced by the earlier acquisition of a squadron of Boeing 707 tankers, thereby extending their combat radius to 2,500 kilometers with in-flight refueling.

By 1987, however, the air force faced an acute shortage of spare parts and replacement equipment. Perhaps 35 of the 190 Phantoms were serviceable in 1986. One F-4 had been shot down by Saudi F-15s, and two pilots had defected to Iraq with their F-4s in 1984. The number of F-5s dwindled from 166 to perhaps 45, and the F-14 Tomcats from 77 to perhaps 10. The latter were hardest hit because maintenance posed special difficulties after the United States embargo on military sales.

China and North Korea with their "independent" policies on arms sales, were the only countries willing to sell Iran combat airplanes. Iran had acquired two Chinese-made Shenyang J-6 trainers in 1986. Unconfirmed reports in 1987 indicated that Iran was receiving Shenyang F-6s (Chinese-built MiG-19SFs), and that Iranian pilots were receiving training in North Korea. The reconnaissance squadron has also struggled to perform its duties with limited equipment. Once flying close to thirty-four aircraft, by late 1987 it may have been reduced to eight, having converted five Tomcats to serve in a noncombat role. It was not clear whether these five airplanes were in addition to the ten in the interceptor squadrons. Given the technical sophistication of reconnaissance aircraft, it was almost impossible to acquire from non-Western sources new ones capable of performing to Iranian standards. The only substantial acquisition was the purchase of forty-six Pilatus PC-7s from Switzerland. Iran requested three Kawasaki C-1 transports and a 3D air defense radar system from Japan, but this transaction did not appear to have materialized by 1987. Reports also indicated that Iran had placed with Argentina an order for thirty Hughes 500D helicopters.

From its inception, the air force also assumed responsibility for air defense. The existing early warning systems, built in the 1950s under the auspices of CENTO, were upgraded in the 1970s with a modern air defense radar network. To complement the ground radar component and provide a blanket coverage of the Gulf region, the United States agreed to sell Iran seven Boeing 707 airborne warning and control system (AWACS) aircraft in late 1977. Because of the Revolution, Washington canceled the AWACS sale, claiming that this sensitive equipment might be compromised. Finally, the air force's three SAM battalions and eight improved Hawk battalions were reorganized in the mid-1980s (in a project involving more than 1,800 missiles) into five squadrons that also contained Rapiers and Tigercats. Washington's sale of Hawk spare parts and missiles in 1985 and 1986 may have enhanced this capability.

The air force's primary maintenance facility was located at Mehrabad Air Base. The nearby Iran Aircraft Industries, in addition to providing main overhaul backup for the maintenance unit, has been active in manufacturing spare parts.
 

highsea

New Member
mysterious said:
It sold American equipment to Iran because Shah was a 'great ally' of the US and so the US decidede to let the Shah have some American toys as a sign of friendship
That is more accurate. The US shares it's military technology with her allies. Iran was an ally.

mysterious said:
(plus, it always is a good idea to sell American equipment 'cuz it acts as a 'tool' in unforseen circumstances if they go bad - against US interests)
Can you give me one real example of this? This repeats your original suggestion that the US somehow has something to gain by selling military technology to someone we think may turn against us. This is just too far fetched for me to take seriously.

mysterious said:
and obviously after the Islamic Revolution in Iran, US withdrew its bed-sharing feelings for Iran for good.
It was Iran that caused the break-up, by taking over the Embassy and taking the hostages.

-CM
 

mysterious

New Member
highsea said:
mysterious said:
(plus, it always is a good idea to sell American equipment 'cuz it acts as a 'tool' in unforseen circumstances if they go bad - against US interests)
Can you give me one real example of this? This repeats your original suggestion that the US somehow has something to gain by selling military technology to someone we think may turn against us. This is just too far fetched for me to take seriously.

mysterious said:
and obviously after the Islamic Revolution in Iran, US withdrew its bed-sharing feelings for Iran for good.
It was Iran that caused the break-up, by taking over the Embassy and taking the hostages.

-CM
Obviously the US has alwayz to gain from selling US equipment to such countries! Take Pakistan for example, it tested its nukes and there you have it! "Sanctions"!! Military Coup, "Sanctions"!! And there are numerous other examples. Iran itself did not cause the break-up and it certainly didnt take over the embassy itself. Certain mind-crazed people did and keeping the close US-Iran relations (during the Shah's period) in mind before the revolution, this incident should not have provoked the US as much as it actually did (the real reason which the US knew very well was that its ally had fallen and there was no indication of the new leader being pro-US). :smokingc:
 

highsea

New Member
mysterious said:
Iran itself did not cause the break-up and it certainly didnt take over the embassy itself. Certain mind-crazed people did and keeping the close US-Iran relations (during the Shah's period) in mind before the revolution, this incident should not have provoked the US as much as it actually did (the real reason which the US knew very well was that its ally had fallen and there was no indication of the new leader being pro-US). :smokingc:
So certain mind crazed people (Iranians) held our citizens for 444 days and the Iranian government was powerless to stop them? You will not convince me that the new gov't did not sanction this action.

Khomeini was the one responsible for the end of friendly relations with the US, whether you can accept that or not. HE was the one leading the anti-US sentiment in Iran.

-CM
 
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