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This is a discussion on A400m within the Air Force & Aviation forum, part of the Global Defense & Military category; The crash of the A400M in Spain resulted in a 4% drop in Airbus shares. The two black boxes have ...


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Old May 11th, 2015   #1
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A400m

The crash of the A400M in Spain resulted in a 4% drop in Airbus shares. The two black boxes have been recovered so depending on the results this will either be an error causing an unfortunate tragedy or a major set back for the A400M program. As this is the only semi strategic lifter in Western production, hopefully there is a straight forward solution to get the plane flying again.
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Old May 12th, 2015   #2
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The crash of the A400M in Spain resulted in a 4% drop in Airbus shares. The two black boxes have been recovered so depending on the results this will either be an error causing an unfortunate tragedy or a major set back for the A400M program. As this is the only semi strategic lifter in Western production, hopefully there is a straight forward solution to get the plane flying again.
Spain's National Institute for Aerospace Technique has temporarily withdrawn its permission for test flights of Airbus A400M planes still in production until an investigation determines the cause of the crash.
Spain withdraws permit for Airbus A400M test flights

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Old February 22nd, 2017   #3
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The A400M continues to drag down Airbus and Airbus is seeking relief from penalties. Interesting remark in the link saying Enders wishes Airbus had canned the A400M in 2010 rather than taking €3.5 billion to keep the program going. Had this decision been made, the C-17 would likely have seen some European sales along with more C-130Js.

Airbus seeks new talks with European nations over A400M costs | Reuters

Last edited by John Fedup; February 22nd, 2017 at 11:06 AM. Reason: Addition
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Old February 22nd, 2017   #4
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The A400M continues to drag down Airbus and Airbus is seeking relief from penalties. Interesting remark in the link saying Enders wishes Airbus had canned the A400M in 2010 rather than taking 3.5 billion to keep the program going. Had this decision been made, the C-17 would likely have seen some European sales along with more C-130Js.

Airbus seeks new talks with European nations over A400M costs | Reuters
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"I am not sure that the states will agree to put their hands in their pockets once again," said Chloe Lemarie, director of aerospace and defense research at Mainfirst Bank in Paris.
My take of the article is they are not asking for more money, it's to renegotiate the exsess penalties hurting their bottom line. I'm all for penalty clauses in contracts as its there to keep them honest but it's no good sending them to the wall as well.
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Old February 22nd, 2017   #5
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Correct, it's about penalty relief now whereas back in 2010 it was about a bailout. They took the money in 2010 along with the penalty obligations. Now they want relief because of their continued screw ups. What's the point of having penalties if you don't enforce them? Canada let Sikorsky off on their penalty obligations on the H-92 (CH-148 Cyclone) several years ago and here we are years later with only 6 out of 28 delivered which don't even meet specs. Both these companies made BS promises so they deserve to be put up against the wall IMO!
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Old February 22nd, 2017   #6
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Correct, it's about penalty relief now whereas back in 2010 it was about a bailout. They took the money in 2010 along with the penalty obligations. Now they want relief because of their continued screw ups. What's the point of having penalties if you don't enforce them? Canada let Sikorsky off on their penalty obligations on the H-92 (CH-148 Cyclone) several years ago and here we are years later with only 6 out of 28 delivered which don't even meet specs. Both these companies made BS promises so they deserve to be put up against the wall IMO!
Yep I understand where you we coming from, but it could work in the consortiums nations favour waive the penalties but the downside for Airbus is a reduced profit margin on future builds for effected nations, still hurts them
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Old February 24th, 2017   #7
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Another link from Flight Global which also emphasizes the engine decision as the most troublesome issue.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...airbus-434545/
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Old February 27th, 2017   #8
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The final fix for the TP400 engine gearbox is to start in September according to MTU.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...on-mtu-434549/
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Old March 8th, 2017   #9
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There will be no quick easing of penalties for Airbus with respect to the A400M. The matter has been referred to OCCAR and will many months of delay for a decision is made.

Nations Hand Off A400M Talks to OCCAR
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Old March 10th, 2017   #10
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British Air Force A400M airlifters prepped for tactical missions

Piece written after A400 visit down under.
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Old March 10th, 2017   #11
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A400M Returns to Jakarta as Airbus Seeks Deal Opportunities

Still no clarity on the on-again off-again sale of A400s to Indonesia.

The guys on the Indonesian forum seem to be taking a 'I'll believe it when I see it' approach, which seems sensible.
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Old March 31st, 2017   #12
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According to this link, the Euro consortium will not let Airbus off on the penalties agreed to several years ago for non-performance when additional funds where provided to the program.

The Secretary of State for Defense Meets with His Counterparts on the 'A400M' Program
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Old April 4th, 2017   #13
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Airbus to enter co-operation discussions with Indonesia over A400M contract | IHS Jane's 360

Further effort frm Airbus to reach deal for A-400 in Indonesia..
As I put in Indonesian AF thread before..this deal will depend on how much benefit Indonesian Aerospace Industry will get from Airbus.
Enhancing Indonesian Industry within Airbus global manufacturing chain seems the main issue in here, despite what the AF ones.

Rumours circulate that the deal seems going to be the Aircraft will be procured through one of state owned enterprises (SOE) that then contracted with the AF to operated. The procurement off set then will be calculated with the amount of Aircraft parts that Airbus will be ordered frm Indonesian Industry.

This can turn out like C-295 deal, where the AF actually prefered C-27J but for the benefit of local aero industry..the C-295 procured.
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Old April 5th, 2017   #14
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This can turn out like C-295 deal, where the AF actually prefered C-27J but for the benefit of local aero industry..the C-295 procured.
The same was true in Canada, the RCAF wanted the C-27J for the FWSAR project but the C-295 won on local content (PWC engines being the biggest component). The award is being contested by Leonardo, not sure if they have much hope of success though.
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Old April 21st, 2017   #15
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Despite (justifiable) scepticism about the A400, the user nations seem to be steadily pressing on with introduction to service.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/art...ench-army.html

https://twitter.com/RAFBrizeNorton/s...20699475488768

(Scroll down a bit for Puma minus rotors being loaded)
The RAF has now received 14 of their planned 22 aircraft, which presumably makes them the largest current user.

https://twitter.com/Seb_Lanc99

Twitter feed of an RAF instructor. Somewhere way back in his timeline is some footage of impressive ground maneuvering - including a three-point turn on the runway from memory.
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