This is a discussion on Nuclear Subs for India within the Navy & Maritime forum, part of the Global Defense & Military category; Indian Navy has projected a need for 10-12 nuclear powered subs in the next 10 years. India has an announced ...
Indian Navy has projected a need for 10-12 nuclear powered subs in the next 10 years. India has an announced "no first strike" policy in terms of a nuclear conflict. The most widely accepted second strike platforms are the nuclear tipped missiles launched from a submerged or otherwise deployed nuclear powered submarine. India clearly lacks in this respect having not even a single nuc-sub currently deployed. In this light I would like to invite discussions on the needs for nuclear subs for india, discussions can revolve around numbers, classes for acquisition, missiles for delivering effective retaliatory strikes, sub required vs. not required debates, reactor details and discussions etc
Would request Mod checks in order to prevent uncessary posting which could result in thread shut down, preferably posts which dont adhere can be removed than the shut down of healthy discussions
Last edited by WebMaster; August 21st, 2009 at 02:22 AM.
Reason: Its "nuclear powered, not "nuc-powered." Please write complete words.
As this thread is to discuss the IN subs , Here i got something
How viable is a surgery which requires a healthy patient to be in a hospital bed for one-third of his life? That is the approximate analogy for the mid-life upgrade for this submarine INS Sindhukirti, the Dry Dock Queen. Four submarines are stuck in such protracted upgrades. Not surprisingly, just nobody is accountable .
During An interview to News Channel CNN IBN7 Admiral Suresh Mehta Said That 48% Subs of IN are in dry dock to repair .
New Delhi: Over-emphasis on indigenous work is hurting India's readiness for war.
As India's vital submarine arm struggles with dangerously low numbers, a top-end submarine has been taken out of the fleet for a repair programme.
The shocking revelations of the report were:
Only seven of India's 16 submarines are available for combat at any time.
10 of these 16 ageing submarines will be due for phase-out by 2012.
To maintain current numbers, one submarine needs to be inducted every two years but there's been no addition since 2001.
India's only submarine-making facility in Mumbai was kept idle for 12 years.
There is one more link from *************.com - but its not showing correctly - wonder why ? in case u need to refer its the site and then /reports-4110
Also would advise you to visit the link bang bang mentioned above, it shows a glaring inavailability of subs (only 7 are available, one sub will take 10 yrs to refit etc) in the IN
The Russian offer comes as Indian Navy has formulated a 20 year plan to produce indigenously 24 conventional submarines. New Delhi had also contracted for two nuclear submarines from Moscow, but navy has projected that in the next 10 years India would need to acquire or build another 10-12 nuclear subs. These nuclear submarines would be similar to the 'Nerpa'class, which was involved in an accident in November during final sea trials in Sea of Japan.
As one of Russian official said " Yes, there is a real possibility of leasing for ten years several of our nuclear powered multi-role submarines of Project 971 of 'Shchuka-B'class " .
Several intresting
i also want to know that how many years a sub take to ready for service .
The Russian offer comes as Indian Navy has formulated a 20 year plan to produce indigenously 24 conventional submarines. New Delhi had also contracted for two nuclear submarines from Moscow, but navy has projected that in the next 10 years India would need to acquire or build another 10-12 nuclear subs. These nuclear submarines would be similar to the 'Nerpa'class, which was involved in an accident in November during final sea trials in Sea of Japan.
As one of Russian official said " Yes, there is a real possibility of leasing for ten years several of our nuclear powered multi-role submarines of Project 971 of 'Shchuka-B'class " .
Several intresting
i also want to know that how many years a sub take to ready for service .
Well i think the leasing is for 3 subs - NATO designate AKULA-II class attack subs with an option of buying them at the end of the 10 year lease period. ATV program is for anywhere between 3-5 subs. So that takes care of about 6-8 nuc-subs.
This is what I think Indian nuc-sub inventory should look like in 10-15 years
Nuclear Subs -
SSBN - 6
SSN - 9
SSGN - 3 (we will need long range cruise missiles for tht)
Tactical Subs
India should have submersibles (2man-16man) may be 12-18 for spec ops - its reported they already have Cosmos CE-2F/X100 for the MARCOS teams
Conventional Powered
The existing subs are going to go including the Sindhugosh class, the newer ones will serve for some more time (only about 4-5), the foxtrot and Shishumar class will be retired
There is an order for 6 scorpenes and an evaluation process in on for ordering 6 more (HDW will probably win this one) under project 75 - That makes 12
So that constitutes about 16-17 subs and as such the plan is for 24 subs which means another 7-8 should be ordered or built (wonder why there is no domestic conventional sub building program - design to delivery - indegenious, one would assume sub building of conventional nature would help in assimilating knowledge for building nuc-subs)
To answer your last question - India has been planning and not yet delivered the ATV - it started 20 yrs ago, however first time players (china and India do take more time owing to the complexity of the deal)
yesterday i saw a video on you tube which was featuring spec ops forces of india - namely the MARCOS and sone desert commando / spec force. It featured the Cosmos CE-2F/X100 (it looks so non lethal in bright green color) and it wasnt looking like an ideal platform for spec ops either - it can only carry 2 ppl and it is not an enclosed sub which means shorter range beacuse of the oxygen capacity for the team (tanks). what would be an ideal platform for a spec ops forces wrt to submersibiles and midget subs - read somewhere that the SEALs has a 16+2 man capable vehicle called ASDS (Advanced Seal Delivery System) which sounds like a paltform capable of inserting a small strike team
Maybe India should develop or procure something like that instead of 2 man submersibiles
come to think of it Cocaine smugglers use bigger submersible - he he - pls dont trash me
Brazil has inked a deal with DCN for building scorpenes and one of which will be a nuc-powered sub, for which the "non-nuclear" part of the sub will be built by france, perhaps india should look at this program as a model, it already has miniature reactor program for its ATV project and it is already building scorpenes. Bingo - new domestic nuc-sub program to accelerate speedier acquisition of nuc-subs - although at about 60-70 mts length it sounds like a small platform for a modern nuke sub
This is what I think Indian nuc-sub inventory should look like in 10-15 years
Nuclear Subs -
SSBN - 6
SSN - 9
SSGN - 3 (we will need long range cruise missiles for tht)
Even if you include the 3 Russian subs in that list you are still looking at building 15 Nuclear subs in 15 years when India has not even built one previously, there's no way that is achievable.
Even if you include the 3 Russian subs in that list you are still looking at building 15 Nuclear subs in 15 years when India has not even built one previously, there's no way that is achievable.
You couldn't build 15 nuke subs in 15 years especialy if you haven't even built your own SSK its not doable not even the cold war superpowers(of a single class in a single yard) could achieve that a SSN a year.
________________
Colin McRae 1961-2007 true champion
Unofficial Royal navy cheering section
They could buy more Russian ones. But it would be expensive. Not to mention hardly helpful in terms of developing indigenous production.
curious would the Russian sell 6 SSN or SSGN I can't imagine them wanting to sell so many unless it was 6 of death traps which have been decommissioned for decades
________________
Colin McRae 1961-2007 true champion
Unofficial Royal navy cheering section
They could buy more Russian ones. But it would be expensive. Not to mention hardly helpful in terms of developing indigenous production.
But then that would require the Russians to build them, do they even have the capacity to do that in the timescale involved? even if they sold old ones to India they would have to build replacements one a 1 for 1 basis or face an overall reduction in numbers.
Location: Under your bed. No seriously, take a look.
Posts: 11,138
Threads:
Quote:
Originally Posted by kev 99
But then that would require the Russians to build them, do they even have the capacity to do that in the timescale involved? even if they sold old ones to India they would have to build replacements one a 1 for 1 basis or face an overall reduction in numbers.
6 submarines over 10 years? I would think it's possible. Not cheap, but definetly possible.
Guys, India already has an ATV project which is supposed to deliver btw 5-6 nuc-subs, 2 akula-II's will be leased and then probably acquired (after lease terms of 10 yrs). So that gives us plans in place already for 7-9 subs within the time frame as such right.
So then what is pending is about 7-8 subs. now in my earlier post i wrote how an indian scorpene can be designed to accomadate a nuc-reactor, given tht this would be small sub it still is a nuc sub, at a lower end of one such sub tht leaves a gap of 6-7 subs
Now for this 6-7 subs one could approach, russia, french or the US
Nuclear Subs for India 
intresting 
