Well, maximum payload is 96 Tomahawks on each DDG, if all VLS are filled with Tomahawks instead of SM-2 and ASROC ASW missiles.chris5424 said:
well well single handedly although that would be nice,you really need to make your qeastion more clearchris5424 said:
Sorry if I appear thick but you are saying DD(X) is not as capable as the AB. I am a little confused, I was under the impression the thing will carry the next generation AEGIS, weapons at least as capable in so far AAW, ASUW and TLAM are concerned (as I noted previously I don't know what is intended with Harpoon on these unit as I understand it is not currently VLS capable) with improvements planned, have lower RCS, carry the latest word in networked combat system and have survivability improvements over the AB. My impression was that it will be a milestone increase in capabilityBig-E said:
If true, it should be possible to think up some nasty ways of taking out an AB with a simultaneous arrival cruise missile attack. But of course an AB would not be let exposed like that.
It will be a milestone in survivability but the thread was about power which I take to mean offensive capabilities. The ABs will have the same types of weapons as DDG-1000 just with different mixes of munitions in her tubes for MS. Pretty much the same power projection just better survivability and defense.alexsa said:
You have to replace Spruance with something and DDG-1000s are the design of the future. Right now the main theme of the ship revolves around her AGS system to fight in the littorals but she will also play a part in ABM and fleet defense. These are only the stop-gap capabilities of this ship. She is fully designed to incorporate future technologies. Her incredible survivability along with IPS will make the perfect platform for Directed Energy Weapons and Electro-Magentic Launchers. She has been specifically designed to incorporate these two technologies into her architecture.alexsa said:
All things considered a US DDG is about as powerful a surface combatant you are going to get outside the USN. But they really arent designed to fight major engagements as stand alone platforms. Remeber as powerful as they are a relatively primitive airforce with enough mass or a powerful surface combatant with decent AShM's would be able to get pretty close due to the curvature of the Earth and potentially cause problems. If you really want a stand alone platform that could go toe to toe single handedly with entire Navy's then think Seawolf, Virginia, Los Angeles or even Ohio SSGN's. Now those are real purpose built stand alone platforms excluding off board ISR data of course.Big-E said:Sure, I was working on a scenerio but I think it would be better if you give me one of a certain force and I'll tell you how the DDG-81+ would deal with it.
All of them would get thru and keep on going past DD(X). If she is doing fleet defense, which would be tasked to CG(X), she still has ESSMs in conjunction with AN/SPY-3 which has a good chance of intercepting dozens of threats before they reach critical impact. In conjunction with CG(X) in a CBG they would have to extiguish the VLS before something got thru, unless they got lucky which is always a possibilty.Aussie said:
A DDX or DDG in a US CSF? I'd say they would do pretty well. Their defenses are designed to deal with those types of threats. AEGIS isnt really a single weapons system. Its like the ultimate net centric warfare system. Fighting a single AEGIS/CEC capable ship in the CSF is like fighting them all as well as all the aircraft in the group.Aussie said:
First time I'd have to disagree with you Darth. Submarines do not make good stand alone platforms when faced off against a dispersed surface fleet. They have limited SA depending on passive sonar to detect targets. Once they engage a target with ADCAPS or TASSMs they give away their position and get to kill a couple ships before they are torped by a helo.DarthAmerica said:
No arguements about the capability of the AB which is the reason I am glad to see the new AWD being based on this design. There are other classes of vessel based on the same platform that are also pretty good (the Kongo being a prime example). But the idea that this is a stand alone beat everybody hands down vessel has problems IMHO. A small force supported by effective survailance assets and decent SSMs would have the potential to put a single AB at serious risk (particualry where that force is a modern AAW ASuW capable vessels). Particualry in light of the gun based CIWS fitted tot the AB. There has been an ongoing discussion in the forum to the effect that gun based CIWS are a real hail mary approach and that missile based systems such as RAM providing a better last line of defence.DarthAmerica said:
If I was on a ship that had expended it stocks of SSMs I doubt I would be racing into engage a 'small fleet' (unless they are gun armed patrol craft) with guns, particularly where the opposition may have some missiles left.Big E said:
I love these scenariosBig-E said:I see I am going to have to explain without someone giving the example I requested. Lets put DDG-81 against the entire Brazilian navy in open blue water. The longest range weapons this fleet has is A-4s with exocets, DDG-81 is armed with SM-2(IIIB) with 90nm range shooting down every air asset in the Brazilian fleet. The fleet is left with MM40 Exocet SSM as their best weapon, with a range of 43nm they are at the mercy of TASSM attacks. Lets say 40 are carried as the TLAMs are left home and probably punch thru the weak air defenses of the fleet knocking the front line destroyer escorts and sinking Sao Paulo in the process. Lets say this strike wipes out A12, D27-30, and F46-49. With the 40,000lbs of ordinance in this strike this is a highly possible outcome. Lets say the remaining SM-2(IIIB)s knock out every flight platform in the fleet so you are left with the Churchill armed with her 63nm ranged Mk 45 MOD 4 Gun system against 43nm MM40 Exocets. So the ERGM rounds open fire before Exocets can be launched and all thats left in Brazils surface fleet are 4 Mk10 frigates and 4 Inhauma light patrol frigates. Churchill uses her advanced range to criple, not sink, the 4 Mk10s. With all SEACAT and other SAM systems sunk or inoperational the SH-60s can move into torpedo or Peguin (AGM-119) range and open fire outside of the light frigates air defense. Needless to say all their surface combatents are sunk. S30-34 are about waiting for the Churchill to come within weapons range but never does. The SH-60s search find and destroy 2 of them. Churchill lands her helos and hauls butt! Thats how she can do, her weapons outrange everything they have. Besides I never said the opposing fleet get shore based assets... did I?
