France is first European country to sign non-aggression pact with ASEAN

[adroth]

http://www.mb.com.ph/MAIN2006120881912.html

Here's an excerpt.

[Edited]

French Foreign Minister Philippe Douste-Blazy will sign the Treaty of Amity and Cooperation on December 11 on the sidelines of the ASEAN aummit in Cebu, 585 kilometres south of Manila.

[Edited]

Accession to the treaty is also a requirement to joining the East Asian summit, which gathers ASEAN countries with Japan, China, South Korea, India, New Zealand and Australia.

Either this article overlooked that fact the UK (still a European country last time I checked) has defense relations with its former colonies, or there's really something unique about this deal.

Are entities like the ASEAN allowed to enter into treaties on behalf of their member countries?

Looks like France intends to expand sales in the region. More Rafaels anyone?

At any rate this is welcome news . . . especially when compared to Australia's pronouncements of using unilateral action a couple of years ago.

 

[contedicavour]

France is extremely active in defence procurement ... and it's not only the Rafale that they are trying to export. We're also talking about Scorpene and Marlin SSKs, Mistral LHDs, FREMM FFGs with the Herakles radar and Aster-15 only, not to mention Tiger and other Eurocopter helos and Leclerc MBTs.
IMHO it's in the naval field that they have the best chances of success.

cheers

PS : Malaysia's Proton could be sold to Peugeot-Citroen PSA group. Imagine if GIAT added a production line for APCs or MBTs in a factory which is very much below maximum capacity...

 

[Ding]

France is extremely active in defence procurement ... and it's not only the Rafale that they are trying to export. We're also talking about Scorpene and Marlin SSKs, Mistral LHDs, FREMM FFGs with the Herakles radar and Aster-15 only, not to mention Tiger and other Eurocopter helos and Leclerc MBTs.
IMHO it's in the naval field that they have the best chances of success.

cheers

PS : Malaysia's Proton could be sold to Peugeot-Citroen PSA group. Imagine if GIAT added a production line for APCs or MBTs in a factory which is very much below maximum capacity...

hahhaha how did you know about the proton deal hahhaha. that deal will go thru if proton are willing to cast off their egoistic assumption that they do not need help from foreigners. hhaha

but that would be something though to see leclercs coming out from proton factory. but it may not be a good thing as usually most protons comes with standard issue of "problem package". you would want the leclerc to brteakdown after each firing of the main gun would you?

 

[.pt]

I would dare say, that, even if GIAT would do such a stupid thing, the factory would remain well below maximum capacity. theres simply too much competition already in APC and MBT markets. They would need to have either a very advanced product or a very cheap one.
Just look at Germany firesale on Leopard 2... Hard to compete.
.pt

 

[Rich]

Didn't they just close a big Scorpene deal in the region? With India or Pakistan right? This is a good boat with a flexible package but pity them having to compete with the Germans, who created the art of boat warfare. Still, the Germans are bogged down with domestic-NATO orders for their outstanding boat and I bet the French shop their Scorpene heavy in the 3rd world/Asia. They also have the advantage of their diesels being "export only".

Pretty amazing the level of boat available nowadays for any country that has a little money.

 

[contedicavour]

I would dare say, that, even if GIAT would do such a stupid thing, the factory would remain well below maximum capacity. theres simply too much competition already in APC and MBT markets. They would need to have either a very advanced product or a very cheap one.
Just look at Germany firesale on Leopard 2... Hard to compete.
.pt

Well to some extent several Asian markets are still closed to international competition and would prefer spending more on a national solution supporting local industry rather than spending less by buying cheaper and better from elsewhere. Just have a look at Malaysia's current account surplus and history of import substitution.

cheers

 

[Musashi_kenshin]

I'm not really sure what the point of this is - after all the chances of France going to war with ASEAN are pretty slim! Probably just a diplomatic exercise, maybe as was said to support arms sales. But I doubt it would make a difference in terms of whether member states will buy or not - the UK has sold stuff to the region already, with more orders on the way/looking likely.

 

[adroth]

If this move were true, I wonder how they would make it stick? How could the ASEAN guarantee that the parliaments (in our case the Congress) of the different ASEAN members ratify the treaty?

Anyone here familiar with international law?

 

[eckherl]

I'm not really sure what the point of this is - after all the chances of France going to war with ASEAN are pretty slim! Probably just a diplomatic exercise, maybe as was said to support arms sales. But I doubt it would make a difference in terms of whether member states will buy or not - the UK has sold stuff to the region already, with more orders on the way/looking likely.

I am in a agreement here, the chances of France getting any big deals are slim, I look at it as France kissing some hiney over the Airbus failures, they cant even make good on a commercial airliner, who is going to listen to the promise of getting new weapons on time.

 

[contedicavour]

I am in a agreement here, the chances of France getting any big deals are slim, I look at it as France kissing some hiney over the Airbus failures, they cant even make good on a commercial airliner, who is going to listen to the promise of getting new weapons on time.

Well though broadly I agree (and perception is reality ), there are a couple of watchouts
> Airbus is a complicated venture mixing capabilities and wishes of French, German, Spanish (and for some time still) British politicians and businessmen. The French defence industry is much more focused and "one-headed", so expect less confusion and much more firm delivery date commitments
> It depends which weapons we're talking about. If it just boils down to delivering new Rafales, the bird already exists, so no issue.

cheers