This is a discussion on NZDF General discussion thread within the Geo-Strategic Defense forum, part of the Global Defense & Military category; Originally Posted by MrConservative
The initial change in attitude with the US political and military establishment began in 2007 with ...
The initial change in attitude with the US political and military establishment began in 2007 with Admiral Fallon's visit and things have steadily being arc'ed upwards since then. Prior to Fallons visit we had since 85 incrementally got to the point of just being 'friends' with the US - 'friends' spelt with a small 'f' and we have moved through to being "Friends" spelt with a capital to been 'Very Good Friends". Shortly New Zealanders will get the sense that we may well be "allies" with a small 'a' as 2012 will be a big year in taking the relationship forward. The principals certainly are of that mind as can be demonstrated by the various alphabet soup groups we have been allowed into as full members. May take awhile- if ever - to get back to being real Allies like we were pre 85 - however the shared interests and pragmatic approach to solving realities are whats essential.
I was at Warbirds over Wanaka in 2008 and there was a USAF New York ANG C130 there. I would think it was one that might have been going through off season maintenace at Air NZ in ChCh. Used to make me laugh; here we are having this big row with the US and there would be C5s, C141s, C130s and C17s transiting through Christchurch working with NZDF on the Antarctic Support program. When I was in RNZNVR at Pegasus we had great relations with USN VXE6 detachment at Harewood and the odd USN senior rate went to sea (incognito) on Kiwi occasionally. When we had the Navy's 50th celebration at Pegasus after the large parade in ChCh, there was a large attendance at Pegasus by USN personnel in full uniform & our boss was nervously watching for any polliticians and media who decided to visit. Don't know which made him the most nervous.
I was just remembering a comment made on this thread sometime last year about CINCPAC not keen on contact with NZ Forces and that we had very good relations with USCENTCOM. So I was hoping that with a new CINCPAC that our realationship with CINCPAC could reach the same level as the USCENTCOM one.
Last edited by ngatimozart; January 20th, 2012 at 07:22 PM.
Reason: typos
There are Australian press reports of a military coup in Papua New Guinea with forces loyal to ousted Prime Minister Michael Soares staging the coup.
Great just what the NZ Army (NZDF) needs at this time, streached to breaking point with Afghan, Timor, Solly, Christchurch, RENA just as well our Govt will look to see what big brother does before we act.
Great just what the NZ Army (NZDF) needs at this time, streached to breaking point with Afghan, Timor, Solly, Christchurch, RENA just as well our Govt will look to see what big brother does before we act.
CD
Well it's not quite so clear cut. It could be a mutiny over pay and conditions and not relate to the Soares controversy. All they've apparenly done is put the Defence Minister Brigadier General Francis Agwi under house arrest and replaced him with a new commander, Colonel Yaura Safa, a former defence attach to Indonesia. Apparently some soldiers had planned a demonstration about pay and conditions which when I served in RNZAF & RNZNVR would have been classed as mutiny.
Yep NZDF don't need it but every cloud has a silver lining and it might give the polies a fright and they just might see the need for more realistic funding for Vote: Defence.
Originally Posted by ngatimozart
I was just remembering a comment made on this thread sometime last year about CINCPAC not keen on contact with NZ Forces and that we had very good relations with USCENTCOM. So I was hoping that with a new CINCPAC that our realationship with CINCPAC could reach the same level as the USCENTCOM one
.
Heh - that may have been me. The RNZN is going to it's first RIMPAC post '85 this year, and this was announced late last year I think, prior to change in CINCPAC.
Small steps, but getting there - still peeved that the whole ANZUS debacle screwed relations with USA for most of my career with RNZAF. (Barring Triad '84).
Heh - that may have been me. The RNZN is going to it's first RIMPAC post '85 this year, and this was announced late last year I think, prior to change in CINCPAC.
Small steps, but getting there - still peeved that the whole ANZUS debacle screwed relations with USA for most of my career with RNZAF. (Barring Triad '84).
There was faults but if Shultz hadn't got so cranky about it and bullied NZ over it, it would have died down and things carried on quietly. But as soon as the US started the bullying well that gave a lot of mainstream support to the then NZG attitude that it didn't have. Now the anti-nuclear legislation is so deeply entrenched in the kiwi pysche that it would be a very brave or stupid politican who advocated getting rid of it as Don Brash found out in 2005. As muhc as had been said publicly about intel dealings and US not having any or very little with NZ I would hazard a guess that was for public consumption because the Echelon facility was and still is operating right through it, and you don't just cut those ties and capabilities. Politics is one thing - intel another totally different animal.
Remembering the discussion about the CINCPAC, IIRC it was mentioned that we have a very good relationship with US Central Command because we work with them in Afghanistan.
Heh - that may have been me. The RNZN is going to it's first RIMPAC post '85 this year, and this was announced late last year I think, prior to change in CINCPAC.
Small steps, but getting there - still peeved that the whole ANZUS debacle screwed relations with USA for most of my career with RNZAF. (Barring Triad '84).
I think that the Centcom relationship seems closer due to senior staff being sent to Tampa since early 2002. There is not a senior officer billeted at Pearl. Maybe on a personal level a recent CINCPAC had a beef with the NZDF (lets face it he would have been a Junior Officer 25-30 years ago when things fell apart), but the DC beltway supers actually call the shots and wanted political warmth. If Gates and Condy wanted political warmth - they got political warmth.
Triad 84 was a ripper. Saw it from the top of Moehau - A-4's and F-15's all dogfighting in the Colville Channel. We may not have entertainment that good these days but if you hangout planespotting late march out of OH it should be pretty good.
I think that the Centcom relationship seems closer due to senior staff being sent to Tampa since early 2002. There is not a senior officer billeted at Pearl. Maybe on a personal level a recent CINCPAC had a beef with the NZDF (lets face it he would have been a Junior Officer 25-30 years ago when things fell apart), but the DC beltway supers actually call the shots and wanted political warmth. If Gates and Condy wanted political warmth - they got political warmth.
Triad 84 was a ripper. Saw it from the top of Moehau - A-4's and F-15's all dogfighting in the Colville Channel. We may not have entertainment that good these days but if you hangout planespotting late march out of OH it should be pretty good.
Yes and the RNZAF site about the airshow isn't very informative at all. In fact the RNZAF website isn't very good at all. Nothing on the NH90 apart from what is put up ages ago and no offical photos of NH 90 in NZ colours. I do have photos of NH 90 in RNZAF colours and first 2 arriving at OH but that is through another place I lurk in. They say same thing about RNZAF website too.
Yes and the RNZAF site about the airshow isn't very informative at all. In fact the RNZAF website isn't very good at all. Nothing on the NH90 apart from what is put up ages ago and no offical photos of NH 90 in NZ colours. I do have photos of NH 90 in RNZAF colours and first 2 arriving at OH but that is through another place I lurk in. They say same thing about RNZAF website too.
Nah - not the 75th airshow mate. There is a reason why the website is lame - because all sorts of people will get far too excited.
I think that the Centcom relationship seems closer due to senior staff being sent to Tampa since early 2002. There is not a senior officer billeted at Pearl. Maybe on a personal level a recent CINCPAC had a beef with the NZDF (lets face it he would have been a Junior Officer 25-30 years ago when things fell apart), but the DC beltway supers actually call the shots and wanted political warmth. If Gates and Condy wanted political warmth - they got political warmth.
Triad 84 was a ripper. Saw it from the top of Moehau - A-4's and F-15's all dogfighting in the Colville Channel. We may not have entertainment that good these days but if you hangout planespotting late march out of OH it should be pretty good.
Triad '84 - best bit was A4's extreme low flying, down the centre strip a Whenuapai. Had the "honuor" of being a "security" guard for the exercise -- mainly main gate, and F-15 flight line at night. Not bad for a youngster of 19.
As for 75th - well in Singapore so will have to live off posting of photos etc. Did take part in the 50th parade though at Wigram :-)
Triad '84 - best bit was A4's extreme low flying, down the centre strip a Whenuapai. Had the "honuor" of being a "security" guard for the exercise -- mainly main gate, and F-15 flight line at night. Not bad for a youngster of 18.
As for 75th - well in Singapore so will have to live off posting of photos etc. Did take part in the 50th parade though at Wigram :-)
You were in the game Dave - up close and personal. Those sort of thrills never leave you - sort of - here I am at 18 guarding F-15's - whilst some of your mates are still in school getting chalk thrown at them.
I did not have my license yet but I remember driving out to Whenuapei with a mate in his Renault Dauphin and watching proceedings from the fence in Triad 81. But in 84 when I was a 1st year Uni student we went on an expedition to Moehau - camped - and watched in awe - washed down with warm Leopard Paw (Things you never forget). Have to admit it was semi-amusing seeing Blunties mixing it with F-15's and Mirages.
You were in the game Dave - up close and personal. Those sort of thrills never leave you - sort of - here I am at 18 guarding F-15's - whilst some of your mates are still in school getting chalk thrown at them.
I did not have my license yet but I remember driving out to Whenuapei with a mate in his Renault Dauphin and watching proceedings from the fence in Triad 81. But in 84 when I was a 1st year Uni student we went on an expedition to Moehau - camped - and watched in awe - washed down with warm Leopard Paw (Things you never forget). Have to admit it was semi-amusing seeing Blunties mixing it with F-15's and Mirages.
Blunties .. hahah, the story I heard that a F-15 pilot went for a ride in one, and came back rather green .. may not be fast the old Bluntie, but low flying was really low.
The other amusing story was that the F-16 pilots were crying foul re the Mirages .. as the Mirage Pilots would turn off their radar and sneak up on the F-16s .... never thought a Mirage could sneak anywhere.
Just a damn shame that it was the last .. rest of my time in was rather quiet in comparison. Heh, nothing like looking back into the past - hard to believe it was nearly 30 years ago.
I wonder what the new announcement is likely to be?
Perhaps we'll see Kiwi defence personnel on board the new LHD's shortly - nothing new there , but how will the new ANZAC taskforce look?
"While the meetings are mainly a talk fest there will be an announcement from the two Defence Ministers on how the forces will be working together more closely in the near future. "
The Background Election Brief to the Minister is on the MOD website. The full brief isn't up yet. A summary of key facts
p.26: Gap Crossing System: Four sets of rapid bridge crossing systems are
being acquired through the UK Ministry of Defence. Acceptance of the last
system is currently scheduled to occur by September 2012.
p.34: Reserve Force - Three Infantry Battalions located throughout New Zealand.
From Key Points pdf.
- Major Projects Report completed in October 2011.
- Bill to amend Defence Act before house, including addressing the reserves.
- Approx $270 million identified in potential savings.
- Canterbury in refit: Sept 2012-March 2013
There is a news release on the NZDF website dated Mo0nday 13/2/2012 stating that a NZDF is hosting a delegation of US defence personnel for five days this week. It is to familiarise them with NZDF capabilities and partly to focus on practical cooperation in the Pacific area. http://www.nzdf.mil.nz/news/media-re...13-usdpvnz.htm Interestingly haven't seen anything on the media sites about it.
We may not have entertainment that good these days but if you hangout planespotting late march out of OH it should be pretty good.
