Iranian Air Force (IRIAF) News & Discussion

[SABRE]

TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)- The Islamic Republic of Iran will celebrate the start of official flights by its home-made fighter jet 'Saeqeh' on Thursday.

During the celebration ceremony to be held in Tehran's Mehrabad Airport, two Saeqeh (Thunderbolt) jets will fly in the presence of a number of officials and commanders, including the defense minister.

Saeqeh, a joint product of the Iranian air force and defense ministry, has been described as similar to the American F-18 fighter jet.

The fly show in Mehrabad will be the first time the Saeqeh jet is shown in public.

Last month, Iran showed off for the first time a new fighter jet said to be modeled on the American F-5 but built using domestic technology.

The Azarakhsh (Lightening) jet - one of the first home-produced military planes by Iran - made a successful flight in the central city of Isfahan in a ceremony attended by Defense Minister Mostafa Mohammad Najjar and other officials last month.

The development of the plane was first announced in September last year, when military officials said that it was "comparable" to the US F-5 fighter jet.

Following the successful flight of Azarakhsh fighter jet, Iranian Defense Minister Brigadier General Mostafa Mohammad Najjar said that Saeqeh which is the second generation of the same fighter jet would also launch official flights in the Iranian sky in the near future.

The fly-past in Isfahan appears to have been the first time the Azarakhsh jet has been shown in public.

The current US embargo means that Iran must work hard to find spare parts to keep its fleet in the air and officials have repeatedly emphasized the importance of moving towards self-sufficiency in defense.

http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.php?nn=8606270544



Azarakhsh no doubt seems kind of like an attempt to keep the F-5 in the air but the Saeqeh still seams quite confusing to me. Its similar to F-18 or as capable as F-18?

[Miles]

I am sure we will find out soon...

[Cucullain]

The Saeqeh shown previously was in effect an F-5E with a V tail. The Azarakhsh in turn is an F-5E with the wings moved from the bottom of the fuselage to a mid point on the fuselage. While either design change may give some improvement in performance the plane is still a modified F-5. Neither could be described as similar to an F-18 in capabilities. The question is will either of these fighters enter service with the Iranian Air Force. If the Iranians wanted a fighter like this the simple answer would be to reverse engineer the F-5E directly. I suspect that there is an element of disinformation emanating from Iran. It would make more sense to develop a new fighter from scratch (or more probably based on the F-5E) which would be in the same class as the Tejas/Gripen/Tigershark. The two aircraft shown could be technology demonstrators for such a fighter. The big problem facing Iran in this scenario would be to source a suitable Radar/weapon system and an engine in the 16,000lb thrust class to power it due to the restriction on arms sales. It may of course be that the Saeqeh shown previously is not the same aircraft that will be shown to the public later in the week.

[ejaz007]

Iran has announced that it has built another indigenous fighter for its air force. Recently Iran also showed another fighter. Earlier fighter resembled US F-5 while I have not actually seen latest fighter but it is said that it resembles US F-18. Any comments about Iran’s progress and achievements in fighter manufacturing please. Link about latest fighter development is:

http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=3051932&C=mideast

Mod edit:

Guy's have a look to see if there already IS a thread on the topic you wish to discuss, before opening a new one. We get a bit tired cleaning up everyone's threads and posts for them all the time...

AD

[Lawman]

It is arguable that the Iranians should have little problem sourcing a suitable engine, since they could simply use the old J79, as they have used for many years on their F-4s. It may not be very efficient, but it would be in the right size and thrust class, and an F-20 type F-5E derivative, with the twin tails, mid mounted wing, and a single J79, would be a reasonable performer.

The truth, however, is that Iran may be best trying to simply buy some Mig-29s or Chinese JF-17s, possibly with some Su-30s as a high end supplement.

Sorry if this is not the desired thread, I couldn't find any other threads regarding the Iranian fighters, other than the Flanker thread, which this isn't really about...

[ShahriarAsta]

Mod:If you don't have anything worth while, informative or anything that could generate a worth while & informative discussion than why post at all? Next time be careful! Mocking, insulting & Degrading a country, its army & its capability is not allowed on this forum.

-SABRE

[radiosilence]

The Iranians want to be self-sufficient and this might get them there in 20 years time. Obviously, they are boasting about this fighter capabilities but its start even if they are just re-arranging old fighter parts.

[SABRE]

Iran to Display 3rd Generation of Home-Made Fighter Jet



TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)- Iran announced that it would soon test fly the third generation of its domestically-built fighter jet 'Saeqeh' (Thunderbolt).

Speaking to reporters on Thursday, executor of Saeqeh manufacturing project said that the first generation of the fighter has been built by the air force while the second generation is a joint product of the defense ministry and air force.

Hassan Parvaneh said that manufacture of the third generation of Saeqeh is underway, and added that the new type which will be tested in the near future differs from the previous generations due to major changes in its weapon system, aerodynamics and operational range.

Iran on Thursday successfully tested two more domestically-built fighter jets from its Azarakhsh (Lightning) generation and the new planes, named Saeqeh (Thunderbolt), will be displayed to the public during a military parade on National Army Day on Saturday.

The Islamic Republic celebrated the start of official flights by its home-made fighter jets during a ceremony attended by a number of officials and commanders, including the defense minister, at Tehran's Mehrabad Airport.

Saeqeh, a joint product of the Iranian air force and defense ministry, has been described as similar to the American F-18 fighter jet.

Last month, Iran showed off for the first time a new fighter jet said to be modeled on the American F-5 but built using domestic technology.

The Azarakhsh jet - one of the first home-produced military planes by Iran - made a successful flight in the central city of Isfahan in a ceremony attended by Defense Minister Mostafa Mohammad Najjar and other officials last month.

The development of the plane was first announced in September last year, when military officials said that it was "comparable" to the US F-5 fighter jet.

Following the successful flight of Azarakhsh fighter jet, Iranian Defense Minister Brigadier General Mostafa Mohammad Najjar said that Saeqeh which is the second generation of the same fighter jet would also launch official flights in the Iranian sky in the near future.

The fly-past in Isfahan appears to have been the first time the Azarakhsh jet has been shown in public.

The current US embargo means that Iran must work hard to find spare parts to keep its fleet in the air and officials have repeatedly emphasized the importance of moving towards self-sufficiency in defense.

Iran's deputy air force commander Mohammad Alavi said on Wednesday that Iran has already prepared plans to retaliate against any possible Israeli air attacks by bombing the Jewish state with "our warplanes," apparently referring to the new jet fighters.

http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.php?nn=8606300362


Nothing new. Just bit more of an information.

[tphuang]

I've read some speculation that China helped Iran quite a bit on this project. More specifically SAC (601)

[SABRE]

I've read some speculation that China helped Iran quite a bit on this project. More specifically SAC (601)

Tell this to Iranians & they would all go ego on you. It would be quite clear once we come to know about the Avionics & Weapons System. I little doubt that Chinese &/or Russians weren't invloved though.

[contedicavour]

The RID magazine (Italian affiliate to Monch Publishing Group defence magazines) in September 07 has run a long and detailed analysis of IRIAF. While the new jet is considered a modified F5E (nothing clear about BVR capability for instance), there is a very useful recap of operational aircrafts :

> 35 MIG-29 with R27 (apparently no R77)
> 24 SU-24
> approx 20 Tomcats
> approx 40 Phantoms
> approx 50 F5s
> a few J7&J8s of unclear origin (directly from China or not ?)
> a dozen Mirage F1 from Iraq

... and a dozen SU25 operated by the Pasdarans !?

I also found interesting the reading about the sole IL76 Mainstay AEW aircraft of unclear origin (fleeing Iraqi plane ?) and of unclear status.

Here's a question : a R27 equipped MIG29 can shoot at lower ranges than a F18E/F with AIM120-C-5 right ? then IRIAF shouldn't even bother to try to intercept incoming American aircrafts as they would be shot down before being able to counterattack...

cheers

[jthieme]

The Problem with their air force is that most (if not all) the US supplied aircraft are from the mid 1970's and have not been supplied with sufficient supplies to keep them maintained. I.E. F-14, F-4, F-5's. Especially the F-14 which is a real high-maintenance piece of equipment. Very few of these air craft should be considered flight ready, and even less (quite possibly none) can be considered combat ready. The Iranians are not unintelligent people, I highly doubt they would send up aircraft to combat our wave of highly effective aircraft and expert pilots. Look at Iraq in GW1, they had maintained Migs, and most of those pilots defected to Iran. Now I don't think Iranian pilots will defect to anywhere, I do believe however that their aircraft will be destroyed on the ground for the most part.

[contedicavour]

The Problem with their air force is that most (if not all) the US supplied aircraft are from the mid 1970's and have not been supplied with sufficient supplies to keep them maintained. I.E. F-14, F-4, F-5's. Especially the F-14 which is a real high-maintenance piece of equipment. Very few of these air craft should be considered flight ready, and even less (quite possibly none) can be considered combat ready. The Iranians are not unintelligent people, I highly doubt they would send up aircraft to combat our wave of highly effective aircraft and expert pilots. Look at Iraq in GW1, they had maintained Migs, and most of those pilots defected to Iran. Now I don't think Iranian pilots will defect to anywhere, I do believe however that their aircraft will be destroyed on the ground for the most part.

The Iraqi air force pilots knew it was the end of Saddam's dictatorship and that weakened the morale. Expect something different from the IRIAF pilots, and even more from the Pasdaran pilots. They (most of them anyway) are extremely motivated by Teheran's theocratic regime and unlikely not to try something.

cheers

[SABRE]

Now I don't think Iranian pilots will defect to anywhere, I do believe however that their aircraft will be destroyed on the ground for the most part.

They'll take to the sky even if F-22s are put up against them. IRIAF & especially pasdaran are trained & motivated to give up their lives for their nation. Something tells me they are well prepared to carry out a mission like pear harbour.

Few perticular countries should remember. Its not just Iran but Persia as well. Iranians haven't cutt themselves off from their pre-historic pride.

[jthieme]

The Iraqi air force pilots knew it was the end of Saddam's dictatorship and that weakened the morale. Expect something different from the IRIAF pilots, and even more from the Pasdaran pilots. They (most of them anyway) are extremely motivated by Teheran's theocratic regime and unlikely not to try something.

cheers
The difference here is that, this will not be the end of the Ayatollahs or the end of Ahmadinejad. Rather, this will destroy some of the infastructure and nuclear capabilities of Iran. Also, the Iraqi pilots fled to Iran because they did not want to be shot down and killed (the few Migs that did try to engage were all shot down). There was very little reason to suspect in GW1 that the US was going to invade Iraq with the goal of regime change. The coalition that was formed was formed on the basis that were would be no occupation or invasion with the intent to occupy Iraq. Granted morale was low, but most likely due to lack of training and our abilities to destroy their aircraft. Not to mention also that the USAF is the most feared air force in the world (that includes all air capabilities).

IRIAF pilots will certainly know that they will be conducting suicide missions with a very low probablility of success. The most they can hope for is to launch excocet's against the oil tankers. They can't hope to get anywhere near a carrier group to inflict any sort of damage, the Iranian navy would most likey take care of that aspect (probably to lay mines rather than to directly engange the US navy). I highly doubt an Iranian air campaign will take place. My guess is that they will be destroyed while on the ground.

My prediction assuming there will be some sort of US strike against Iran: IRIAF will have no impact on anything. But who knows, time has proven that a much smaller, less trained, less equiped force can inflict major damage on superior enemy.

[BilalK]

I think the improvements we see on their Saegeh and Azarakash (sp?-both) might be technology demonstrations for their Shafaq project. I remember seeing one of Saegeh or Azarakash sporting higher mounted wings, similar to Shafaq.

[paskal]

i personally think iran should purchased r-77 air-to-air missile to withstand any attack in the future.
missiles play a very important role in air combat.
the americans shot down a few mig's-29 in iraq with amramm's.
while the iraqis were only using mere normal missiles.

[IceCold]

Show news paris 2007 suggested that iran might be close to a 250 Sukhoi order with Russia. If indeed that might be the case it will change the whole face of iranian air force from a second string minor league Air Force to a highly capable and lethal power. IMO iran should go for deals like these with their pilots getting trained in russia instead of going for the local industry since it will take time to mature up and iran does not seem to have all that much of time as BUSH administration is thriving to solve the issue and take this victory with them as they depart in 2008 presidential elections.

[Izzy1]

Show news paris 2007 suggested that iran might be close to a 250 Sukhoi order with Russia. If indeed that might be the case it will change the whole face of iranian air force from a second string minor league Air Force to a highly capable and lethal power. IMO iran should go for deals like these with their pilots getting trained in russia instead of going for the local industry since it will take time to mature up and iran does not seem to have all that much of time as BUSH administration is thriving to solve the issue and take this victory with them as they depart in 2008 presidential elections.

In all honesty, 250 Sukhois are the bare minimum of what Iran needs. Their air defence network is a shambles and in dire need of investment.

Just amazed it has took Tehran this long to start upgrading tio be honest.

[swerve]

It is arguable that the Iranians should have little problem sourcing a suitable engine, since they could simply use the old J79, as they have used for many years on their F-4s. It may not be very efficient, but it would be in the right size and thrust class, and an F-20 type F-5E derivative, with the twin tails, mid mounted wing, and a single J79, would be a reasonable performer. ....

That presumes that they can make new J79s, or have a very large numbers of spares they can refurbish. And even if one of those is true . . . . if they can make J79s, they could probably make something newer & more efficient, so why bother? And you'd need a very large stock of usable engines to make it worthwhile building a fighter around an engine that is no longer made. One for each fighter, plus enough spares to last the lifetime of the fighters. Your fleet size would be limited by your engine stocks, which is not a happy position to be in.

[contedicavour]

Show news paris 2007 suggested that iran might be close to a 250 Sukhoi order with Russia. If indeed that might be the case it will change the whole face of iranian air force from a second string minor league Air Force to a highly capable and lethal power. IMO iran should go for deals like these with their pilots getting trained in russia instead of going for the local industry since it will take time to mature up and iran does not seem to have all that much of time as BUSH administration is thriving to solve the issue and take this victory with them as they depart in 2008 presidential elections.

If Putin decides to get really mad at the US administration over the ATBM defense sites in Eastern Europe then selling a considerable number of Flankers to Iran is probably top of the list since it would bring in money and anger the US mightily. However then Russia would lose any remaining credibility when requesting a stop to Iran's nuclear programme... and it remains in Russia's interest to stop nuclear escalation to preserve its role as superpower thanks to its nuclear arsenal.

cheers

[rabirizvi]

If Putin decides to get really mad at the US administration over the ATBM defense sites in Eastern Europe then selling a considerable number of Flankers to Iran is probably top of the list since it would bring in money and anger the US mightily. However then Russia would lose any remaining credibility when requesting a stop to Iran's nuclear programme... and it remains in Russia's interest to stop nuclear escalation to preserve its role as superpower thanks to its nuclear arsenal.

cheers

On the other hand if they sell the jets, they'll buy more influence in iran. iran also needs support from where ever she can get against any future UN sanctions or even worse Millitary use by US.I think if russia plays smart she can get money & stop iran to pursue any ambitions with respect to Nuclear weapons. Thus making sure russia profits even from the worst condition possible in the region

[SABRE]

Iran buys Israeli fighter jets


20:00 | 23/ 10/ 2007
Iran has signed a contract with China for the delivery of two squadrons of J-10 fighter planes. The design was developed by Israel for its Air Force and then sold to Beijing. Engines for the jets will be supplied by Russia.

Representatives of the Iran Aircraft Manufacturing Industrial Company said China would deliver the total (24 jets) in 2008-2010. Experts, estimating one fighter at $40 million, put the contract's value at $1 billion.

The maximum range of the J-10 with detachable fuel tanks is 2,940 km. In this way, Iran will be able not only to fly over the Persian Gulf, but also theoretically venture as far as Israel and come back to base. Until now, Iran's longest-reach fighters have been Russian-made MiG-29s (Fulcrum), whose maximum range is 2,100 km. Experts, however, do not think the two squadrons of J-10s will substantially alter the balance of force in the region.

"The American military has far more planes of more advanced types in the Persian Gulf area," said Konstantin Makiyenko, an analyst with the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies.

"A more likely opponent of Shia Iran is Sunni Saudi Arabia. But even Saudi Arabia, thanks to American assistance, has a more powerful air force than Iran," he added.

In the expert's view, Iran will most likely use J-10s to protect key facilities, such as the nuclear power plant at Bushehr. Besides, the very presence of J-10 jets could act as a deterrent, said Makiyenko: the fighters can theoretically scuttle any Israeli strike at facilities which Israel may believe are manufacturing weapons of mass destruction.

Experts say that in mid-2007 the Chinese Air Force had a complement of 89 J-10s. According to unofficial reports, China had intended to build 120 such fighters for its needs. As a propulsion unit the J-10 uses the Russian AL-31FN engine, an upgraded version of the AL-31F turbojet widely employed on Su-27 (Flanker) fighter planes. In July 2005, China concluded a contract with arms export monopoly Rosoboronexport for the supply within the next two years of 100 AL-31FN engines from Moscow's Salyut plant with an option on another 100 engines. In the summer of 2007, China exercised its option by signing a new contract for another 100 AL-31FN engines to be supplied within the next two years.

http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20071023/85174001.html


It is unconfirmed report so treat it accordingly.