Black Hawk Down - Six Die

[ullu]

Sad news for American Families. Six US soldiers die in another copter crash. Is this ever gonig to end???


An Army Black Hawk helicopter crashed Friday -- apparently shot down by insurgents -- killing all six U.S. soldiers aboard and capping the bloodiest seven days in Iraq for Americans since the fall of Baghdad.

In retaliation, American troops backed by Bradley fighting vehicles swept through Iraqi neighborhoods before dawn Saturday, blasting houses suspected of being insurgent hideouts with machine guns and heavy weapons fire.

"This is to remind the town that we have teeth and claws and we will use them," said Lt. Col. Steven Russell, commander of the 1st Battalion, 22nd Infantry Regiment.

The U.S. death toll for the week climbed to 32, including those aboard the Black Hawk. Two other soldiers were killed near Mosul, raising concerns that the insurgency was spreading north.

U.S. policy, meanwhile, suffered another setback as Turkey decided not to send troops to Iraq because of strong opposition from Iraqi officials.

The Black Hawk crashed on an island in the Tigris River and burst into flames -- the third crash caused by hostile fire in two weeks and the second causing fatalities. Maj. Josslyn Aberle said the cause of Friday's crash had not been determined, but several other officers, speaking on condition of anonymity, believed it was shot down.

The helicopter, assigned to the 101st Airborne Division, went down about 9:40 a.m. about a half mile from the U.S. base in Saddam Hussein's former palace, which serves as headquarters for the 4th Infantry Division.

moreeeeeeeee..........
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2003/11/07/international1842EST0744.DTL

[Oqaab]

Man, atleast 2-3 american soldiers are dying everyday. Turkey refuses to send its troops to Iraq. Pakistan and Bangladesh also refused.... Britain too is trying to save its troops. Now who will support the americans. They are alone in the battlefield. :!:

[ullu]

And battle has just beGun. :D

[Winter]

There are two multi-national divisions in Iraq, with a third being formed, I think. Nowhere near enough, but a larger force than most people give credit.

[WebMaster]

Its very sad to see the soldiers die. Though, they are trained for this type of stuff but still human life lost is a loss for all.

[Winter]

Quite right Webmaster...

[Red aRRow]

Yeah WEBS (webmaster) is right. But those soldiers shouldn't even be there in the first place. All responsiblity for loss of life, Iraqi or American, lies with the hawkish neo cons in Washington. :mad

[suleman]

seeing the current conditions allied forces will have to evacuate iraq otherwise they will face too many casualties.Muslims all overthe world espacially alqaida is regrouping in iraq as its easier to kill them in iraq then in afghanistan as they are in large numbers.Bush is wasteing the life of his soldiers undue.They now accept the fact that its not easy to conquer a nation.U can defeat army but cant conquer a nation.

[Winter]

In this case I believe the U.S. would not say 'conquer' but rather 'liberate' Iraq....Regardless, I see your point.

If 'conquering' a nation means to dominantly occupy that nation without resistance then few nations have ever 'conquered.' Northern Ireland is seen as a legitimate state of the United Kingdom, but look at the resistance there over the past 100 years.

Personally I feel they're already looking at too many casualties. No such thing as too few.

Iraq Timetable:

End of February 2004: A law for the administration of the state for the transitional period, including procedures for the election of a transitional assembly.

End of May 2004: Election of a transitional assembly representing Iraq's 18 provinces. It will include representatives of all the country's social groups, as well as professionals and tribal members.

End of June 2004: The election of a provisional government by the transitional assembly and dissolution of the current Governing Council, installed by the US-led coalition on July 13, 2003.

Before end of 2005: A council to be elected by the Iraqi people to draft a permanent constitution.

End of 2005: Elections for a new government according to the provisions of a new constitution.

[nsdap_id]

I am afraid that the casualities are going to Latino green-card holders again!!! :mad Sad to see that these cannon-fodders in U.S.Army uniforms must die thousands of miles for Bush and Co as well as goddamn neo-cons :( :(

I remember Nam where 12% U.S. casualities were Latinos!

QUESTION: What is this? Hidden racism? Sending non-whites to war and die with another colored races??

[Mujahid]

I think americans are in deep water now, where unseen powers abide.


Wasalam,

Mujahid :cop

[Oqaab]

Hey, yesterday I saw a donkey cart with missile launchers in Iraq .... :D Quite Intelligent.

[boylde]

Where the insurgants getting these wepons from if we can cut down the number of RPG'S and wepons like that as well as capturing the the insurgants.

[Temoor_A]

seeing the current conditions allied forces will have to evacuate iraq otherwise they will face too many casualties.Muslims all overthe world espacially alqaida is regrouping in iraq as its easier to kill them in iraq then in afghanistan as they are in large numbers.Bush is wasteing the life of his soldiers undue.They now accept the fact that its not easy to conquer a nation.U can defeat army but cant conquer a nation.
The problem is that US is adopting softer stance vis-a-vis tough one and that allows some freedom for gurreilla fighters to cause some serious disturbances.

Donald Rumsfield, did not send the desired number of troops in Iraq, as per requested by American commanders, so he should understand as well.

NOTE: This is not Vietnam!

And US still is far from defeat in Iraq. So far they did some important break-throughs there!

--> Capturing Iraq in 21 days.
--> Capturing Saddam Hussain (and over 40 of his aides among 50 cards)
--> Killing his all 3 sons (wanted for corruption and killing)
--> Installing Interim Iraqi Govt
--> Softening resistance by taking back control of rebel-held cities (over 25,000 gurreilla fighters killed in last 2 years)
--> Holding the elections in a war-torn country

But they are still facing some resistance in some remote areas (mostly in the so called 'sunni-triangle')

Total death toll has reached approx. 1500 troops (out of 150,000 total Americans there) and calling it impressive sounds like a joke to me!

Yes! about 100 military vehicles have been damaged and destroyed but some of them are under-repairs amd 12 helicopters downed (in last almost 3 year period). As far as wounded are concerned, they reached 12,000 in total but half of them have returned to Iraq already.

Thats the summary of US performance in Iraq and I think that Iraqis have lost badly. So don't go for media propanganda and take the entire situation in to account.

[Deltared075]

Where the insurgants getting these wepons from if we can cut down the number of RPG'S and wepons like that as well as capturing the the insurgants.

It will be hard to cut down the number of RPG's because the weapon are more than the Iraqis freedom fighter can use. Lot of weapons and few people to use it. it will take years to find out all hidden weapons.

[ajay_ijn]

Its very sad to see the soldiers die. Though, they are trained for this type of stuff but still human life lost is a loss for all.
But still its War.
No Matter how much Soldiers are trained,There will be casualities.
Thats is why US is developing Unmanned vehicles.

But The way I like is the professional Way,Something Nazis like though they were cruel they fought in a Organised unit not like Terrorist Cowards.

One more thing i like in US Military,They are sympathic to Civilians which is most important in a war,winning the confidence of People.


seeing the current conditions allied forces will have to evacuate iraq otherwise they will face too many casualties.Muslims all overthe world espacially alqaida is regrouping in iraq as its easier to kill them in iraq then in afghanistan as they are in large numbers.Bush is wasteing the life of his soldiers undue.They now accept the fact that its not easy to conquer a nation.U can defeat army but cant conquer a nation.
.
I don't think,There are many ways to conquer a Nation,But US is using the most humanitarian Method i think.
US Army can just leave that place and USAF could do massive bombing on badghad/iraq and say that they have conquered the nation.
Or They can also use the cruel method like the notorius Nazis.
Killing every person including Civilians if the soldier gets doubt that he/she is a Militant.
There are many other horrible methods to conquer a Nation.

Its just not about conquering.Its about achieving peaceful and stabilized iraq.
If it was just about conquering US could have even used nukes.

Its not that US is not capable of doing it,it about doing it in a better way.

If U Really Want To Know About the What is US Military Might,Then go back to the days of Cold War when they matched every Soviet Nuke with a more destructive one.

[tatra]

I am afraid that the casualities are going to Latino green-card holders again!!! :mad Sad to see that these cannon-fodders in U.S.Army uniforms must die thousands of miles for Bush and Co as well as goddamn neo-cons :( :(

I remember Nam where 12% U.S. casualities were Latinos!

QUESTION: What is this? Hidden racism? Sending non-whites to war and die with another colored races??

Nope, just the way it work is that for some groups (blacks, latinos) the military represents a good avenue to getting an education (paid for by the military) and social-economic advancement. For some it may be the only way to get ahead in life. The result is that you get a relatively high proportion of black and latinos in the military and within the military in certain jobs and ranks. Then, when you go to war, naturally these groups will also be overrepresented on the casualy lists.

[Pendekar]

One more thing i like in US Military,They are sympathic to Civilians which is most important in a war,winning the confidence of People.

i have heard a hundreds reports of US soldiers deliberately engaging civilians, even when not threaten. i think the US military should scouring it's ranks for mentally disordered soldiers.

and there is a story of the dead Italian Intelligence officer. it seems lying have become commonplace in Bush government.

[tatra]

and there is a story of the dead Italian Intelligence officer. it seems lying have become commonplace in Bush government.

Yes, that story has been notably absent from CNN. A female Italian journalist was kidnapped in Iraq. She was relased to Italian secret service members after a ransom was paid. One their way to Bagdad airport, their convoy was shot up by US forces at a checkpoint, apparently with no warning or prior incident. An Italian secret serviceman was killed as he covered the journalist with his body. He received a state funeral in Italy. That journalist now claims that the Americans may have wanted her dead because she wrote critically about the US forces in Iraq for a left-wing journal. Apparently, her kidnappers told her as much in advance. Investigations are ongoing, both on by Italians and Americans.

[moughoun]

I am afraid that the casualities are going to Latino green-card holders again!!! :mad Sad to see that these cannon-fodders in U.S.Army uniforms must die thousands of miles for Bush and Co as well as goddamn neo-cons :( :(

I remember Nam where 12% U.S. casualities were Latinos!

QUESTION: What is this? Hidden racism? Sending non-whites to war and die with another colored races??

over 70% of the casualties are White:rolleyes:, it's that way because of the disportionate number of white's in the combat MOS's

[Gremlin29]

ajay_ijn, I really appreciate your sentiment and I'm happy to see that there are people in the world that don't buy into all of the anti-American propaganda.

Regarding the Italian journalist, just like the media and in keeping with the current philosphy of the world people miskew the truth with half truths and lies. She was told my her captors that while they were moving her to a drop off point they were at risk from the Americans. Well no kidding, if your being escorted around by terrorists regardless of who you are at risk from being hurt by those fighting the terrorists. The media made it sound like the US was gunning for here but anybody with HALF a brain can see the truth in the statement she made while many disregard what was said and spin it around to sound like something different. I find it disgusting that so many people don't see who the culprits really are, the scumbags that kidnapped that lady in the first place. THEY are the ones that are to blame for the subsequent shooting, not the Americans. Her CAPTORS (you understand that she was kidnapped right?) placed her in harms way.

Tatra is right on the mark regarding minorities in the service.

[Pendekar]

i heard stories about some US officers ordered an execution of civilians, and then they place a weapons besides the bodies and make a report that they have killed an insurgents.

Also there is this conduct among the americans soldiers that when fired upon, they'll start shooting randomly on everything that move around them. Though i have no there circumstances that have to be considered, but such an action can only strengthen the insurgent by providing them with more sympathizers and potential recruits.

[highsea]

Well, this thread was about an incident back in Nov. 2003. Somehow it got resurrected and has been off topic since. Now we are making baseless allegations of officers executing civilians and other such bullshit.

Pendakar, consider this a warning.

Locking.