Updated[not true anymore]: Zimbabwa to buy FC-1

[fieldmarshal]

Zimbabwa to buy FC-1

http://www.suntimes.co.za/2004/06/13/news/news02.asp

ZIMBABWE'S order for more than 240-million worth of jet fighters from China flies in the face of a request by South African Foreign Affairs Minister Nkosazana Dlamini-Zuma that the country stop selling arms in sub-Saharan Africa.

According to a semi-official US defence intelligence publication, Dlamini-Zuma made the request, during a meeting of the China-South Africa bilateral forum, to head off a possible arms race on the subcontinent.


Military sources in Harare say that Zimbabwe will acquire 12 FC-1s as replacements for the Chengdu F-7s, currently based in Gweru. The FC-1, a lightweight multipurpose fighter based on Russia's MiG-33, will provide a credible answer to the challenge posed by the 28 JAS-39 Gripen multi-role fighters that the SA government has ordered from Saab, the Swedish arms manufacturer.


According to Armed Forces Journal International, published in Virginia, US, Dlamini-Zuma's request was at least partly aimed at protecting the interests of SA's state-owned arms industries. But her request also "reveals that South Africa has observed a growing pattern of Chinese arms sales" in its own backyard, and provided "evidence of its serious concern about the matter".


Yesterday Foreign Affairs spokes man Ronnie Mamoepa said he could not recall Dlamini-Zuma making such a request. He referred further queries to his department's Asian Affairs desk, which did not answer calls.


The Zimbabwean fighter jet order also defies a 1998 appeal by UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan that defence expenditure in Southern Africa be frozen for 10 years at 1.5% of countries' GDP.


Figures compiled for the SA Institute of International Affairs show that, if anything, Annan's plea has been answered with a full-scale arms race between Zimbabwe, Namibia, South Africa and other countries in the region.


The South African government says it spends only 1.5% of GDP on arms. According to the institute's figures, however, only Zambia and Swaziland have adhered to the 1.5% limit. Zimbabwe (3.4% ), Namibia (3.6% ) and South Africa (1.7% ), it says, have committed themselves to expensive military upgrades.

[fieldmarshal]

awsome aint it...........to all u doubders out there..eat ur heart out..........n all my indian frineds out there this must really hurt...no offence but aouch. :D:

[fieldmarshal]

aint it ironic FC-1 being baught to counter the grippen.............but remember they are buying fc-1 n not jf-17 thunder..........n tell u wt guys there is a hell of a difference between the two

[corsair7772]

Difference? I thought it was just the name they changed because of pakistani reservations.

And anyway to all those who think that the JF-17 is inferior to the Gripen, read the ACM's interview and note that the JF-17 has enough room for upgrades to easily entre into the Hi-tech and 4th generation category. :smokingc:

[adsH]

its the chinese cheap version
pakistan will not sell the JF-17 to Zimbabwe, would cause too much ill feeling for Pak in the west and may cause the west to stop supporting PAF.

[Revival_786]

Technologically JF-17 is upgradeable but power-to-weight wise, you are still vulnerable (in dogfights, etc.) Its possible to upgrade the engine on the plane, no?

[srirangan]

So what's the difference betw the JF-17 and the FC-1? :?

[adsH]

So what's the difference betw the JF-17 and the FC-1? :?

FC-1 is a basic Chinese 3rd generation Fighter and Jf-17 has extensively modified sub systems including western radars and completely different Avionics similar to the ones on the Rose 3 i think, with IRST. and other AI components. these mod are done by PAF and the Cockpit is very different its apparently made out of Composite instead of the basic Chinese version. there other varius undisclosed mods.

[fieldmarshal]

u ask wts the diff.........well the diff between the two vatients will be as wide as the earth and the sky......the only simalarity theyll ave is the air frame and may be the engine...initally they will ave the same engine.....but after a while ull see a new engine........fc-1 will be an effective machine but the jf-17 thunder will be awsome.and will become better with time..........an other thing jf-17 is only n i repeat only for Pakistan........fc-1 is the export version even the chinese varient will be different.........ud all know soon wt i am talkin bout...... :smokingc:

[fieldmarshal]

some of the specs of a jf-17 thunder are..........JF-17 already will have IRST, FLIR, CLDP, night vision goggles, HMD, Full glass cockpit. Regarding radar i think either Grifo S-7 or RC400 will do the work.......... ;)

[fieldmarshal]

while on the other hand an fc-1 is most likly to come with a chinese electronic suite.

[srirangan]

So as I understand it correctly, FC-1 is the base and JF-17 is the complete thing.. right? Thanskf or the info adsH..

[Revival_786]

adsh - "FC-1 is a basic Chinese 3rd generation Fighter and Jf-17 has extensively modified sub systems including western radars and completely different Avionics similar to the ones on the Rose 3 i think, with IRST. and other AI components. these mod are done by PAF and the Cockpit is very different its apparently made out of Composite instead of the basic Chinese version. there other varius undisclosed mods."

lol there you go srirangan

[Oqaab]

Difference? I thought it was just the name they changed because of pakistani reservations.

And anyway to all those who think that the JF-17 is inferior to the Gripen, read the ACM's interview and note that the JF-17 has enough room for upgrades to easily entre into the Hi-tech and 4th generation category. :smokingc:

Gripens uses composites extensively. JF-17 doesnt. Gripen is far better in avionics. JF-17s radar (If grifo) lacks multi-targets tracing capability.

A simple question, if JF-17 isnt inferior to Gripen, then why have PAF selected Gripen as a front line fighter ?

[adsH]

Difference? I thought it was just the name they changed because of pakistani reservations.

And anyway to all those who think that the JF-17 is inferior to the Gripen, read the ACM's interview and note that the JF-17 has enough room for upgrades to easily entre into the Hi-tech and 4th generation category. :smokingc:

Gripens uses composites extensively. JF-17 doesnt. Gripen is far better in avionics. JF-17s radar (If grifo) lacks multi-targets tracing capability.

A simple question, if JF-17 isnt inferior to Gripen, then why have PAF selected Gripen as a front line fighter ?

look no one here is drawing a direct comparison with these two AC. we all know JF-17 will be inferior to Gripens, PAF has admitted it, saying its not a higtech AC currently what you would class a High-tech fighter like EF 2000 or grippens or rafael. JF-17 will utilize composite for Cockpit construction, the BOdy will not have composite. The Avionics would be similar to the Mirages which have Rose 3 Config on them. but the first model of JF-17 would not have IRTS, it will come as one of the five major updates planned for it during its redevelopment cycle.

[SABRE]

China can sell their FC-1 to Zimbabwe & its cheaper than JF-17.
Pak might not sell JF-17 to Zimbabwe not because of western pressure but because they wont sell any arm to any African nation which is against Souh Africa.
But on the other thought Pak might sell JF-17 to Zimbabwe cause it has more militrialistic relation with Zimbabwe than any other country. In 1980's Zimbabwe got its independence & asked PAkistan for Military Help. The first ever Chief of Army Staff of Zimbabwe happens to be a Pakistani & first ever Chief of Airforce for Zimbabwe happens to be a Pakistani.

[adsH]

China can sell their FC-1 to Zimbabwe & its cheaper than JF-17.
Pak might not sell JF-17 to Zimbabwe not because of western pressure but because they wont sell any arm to any African nation which is against Souh Africa.
But on the other thought Pak might sell JF-17 to Zimbabwe cause it has more militrialistic relation with Zimbabwe than any other country. In 1980's Zimbabwe got its independence & asked PAkistan for Military Help. The first ever Chief of Army Staff of Zimbabwe happens to be a Pakistani & first ever Chief of Airforce for Zimbabwe happens to be a Pakistani.

they wont sell it to Zimbabwe, South africa is the only nation that can work with Pakistan on Project like R&D on the Grippens and the Drater, and ,ay be the only source of Drater type Missiles.

[gf0012-aust]

Chinese ambassador to South Africa denied reports of fighter jet sales to Zimbabwe in a press briefing held Monday in Pretoria.
While answering a question posed by local media, Ambassador Liu Guijin said it is totally groundless for the report that Zimbabwe has made order to buy 240 million US dollars worth of Chinese made fighter jets.

Liu Guijin said that he had immediately contacted with Chinese ambassador to Zimbabwe on the issue shortly after he had read the report. "We find that the report is not true and it is baseless," he said.
The Chinese ambassador said that the Chinese government already consulted the matter with the Zimbabwean government.

South African Deputy Foreign Minister Deputy Foreign Minister Aziz Pahad also said that he was not aware of the claim made by the report.

Local reports quoted military sources in Harare as saying that Zimbabwe will acquire 12 Chinese made FC-1s as replacements for the Chengdu F-7s, currently based in Gweru.

The FC-1 would provide a credible answer to the challenge posed by the 28 JAS-39 Gripen multi-role fighters that the South African government has ordered from Saab, the Swedish arms manufacturer.

http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200406/22/eng20040622_147120.html

[fieldmarshal]

interustin..............somthin is cookin but wt........ :smokingc:

[umair]

Nothing is cookin.That press report was nothing but crap.

[The Watcher]

:idea2 Zimbabway doesn't even have money to support its Cricket Team let alone buy new fighter jets. :roll

[gf0012-aust]

Nothing is cookin.That press report was nothing but crap.

The zimbabwe report was crap or the chinese one??

[adsH]

I can't believe this, Mugabee has not got a shred of self respect first he Kicks people out of their homes and then goes on a genocidal Rally, and then expects to buy New advance weapons from his Maxed out Two bit credit limit. Zimbabwe would of been so well off if it only had kept its cool like SA. the starvation mass poverty is because of Corruption.

[P.A.F]

the story is just a load of crap.

[The Watcher]

following gf, more confirmation


Doubts Cast on Supposed Zimbabwean Fighter Order from China

LONDON, UK - Reports surfaced earlier in the summer that the Mugabe government had reached a deal with China to buy 12 fighters for the Air Force of Zimbabwe. They cited a June 9 statement in Parliament by the defense ministry's permanent secretary, Trust Maphos, that 12 of the fighters had been ordered and that six would be delivered as early as possibly the next week. This was followed days later by a statement by an opposition party official that 12 Chinese fighters were being ordered.

However, the reportedly $240 million "deal" seems to have since evaporated into thin air. A Chinese official emphatically denied the report of the deal when queries at a press briefing on June 21 in South Africa, calling the report "not true" and "baseless". Both governments have since claimed to have no knowledge of such a deal although there is still speculation that the Zimbabwean government remains interested in such a purchase. Its ability to fund such a purchase is another matter, however, considering the general shortages plaguing the country as a result of the Mugabe government's increasingly irrational economic and political policies.

Local speculation has centered on the Chengdu FC-1 as the fighter in question, but this raises more questions since this model is still in the developmental stage. Still, the Air Force is known to have pursued possible purchase of the older Chengdu F-7MG.

Source: Air Force Monthly

[WebMaster]

Subject changed/updated.