Identification help !!!

[Caius]

Can anyone help me for the identification of the vehicle at right of the picture....
It seem to me to have a dual mode of propulsion (wheels and tracks)
Any infos are welcomed......
http://voenavto.almanacwhf.ru/fotos/br03p1/br003-013.jpg

Thanks for your help....

[gf0012-aust]

It looks like a modified BMP. I'd say it's a BMP Mule.

[Winter]

To me, it looks like a heavily messed-around BTR-80. Possibly a modified GAZ-59032 (Yes, I had to look that up, no catchy names like Bradley or Tiger ;))...So in that case, it would be a derivative of a derivative. :roll Edit: Though I would be inclined to gf's statement, as the foward-based turret and chassis do seem to bear a strong resemblance to a BMP-3...

Judging from the source, I took it that the image was snapped at the International Exhibition of Dual-Purpose Motor Vehicles in Bronnitsy near Moscow, if you hadn't already known. Hope that helps.

[gf0012-aust]

It's an Ob'yekt 1200 BMP experimental. I've answered the question on some of your other forum postings as well. ;)

[Red aRRow]

It's as if they merged a BMP with a BTR.
BTW Caius where is this picture taken?? and which country does the vehicle belong to??? :?

[gf0012-aust]

It's as if they merged a BMP with a BTR.
BTW Caius where is this picture taken?? and which country does the vehicle belong to??? :?

It's Russian

[Caius]

Shamayel, the picture was taken at this site

http://voenavto.almanacwhf.ru/slovo/sl23.htm

Unfortunately the site is in russian...... :? :? :?

[tatra]

It is not a GAZ-59032 / btr-80 commandpost vehicle derivative. See image:
http://www.amphibiousvehicle.net/amphi/G/gazspecial2/g59032-baseline.jpeg

It is also NOT the Ob'yekt 1200 - Wheeled BMP with rear mounted engine and 73mm gun - of 1964. The year matters as there was also an Ob'yekt 1200 in 1954, which was the prototype ZIL-153 BTR 4x4. The Ob'yekt 1200 of 1964 was an 8x8 BMP competitor built by Rybinsk. See images:
http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/o1200_01.jpghttp://gallery.vondur.net/albums/tank_museum/DSC02147.jpg

The vehicle we're trying to identify is probably related to Ob'yekt 1200 in the sense that it is another BMP-1 competitor prototype. In the late 1950s
it became necessary to create a new type of weapon that was subsequently called infantry combat vehicle (BMP in Russian). The BMP enabled troops to deliver fire both from inside the vehicle deployed in combat formations and skirmish lines supported by on-board armament. Motorized infantry elements outfitted with such vehicles needed requisite mobility, combat maneuverability, considerable fire power and sufficient survivability in a wide range of combat actions, thereby becoming able to successfully execute combat tasks in modern warfare combats in cooperation with tanks and independently. In 1962 Russian developers began to work in conformity with the aforementioned concept to create such a vehicle (BMP). In all 17 versions were developed. In 1962 - 1964 six prototypes were created: two wheeled vehicles; two-tracked and two - wheel-tracked.

It's not Ob'yekt 911 (1964) I.V.Gavalov IFV with under belly wheels - 5 road wheels. But it could be Ob'yekt 19 (1965) Bryansk BMP half track competitor, experimental reconnaissance vehicle. This is a mixed wheel-tracked BMP with rear mounted engine and 73mm gun. To me, the vehicle looks more in line with a recon-vehicle (like BRDM-1 and BRDM-2, with their distinctive under-belly wheels to augment cross-country performance) rather than an infantry fighting vehicle like BMP-1. So, that would seem a match. Problem is, I can't find a picture! :mad

[gf0012-aust]

Tatra, I've got a (admittedly blurry and grainy black and white shot of this vehicle which is captioned 940/1200 - the centre wheels appear to be banded) is this likely to be a 940 then?

The reason why I've assumed it to be the 1200 is because of the banding and the fact that the "wheels" are lifted high as well.

I thought I had this one nailed! :eek

[tatra]

@gf0012
That could also be a possibility. Trouble is finding images for these puppies.
All references I could find on the 940 are these:
"Ob'yekt 940 - Experimental version"
"Ob'yekt 940 - BMP-based experimental version"
"Obiekt 940 (1976). Command vehicle."

If 940, it would be a decade newer than the others mentioned thusfar, which could explain the BMP-2 like turret.

There's a nice piece on BMP development here: http://www.rickard.karoo.net/weaponsmain4.html
This mentions Obiekt 1200, 19, 911, 914 and 765

More info on the 1200 here: http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/o1200.html

[gf0012-aust]

@gf0012
That could also be a possibility. Trouble is finding images for these puppies.
All references I could find on the 940 are these:
"Ob'yekt 940 - Experimental version"
"Ob'yekt 940 - BMP-based experimental version"
"Obiekt 940 (1976). Command vehicle."

If 940, it would be a decade newer than the others mentioned thusfar, which could explain the BMP-2 like turret.

There's a nice piece on BMP development here: http://www.rickard.karoo.net/weaponsmain4.html
This mentions Obiekt 1200, 19, 911, 914 and 765

More info on the 1200 here: http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/o1200.html

Tatra, there appears to be a complete dry up on Ob'yekt pics. all the links I had are bouncing.


This is now starting to krapp me off - I want to know what it is!

[WebMaster]

:lol

Lets start from the link of the picture:

http://voenavto.almanacwhf.ru/fotos/br03p1/fotobr03p1.htm [the picture is among many other on the site and translation of russian writting on top is something like this:

The photoreport on an exhibition "Bronnitsy - 2003" which passed in August 2003ã.
Part the second " Automobiles on range "
" Fighting machines "
Safely click on all prevjushki to see the big photos!

This maybe a "commercial" vehicle then a military one as the website carrying it relates to auto industry.

Fight it off. :D

[gf0012-aust]

Found it!

Its an Obyekt 19

http://www.jedsite.info/misc/oscar/obyekt_series/obyekt19/obyekt19_004.jpg

http://www.jedsite.info/misc/oscar/obyekt_series/obyekt19/obyekt19_001.jpg

http://www.jedsite.info/misc/oscar/obyekt_series/obyekt19/obyekt19_009.jpg

http://www.jedsite.info/misc/oscar/obyekt_series/obyekt19/obyekt19_007.jpg

http://www.jedsite.info/misc/oscar/obyekt_series/obyekt19/obyekt19_003.jpg[/img]

[Winter]

Superbly done gf0012...

:frosty

[gf0012-aust]

Superbly done gf0012...

:frosty

I cannot tell a lie, I had lots of help from all over the place with this. ;)

[Caius]

Thanks to all, specially to you gf0012, my curiosity was now satisfied :) :) ;)

[tatra]

Aha, Gf0012, you found JED again! No wonder then (so pi**ed I couldn't get in there though my old links). I see now a basic BMP1 turret instead of BMP2 like turret. You are commended for beating me to the punchline photography-wise :smokingc:

Incidentally, the Ob'yekt 1200 is a very nice design, which in modernized form could well have interested today's RDF. In fact, I like this basic design much better than the basic design used for the btr-60/70/80/90 series. A sort of Mowag Piranha / LAV / Stryker avant-la-lettre.

BMP 1 alternative prototypes in addition to Obýekt 1200 (1964):
Ob'yekt 19 technical info:
http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/o019.html
http://legion.wplus.net/guide/army/ta/kgbm.shtml

Ob'yekt 911 technical info:
http://www.army.lt/armor/btr/obj911.html
http://legion.wplus.net/guide/army/ta/911.shtml

Ob'yekt 914 technical info: http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/o914.html

The other Object 1200 of 1954 = the Zil 153 info:
http://www.army.lt/armor/btr2/zil153.html

Obiekt 1200 (1964), 19, 911, 914 and also 765
http://otvaga.narod.ru/Otvaga/arm-russia.htm
(this site slow to load!)

[gf0012-aust]

Tatra, one of my favs is the Dana 8 wheeler gun mount. A very purposeful looking unit. ;)

[tatra]

Ah yes, the VZOR 77 a.k.a Dana 152mm SPGH, and its cousins Ondova (with a longer 53-caliber barrel) and Zuzana (an upgraded Dana with 155mm L/45). Nice design!

http://www.military.cz/army_cr/modernizace/pics/Dana.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/europe/images/zuzana-1a.jpg

Here are some of my favorites:
SA G6 (UAE variant)
http://www.jedsite.info/artillery/golf/g6_series/z-uae/g6uae_001.jpg

SA Rooikat 76mm
http://www.jedsite.info/8x8afv/romeo/rooikat_series/rooikat76/rooikat76_009.jpg

[Revival_786]

Woah... (looking at tatra's post) :eek


That thing is huge... do armies actually use this thing? Do they fair well against tanks?

[tatra]

Woah... (looking at tatra's post) :eek


That thing is huge... do armies actually use this thing? Do they fair well against tanks?

If you are referring to the Rooikat 8x8, although the operational South African army units have only a 76mm gun, they have on occasion made minced meat out of T55s and (I think) T62s in southern Africa. There is also a 105mm version and a version with single 35mm gun and ZT3 ATGW. Prototypes were built of a twin 35mm SPAAG (the ZA 35) and a SPSAM with 4 SAHV3 missiles (ZA-HVM), both using a common turret and the Rooikat chassis.

The G6 155mm SPGH has seen use with South African army and has experienced some export successes (UAE and - I think - India)

The Dana and variants are used mostly by Czech and Slovak armed forced but has also been exported to several countries.

Interesingly, both the turret of G6 and the turret of the VZOR77 have been trialled succefully on a T72 tank chassis. A variant of G6 turret has also been mated to the chassis of the Arjun MBT to make the Bhim tracked SPGH. The G6 chassis has been used to mount other turrets e.g. the british Marksmen twin 35mm SPAAG turret. There is also a twin 35mm SPAAG and I think also a twin 30mm variant using the DANA chassis.

South Africa also offers some pretty top notch T72 upgrades, including new barrel for 125mm gun, new commander and gunner sights, turret drive, firecontrol, environment sensors etc.

Typically SPGHs like DANA and G6 would not be employed against MBTs (but I suppose their guns could be effective in a direct fire role if the situation required this)