Should Pakistan Export Agostas ?

[Oqaab]

Pakistan ordered 3 Agosta90B submarines from DCN, France in 1994. The first (Khalid) of the three submarine was assembled in 1999 and now its serving for PN. The second submarine (Saad) is completed and undergoing trials right now. The third submarine (Humza) will complete in 2005. These submarines are quiter then Indian Kilo Class Submarines and are meant for long missions in a war and have advanced stealth features.

Now, Pakistan is making 1 agosta in 3 years. Malaysia and Saudi Arabia are negotiating with Pakistan for these subs. So do u think Pakistan should export these submarines coz three agostas arent enough for PN ??

Need sencible replies plzzz.
Thanx.

 

[ullu]

Is that a question we "should" be asking? Off course pakistan should export Agostas. Pakistan has the license to export so I don't see any reason why not. :smokingc:

 

[Red aRRow]

First satisfy the demands of the P.N. which should be around 6 subs and then start exporting this baby.

 

[Oqaab]

Pakistan is facing a threat of 9 kilo subs. I think we should make 6-8 of these subs and then start exporting.

 

[Hataf]

6 subs in 18 years to finish!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,,,, :eek :eek so no argument till then ....

 

[Oqaab]

6 subs in 18 years to finish!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,,,, :eek :eek so no argument till then ....

Yeah, but Pakistan has to start planning from now. Lack of facility is the only problem due to which each sub is taking 3 years.

 

[corsair7772]

hmmmmm
but where should the money from the sub sale go 2?

 

[Oqaab]

Probably, the money comming from sale of agostas will be used over Pakistan's defence only..... :roll

 

[corsair7772]

if its going on defence shudnt the navy get the money? i mean itll be a great help 2 them if we got them more SSMs and tried 2 setup an indigenous Ship industry

 

[Oqaab]

Pakistan might sell Agosta 90B after the third one joins the navy. The money comming from the sales of these weapons should be spent over R&D or should be used to strengthen our economy.

 

[Mujahid]

I think Pakistan should hurry up the process of building these subs. If the worlds biggest luxury cruise liner can be build in about 2 years time, then PN should also be able to complete a sub per year.

And ofcourse Pakistan should export these subs after the demand of PN has been met. But the export should only be to friendly countries who we can rely upon in war scenerio.

Wasalam,

Mujahid

 

[corsair7772]

I dont think the Agosta sales can whip up enuff money 4 any meaningfull economic activity, i say we use it 4 the navy

 

[Mujahid]

I dont think the Agosta sales can whip up enuff money 4 any meaningfull economic activity, i say we use it 4 the navy

maybe you are right.

the time to money ratio isnt very good. so we should maybe stick to making agosta subs only to PN.

 

[Oqaab]

I dont think the Agosta sales can whip up enuff money 4 any meaningfull economic activity, i say we use it 4 the navy

Right, but do u know we are giving 800 million UDS for these three agostas. Saudi Arabia needs submarines and they might buy 4-6 of these submarines....

 

[Mujahid]

Saudi Arabia? come on yaar.........do they have a navy at all ?

 

[Oqaab]

Saudi Arabia? come on yaar.........do they have a navy at all ?

Yes they have. Three F300S stealth frigates are serving in their navy.

 

[darklegent]

Military sales are not based on if's and but's. It is more econmical to buy directly from France.
Most of you will ask WHY?
The answer is simple when a military product is purchased, the equipment has to be supported in terms of service and spares which could mean purchasing the required spares from the original manufacturer for the next 30 years of the service life. The Agostas are being built under license. The Indians also built HDW 209 under a similar license 20years ago. By the term license it means that one can built these products and yes also export them. But the cost of manufacturing spares and supporting services is expensive as this is a technological and industrial intensive endevor. It is usually cheaper to purchase a lot of spares from europe (france, germany,british,etc) then to manufacture them locally(even if the term TRANSFER OF TECHNOLOGY is involved).
Please tell me why would the French not sale a similar package to another country like Saudia. :?
Oh- yeah I read Oqaab saying that the Agostas are quiter then the Kilos... I guess you would have some link that can qualify that statment. Could you please be kind enough to lead me to the same plz.

 

[Roger Smith]

Pakistan ordered 3 Agosta90B submarines from DCN, France in 1994. The first (Khalid) of the three submarine was assembled in 1999 and now its serving for PN. The second submarine (Saad) is completed and undergoing trials right now. The third submarine (Humza) will complete in 2005. These submarines are quiter then Indian Kilo Class Submarines and are meant for long missions in a war and have advanced stealth features.

Now, Pakistan is making 1 agosta in 3 years. Malaysia and Saudi Arabia are negotiating with Pakistan for these subs. So do u think Pakistan should export these submarines coz three agostas arent enough for PN ??

Need sencible replies plzzz.
Thanx.

Firstly, France will not allow Pakistan to export Agostas submarine to third country. Secondly, Malaysia and Saudi will not buy second hand technology from Pakistan and will instead contact the source France directly.

The situation was similar on Karakaroum K-8 jet trainer Pakistan joint venture with China. Zambia, Burma and Egypt bought direct K-8 jet trainers for China. Egypt placed an order for 200 K-8 and received transfer of technology and blue print to make K-8 in their country from China.

The FC-1 or JF-17 fighter plane, China will supply to Pakistan also to other third world countries like Bangladesh.

Pakistan will not be able to export Karakaroum K-8 jet trainers or FC-1 or JF-17 fighter jets to any country as China is controlling both the projects.

 

[umair]

Mr Smith as someone who knows more I would like to bring to light some facts
1)The Agosta agreement gives Pakistan EXCLUSIVE EXPORT RIGHTS for the Agosta in the region of the middle east and south east asia.
2)The K-8 was designed by Pakistani engineers and it's performance parameters were also set by us,As the party which designed this aircraft Pakistan has a say in matters of Exporting the K-8.China does the marketing prod and sales while we are like partners who have made an investment and are now recieving the dividend.
3)The Thunder is a 50:50 partnership meaning that we have an equal say in the design,prod in short every aspect of the programme.The marketing responsibility for the Thunder will lie equally with both the partners.Also China won't sell it to us we will make it ourselves in increasing shares.
Please do some research about the topic and the subject matter of the post next time.
PEACE!

 

[The Watcher]

Pakistan first needs to concentrate on its naval needs then worry about selling home made naval weapons to other countries.