American troops are paid with empty rhetoric

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WE'RE LOOKING FOR A FEW POOR MEN
Wed Apr 9,11:02 PM ET Add Op/Ed - Ted Rall to My Yahoo!


By Ted Rall

America Pays Its Troops with Empty Rhetoric


Ted Rall



NEW YORK--Not everyone loves the war, but everyone loves the troops. So why, in the words of my pal Bill Maher, do we pay them like chumps?


During Vietnam the military felt no pressure to pay a living wage. A steady supply of draftees ensured that the Pentagon (news - web sites) would never run out of cannon fodder. Since top military officials don't want to bring back the draft, you might expect the government would be willing to pay more for our all-volunteer army. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld has completely dissed draftees, saying they offer "no value, no advantage, really, to the United States armed services over any sustained period of time." So you might expect the United States would show the young men and women who volunteer to lay down their lives to protect us some appreciation in the form of a big fat paycheck.


You'd be wrong.


Take a guy like Pat Tillman, a 25-year-old who until last year worked as a safety for the Arizona Cardinals football team. Tillman passed up a three-year, $3.6 million contract offer from the NFL to serve in the U.S. Army. Private Tillman's starting pay was $13,000--a paltry buck and a dime over the $5.15-per-hour minimum wage.


Senator John McCain, who understands the risks of military service more than most, lauded Tillman. "I don't think there will be any doubts about [Private Tillman's] capabilities as a soldier, but also as a recruiting tool," McCain said. "He'll motivate other young Americans to serve as well." Thanks to idealistic chaps like Tillman, in other words, America can continue to pick up its warriors on the cheap.


George W. Bush did everything he could to avoid military service during Vietnam. He used family connections to sleaze his way into the Texas Air National Guard, from which he went AWOL from 1972 to 1974. (Some military law experts believe that he should still be tried for desertion.) Perhaps this despicable personal history explains why Bush seizes every chance he gets to praise the hard-fighting men and women of our armed forces. "All of America is grateful for your sacrifice," Bush told a gathering of Marines on April 3. A few days earlier, he choked up while meeting with widows of the Iraq (news - web sites) war. But troops shouldn't look to Bush for support more substantial than words and gestures.


Bush recently asked Congress to appropriate $75 billion to pay for the invasion of Iraq. If that money were evenly divided among the 1.4 million members of the armed forces on active duty, each would receive $54,000. But even as Bush revs up a propaganda campaign for new wars against Syria and Iran, his 2003 budget proposes a piddling two percent raise for low-ranking soldiers, hardly enough to keep up with inflation. More than 2,100 servicemen currently collect food stamps, and no one expects that to change.


It's true that soldiers receive PX privileges, health care and, in some cases, small college tuition grants. But even these modest fringe benefits are shrinking. "[Base housing is] in poor condition," Army General Robert L. Van Antwerp testified before Congress. "Much of the housing is old and built to standards that met lifestyles of 30 to 50 years ago. On-base housing is still preferred by many soldiers, with waiting times averaging 10 to 15 months."


Gen. Antwerp also complains that buildings and equipment are worn and out of date.


Soldiers sign away their lives on a pretty severe deal. The pay sucks, the risk is infinite and the benefits of military service are shrinking fast. At any time in the future, some politician nobody has yet heard of can become president and order them into combat against any adversary for any reason. Then, when our troops come home--if they come home--they face a lifetime of medical care in the overburdened, underfunded Veterans Administration hospital system. (To help fund Bush's $1.5 trillion tax cut for the ultrawealthy, House Republicans just slashed the VA's budget by $25 billion. They also slapped a $250 annual fee on every veteran who needs to see a doctor--even those who are homeless.)


To add insult to injury, even job security is now part of military history. Congress has closed 97 bases since 1988, leading to de facto layoffs, with some soldiers denied an option to reenlist.


As a society, we apparently care less about our soldiers than we do about burger flippers. Starting wages at Burger King "run $6 to $8 an hour, although employees who stick around can eventually earn more than $12 an hour," according to the Wall Street Journal. That's twice as much as Private Tillman gets. And unless you get stuck with the late shift at the Bed-Stuy BK, burger flippers don't have to duck bullets.


(Ted Rall is the author of "Gas War: The Truth Behind the American Occupation of Afghanistan (news - web sites)," an analysis of the underreported Trans-Afghanistan Pipeline project and the real motivations behind the war on terrorism. Ordering information is available at amazon.com and barnesandnoble.com.)




http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...0410/cm_ucru/we_re_looking_for_a_few_poor_men
 

DarkAngel

Banned Member
adn they still go about killing innoent people. i dunno, mebbe the servicemen are more crazy than their employers.
 

Blackclaw

New Member
DarkAngel said:
adn they still go about killing innoent people. i dunno, mebbe the servicemen are more crazy than their employers.
Professional soldiers do not go about intentionally killing "innocent" people. The US has professional soldiers.

But no, they don't get paid worth crap.
 

DarkAngel

Banned Member
in their own words they kill becuase they are told to
one profession that i atleast would not respect, but then in this world no one is innocent, everyone deserves to die
 

Blackclaw

New Member
DarkAngel said:
in their own words they kill becuase they are told to
one profession that i atleast would not respect, but then in this world no one is innocent, everyone deserves to die
They have the right to refuse any order that would have them kill noncombatants.

Everyone deserves to die? Ok, perhaps no human being is perfect. But are even minor faults worthy of the death penalty? If you really believe this, why are you still alive?
 

DarkAngel

Banned Member
Mod edit: This sort of rubbish has no place here and will not be tolerated. AD.
 
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ullu

New Member
Blackclaw said:
DarkAngel said:
adn they still go about killing innoent people. i dunno, mebbe the servicemen are more crazy than their employers.
Professional soldiers do not go about intentionally killing "innocent" people. The US has professional soldiers.

But no, they don't get paid worth crap.

They don't get paid enough all right but consider the benefits they get for being in the armed forces. So it kinda evens up.
 

Blackclaw

New Member
DarkAngel said:
the right to refuse and get court marshalled? not that i expect the majority of them to have any ethics or id be seeing more than 4 of them refusing to go into battle.
Simply because someone does not agree with your position does not mean that they do not have ethics. There's nothing morally wrong with shooting at Saddam or his thugs.

US pilots are duty bound to fly any mission that they are ordered to, but once over the target it is their choice whether to fire or not. If they don't believe the target is legitimate or that the chance of hitting civilians is too great, they don't have to fire.

If a US soldier refuses an order than he probably will be courtmartialed, but he or she will be exonerated if the order they disobeyed was founf to be illegal - such as the intential killing of noncombatants.

for the american, only the american ( or sometimes the israili ) deserves to live. no muslim really deserves to live and they sooner see the deaht of us all than any peace. Its a known fact no matter how much denial some of u americans still put urselves in.
That's just BS. How can it be a "known fact" when I'm an American and I don't feel that way. What about all of the American Muslims? What about all of the Christian Americans that guarded Mosques after 9-11 to keep young hotheads vandals away from them?

The US has fought alongside Muslim allies more often than any Muslim nation has.
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
There will be occasions that soldiers will not be able to distinguish between a enemy combatant or a civilian, in Iraq civilians are being used as human shields by these thugs/terrorists, you can`t really call them enemy combatants because with them they have no rules, our soldiers for the most part have good restraint but you have to look at what they are up against, you will occasionally have innocent lives lost. For the soldiers who decide to go off the deep end they need to be brought before a military tribunale and prosecuted to the fullest, War is ugly and you really do not know how people are going to handle it, it will take the most dedicated hardcore soldier and make him cry, I know this first hand serving in the first Persian Gulf war as a Tank Commander. If you see enough death it will eventually effect you, it all depends on how you go about handling it. What is really upsetting right now is the way alot of people throughout the world is viewing this as a war against christians and musilums because of these terrorists. Every single person on this planet has a right to live in peace, it is too bad that some governments will not allow this. I Did not agree with my governments decision to invade Iraq, what was the cause for? But I do agree with my governments approach to destroying terrorism, you do not come into my backyard and kill thousands of innocent civilians for the name of Allah without feeling our wrath, Iran better take notice to this because my country will not tolerate this type of behavior, we did not start this war but we Americans have shown throughout history that after you decide to sucker punch us we will come after you. We as Americans will not watch the destruction of Isreal, take heed to that Iran, Russia, Syria and China. If you are going to harbor terrorists or support them then you have the right to be treated as one.
 

atilla

New Member
eckherl said:
There will be occasions that soldiers will not be able to distinguish between a enemy combatant or a civilian, in Iraq civilians are being used as human shields by these thugs/terrorists, you can`t really call them enemy combatants because with them they have no rules, our soldiers for the most part have good restraint but you have to look at what they are up against, you will occasionally have innocent lives lost. For the soldiers who decide to go off the deep end they need to be brought before a military tribunale and prosecuted to the fullest, War is ugly and you really do not know how people are going to handle it, it will take the most dedicated hardcore soldier and make him cry, I know this first hand serving in the first Persian Gulf war as a Tank Commander. If you see enough death it will eventually effect you, it all depends on how you go about handling it. What is really upsetting right now is the way alot of people throughout the world is viewing this as a war against christians and musilums because of these terrorists. Every single person on this planet has a right to live in peace, it is too bad that some governments will not allow this. I Did not agree with my governments decision to invade Iraq, what was the cause for? But I do agree with my governments approach to destroying terrorism, you do not come into my backyard and kill thousands of innocent civilians for the name of Allah without feeling our wrath, Iran better take notice to this because my country will not tolerate this type of behavior, we did not start this war but we Americans have shown throughout history that after you decide to sucker punch us we will come after you. We as Americans will not watch the destruction of Isreal, take heed to that Iran, Russia, Syria and China. If you are going to harbor terrorists or support them then you have the right to be treated as one.
well fırst US soldıers are gettıng better pay then ours :) but pay or check ıs not ımportant actualy who ever serves to hıs or her country .....

and second as a secular ındıvıdual turkısh ı m not happy to see US army near my borders and messıng around ın the lands whıch we all lıved more than 1000 years there ıs no excuse for any tecnologıcly developed army for cıvılıan casualty eıther ın ıraq nor ın any part of the world ınculudıng mıne

poınt 3 ı dont know who started but ı know laden was not IRAQı and ı also know saddam was secular so cant have dırrect contact as we all know laden ıs fundamantalıst:)


ı m sure IRan also showed ın hıstory they can after what ever ıt ıs Iran has longer past then any other natıon ın mıd east ın terms of devolopıng state developıng rule constutıtıons and fellıng of beeıng one natıon example pers Sasanı ex.......

point 4 no one ıs goıng to ask USA how to behave expecıally ıf they are lıvıng ın our lands u can name them syrıa ıran resıdends of ıraq or what ever and no one ıs goıng to accep accupatıon doesnt matter under whıch reason ıt ıs made u can call ıt fıght agaınst terrorısm or agaınst ıslam or agaınst laden or agaınst NUKES or agaınst ex.....

These lands saw more armıes and even hundereds years before USA was developed as a state these lands saw more ındependence battles and more power battels then any other place or any cıv on earth ınculudıng USA obvıosly

Yes as u told [If you are going to harbor terrorists or support them then you have the right to be treated as one ]there are terrorısts ın IRAQ called PKK and supported by new goverment of ıraq so ????? any solutıons?????? we as a TURKISH PEOPLE should treat new ıraqı goverment the way u thınk?????? by the way how thıs new goverment was ellected ıs another big questıon was ıt u belıve free electıons???? I dont because
 

DragonKing786

New Member
It's an America puppet Govt. do doubt about that...and yes their are crazy people killing innocient civilians look on CNN.com about a navy personal who killed a civilian for no aparent reason..

SO yeah it's all American doing to secure their resources to run their economy...
 

eckherl

The Bunker Group
Verified Defense Pro
atilla said:
well fırst US soldıers are gettıng better pay then ours :) but pay or check ıs not ımportant actualy who ever serves to hıs or her country .....

and second as a secular ındıvıdual turkısh ı m not happy to see US army near my borders and messıng around ın the lands whıch we all lıved more than 1000 years there ıs no excuse for any tecnologıcly developed army for cıvılıan casualty eıther ın ıraq nor ın any part of the world ınculudıng mıne

poınt 3 ı dont know who started but ı know laden was not IRAQı and ı also know saddam was secular so cant have dırrect contact as we all know laden ıs fundamantalıst:)


ı m sure IRan also showed ın hıstory they can after what ever ıt ıs Iran has longer past then any other natıon ın mıd east ın terms of devolopıng state developıng rule constutıtıons and fellıng of beeıng one natıon example pers Sasanı ex.......

point 4 no one ıs goıng to ask USA how to behave expecıally ıf they are lıvıng ın our lands u can name them syrıa ıran resıdends of ıraq or what ever and no one ıs goıng to accep accupatıon doesnt matter under whıch reason ıt ıs made u can call ıt fıght agaınst terrorısm or agaınst ıslam or agaınst laden or agaınst NUKES or agaınst ex.....

These lands saw more armıes and even hundereds years before USA was developed as a state these lands saw more ındependence battles and more power battels then any other place or any cıv on earth ınculudıng USA obvıosly

Yes as u told [If you are going to harbor terrorists or support them then you have the right to be treated as one ]there are terrorısts ın IRAQ called PKK and supported by new goverment of ıraq so ????? any solutıons?????? we as a TURKISH PEOPLE should treat new ıraqı goverment the way u thınk?????? by the way how thıs new goverment was ellected ıs another big questıon was ıt u belıve free electıons???? I dont because
I agree to some extent with you, we do not need to be over there, we have no reason to be in Iraq, our primary goal should of been Bin Laden and thats it, all we have done is cause a bigger problem in the long run. And as far as the Kurds goes, do they not have the right to live in peace, Saddam did what he could do to destroy them, your country doesn`t want them around and I know that you a very concerned about their independance. It would be nice if you guy`s could get along, but you are right in the fact that if they perform some type of terrorist attack against you then you have the right to eliminate that threat. You can rest assured that America is tired of fighting other nations battles, we have shed to much of our blood for two major wars and a bunch of small ones to boot, there will be a time real soon that we will stop helping the world to solve it`s problems. Just remember that when we do eventually pull out of Iraq you will pretty much be dealing with the Iranian government, and we all know how sane the Iranian president is, him and Vladamere Putin get along real good. The middle East does have a rich culture that is fascinating and very educational and we should respect your country as a sovern nation.
 
the problem is the contractors are paid 3-4 times more than the regular soldier that is protecting them. all these politicans talk about supporting the troops is bunch of garbage.
 
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