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Indian Military Aviation; News, Updates & Discussions

This is a discussion on Indian Military Aviation; News, Updates & Discussions within the Air Force & Aviation forum, part of the Global Defense & Military category; I wonder what happened to the old thread, anyhow; I am starting a new thread to cover military aviation in ...


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Old May 12th, 2011   #1
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Indian Military Aviation; News, Updates & Discussions

I wonder what happened to the old thread, anyhow;

I am starting a new thread to cover military aviation in Indian Air Force, Indian Army and Indian Navy.

Here's some food for your thought..

Indian Armed forced to induct 1000 helos by 2020

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The choppers to be inducted into the Army, Navy and Air Force include around 450 light utility, 12 VVIP, over 200 attack, 139 Mi-17 transport and 15 heavy-lift helicopters and over 50 multi-role helicopters for the Navy, Defence Ministry officials told PTI here.
Perhaps the largest helo procurement by any country in the coming decade.
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Old May 12th, 2011   #2
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Originally Posted by Twinblade View Post
I wonder what happened to the old thread, anyhow;

I am starting a new thread to cover military aviation in Indian Air Force, Indian Army and Indian Navy.

Here's some food for your thought..

Indian Armed forced to induct 1000 helos by 2020



Perhaps the largest helo procurement by any country in the coming decade.
The old thread has been closed/hidden while the Mod team does cleanup on it, following some problematic posting. Once it has been completed, the thread should be re-opened and available for members to see and post to it. In the mean time, this thread can remain open (if kept clean) and will be merged into the other Indian Air Force thread once that has been moderated.
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Old May 24th, 2011   #3
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In Zhukovsky was presented PAK FA program and MiG-29UPG for the Indian Air Force

Moscow, May 23. Today in the Flight Research Institute. Gromov in Zhukovsky near Moscow was presented and flight demonstration of promising air complex tactical aircraft (PAK FA) and the upgraded fighter aircraft carrier-based MiG-29UPG Indian delegation headed by the commander of the Air Force Pradeep Vasant Naik (Pradeep Vasant Naik).

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Old May 24th, 2011   #4
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-50 ( 3) \\-50 ( 3) \\

the bird is all engines :p
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Old June 4th, 2011   #5
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Miffed Russia upsets India

Miffed Russia upsets India
June 05, 2011 4:15:44 AM

PNS/PTI | New Delhi/Moscow

Longstanding defence and strategic relations between India and Russia are under strain with Moscow calling off a scheduled joint naval exercise at short notice in an apparent move to express its displeasure over New Delhi exploring global markets for weapons procurement.

The Russian decision has been slammed by country defence experts and the media while the Indian Navy is also unhappy with the development.

The incident took place late in April when five Indian Navy warships sailed for waters off Vladivostok for the joint naval exercise. The Indian contingent reached Vladivostok and made a port call before returning home after Russians abruptly called off the exercise.

This action was sharply criticised by Russian defence experts who said calling off the exercise by Moscow was simply stupid when several countries are waiting in queue to hold such an exercise with India.

While the Russians later said the exercise was called off due to the nuclear disaster in Japan following the tsunami, sources here said on Wednesday that several Russian warships were later seen carrying out combat drills in the waters off Vladivostok.

Peeved at the snub, the Indian Navy lodged a protest along with a detailed report to the Indian Defence Ministry, sources said adding the External Affairs Ministry was also apprised of the facts. Incidentally, the schedule for the joint exercise was planned months in advance, they said.

The development has put a question mark over the joint Army exercise Indra between the two countries later this year. Focussed on honing anti-terrorism drills in urban and rural scenario, the two sides have held some preliminary meetings to plan the exercise but the dates are yet to be finalised.

It was learnt that Russia, which is the biggest arms supplier to India, is unhappy with New Delhi now exploring the Western world for procuring weapons and critical spare parts. Regular supply of spare parts from Russia has been a problem for the last one decade since the disintegration of Soviet Union and the issue has cropped up many times in talks between top political leadership of both countries.

Moreover, Russia now prefers to pitch for its equipment and the Indian security establishment decided some years back to expand its vendor base to inject more competition and get a better deal for lesser money, sources said.

A top Russian defence expert has said Moscow is not taking defence interaction with India seriously and described the cancellation of a naval drill recently with it as simply stupid.

While other nations wait in the queue to develop military interaction with India, Russia is not behaving seriously. There is no need to be surprised that India is more and more turning towards western partners - at least more serious and stable, said Mikhail Barabanov, editor of Moscow Defence Brief monthly, was quoted as saying by financial daily Vedomosti.

He said: The Russian decision to cancel war games with the main military-technical partner is simply stupid.

Barabanov also noted the Russian and Indian Air forces have never carried out joint drills, probably because the Indian pilots on their Russian built SU-30MKI fighters will easily win over the Russian pilots, with inferior aircraft and less flying experience.

It is noteworthy that Indian pilots with SU-30MKI fighters have participated several times in joint drills with USAF and other major Western nations, he said.

Another major daily Nezavisimaya Gazeta notes the Russian decision to cancel a war drill at the last moment is believed as Moscows snub to India for rejection of MiG-35 fighters in the IAFs tender for 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA), in which French Rafale and European Eurofighter Typhoon have been shortlisted.

Tatiana Shaumyan, director of Centre for Indian Studies of the Science Academys Oriental Institute, said the poor planning of the Russian side may be detrimental to the defence cooperation.

Russia and India have several decade-long traditions of geopolitical, trade, economic and defence co-operation. The military-technical cooperation had been the one of the main pillars of the Russian-Indian relations. And now in this crucial sphere a snag has occurred probably due to bad planning by the Russian side, Shaumyan said.

She cautioned that it could affect the interaction of armed forces of the two friendly States.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #6
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Indian Deal For Ten Boeing C-17s Cleared

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The Indian govt today cleared the country's largest defence deal with the US so far. Long expected, the Cabinet Committee on Security approved a $4.1-billion deal for 10 Boeing C-17 Globemaster-III heavy transport aircraft. The deal is expected to hold options for six more aircraft.

The deal includes $1.12-billion in offsets, which reportedly includes a high-altitude engine test facility and trisonic wind tunnel facility for India's Defence Research & Development Organisation.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #7
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Peeved IAF Looks Beyond Russia To Revive Ilyushins

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Seemingly exasperated by low-availability/serviceability for years as a consequence of what it has described unofficially as "unpredictable Russian support" and the country's apparent unwillingness to honour after-sales commitments, the Indian Air Force is looking for the first time beyond Russia for long-term maintenance and product support of its fleet of Ilyushin-76 heavy transports and Ilyushin-78M tanker transports at Agra, Chandigarh, Delhi and Nagpur.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #8
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Originally Posted by gf0012-aust View Post
Miffed Russia upsets India
June 05, 2011 4:15:44 AM

................................
Something doesn't feel right, by forfeiting training with India, Russians lose a chance to train with armed forces, which :
a. Know their equipment as well as Russians
b. Have access to substantial amount of western tech
c. Have a doctrine closer to western nations than that of ex-soviet block and PRC (at least navy and air force)
d. Have been in a constant state of deployment for COIN ops in every possible environment.
e. Have been a higher state of readiness for coventional war .
f. are your biggest client and whose acceptance of your hardware means increased sales to other nations as well.
g. are actively participating in some of your key defence projects.

OTOH, GF, can you speculate on as to why is the spares situation with Russia deteriorating ? My sources tell me money is not an issue, Indians are ready to pay what Russians are asking for. The problem is more severe with Ilyushin and Migoyan than with Sukhoi. Migoyan might not getting much orders but Ilyushin might just have kicked themselves out of the IAF tanker competition. Too bad IAF selected IL-76 as the platform for Phalcon AEWCS.

Last edited by Twinblade; June 6th, 2011 at 09:01 PM.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #9
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Mikoyan and Ilyushin are both in the hole. TAPOiCh is in very bad shape. When Aviastar-SP takes over Il-76 (476) production this might improve. When Mikoyan takes itself out of the hole is unclear.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #10
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I don't get it..
If the current deal to get spares parts for the IAF Mig-29 fleet`is so strained, then why on earth are they procuring even more Mig-29K and the go ahead on those Mig-29 UPG upgrade?

It makes even less sense if what Twinbladesays, that 'money is not an issue'.
If money was not an issue, then India could just aimed for F-35C.

Are you sure its just that the exercise was put off, cause due to the huge Tzunami disaster in Japan and the last thing both India and Russia wanted was to show up in various press around the world showing an 'show of force' when Japan clearly have enough on their hands..
which would not put neighter India nor Russia in any particulary good light.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #11
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I don't get it..
If the current deal to get spares parts for the IAF Mig-29 fleet`is so strained, then why on earth are they procuring even more Mig-29K and the go ahead on those Mig-29 UPG upgrade?
I don't actually know, but some reasons that would make sense to me are unification of spare parts and munitions. The original MiG-29K purchase was tied to the Gorshkov deal, so when time came for more carrier-borne fighters it made little sense to search for an alternative. Upgrading the in-service Fulcrums is partially inertia, as there isn't an immediate replacement, and there is a pro-Russian lobby in India.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #12
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I don't actually know, but some reasons that would make sense to me are unification of spare parts and munitions. The original MiG-29K purchase was tied to the Gorshkov deal, so when time came for more carrier-borne fighters it made little sense to search for an alternative. Upgrading the in-service Fulcrums is partially inertia, as there isn't an immediate replacement, and there is a pro-Russian lobby in India.
Actually the spares situation of Mig-29 is way better than 21 or 27, because several deals have been made regarding production of spares locally.
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Old June 6th, 2011   #13
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Originally Posted by Haavarla View Post
I don't get it..
If the current deal to get spares parts for the IAF Mig-29 fleet`is so strained, then why on earth are they procuring even more Mig-29K and the go ahead on those Mig-29 UPG upgrade?

It makes even less sense if what Twinbladesays, that 'money is not an issue'.
If money was not an issue, then India could just aimed for F-35C.
Money for spares isn't an issue :P it is for F-35B
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Old June 7th, 2011   #14
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Actually the spares situation of Mig-29 is way better than 21 or 27, because several deals have been made regarding production of spares locally.
Interesting. So what do they still import?
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Old June 7th, 2011   #15
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Interesting. So what do they still import?
Ans : A major part.

The situation for Mig-29's is marginally better (given higher priority over other Migs for delivery as it is an air superiority fighter) After early 90's when collapse of the SU grounded almost a third of Mig-29's due to lack of spares, India maintains probably the largest inventory of Mig spares. With Russians reviving their aircrafts as well and increasing their flying hours, i would not be surprised if Mig prioritizes domestic customers and given the poor state of mig they might not be in a position to increase spares production.
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