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French Armée de l'Air News & Discussion

This is a discussion on French Armée de l'Air News & Discussion within the Air Force & Aviation forum, part of the Global Defense & Military category; Tried looking for a thread like this, found plenty of scattered threads about Rafale so I thought one central thread ...


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Old March 6th, 2013   #1
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French Armée de l'Air News & Discussion

Tried looking for a thread like this, found plenty of scattered threads about Rafale so I thought one central thread like this would be a better option.

Good picture from G_Steuer on twitter of the first French A400M in the sky decked out with French colours, it's completed it's inaugural flight - some 7 hours - today too.

He posted a decent stat too from a colleague

Quote:
A400M would be able to fly Istres>Bamako in 5h30 with a 31t payload vs 13t in 7h30 for a C-130 & 5t in 9h for a Transall
Which aircraft specifically is the A400M replacing in this instance? IIRC the AdlA are getting something like 50 A400M at the last count, presumably they're replacing the C-160.

For what it's worth, in this case the pair are journalists for Air & Cosmos which is a French aerospace magazine.

EDIT: Forgot to attach the darn photo . . . .
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Old March 6th, 2013   #2
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Originally Posted by RobWilliams View Post
Tried looking for a thread like this, found plenty of scattered threads about Rafale so I thought one central thread like this would be a better option.

Good picture from G_Steuer on twitter of the first French A400M in the sky decked out with French colours, it's completed it's inaugural flight - some 7 hours - today too.

He posted a decent stat too from a colleague



Which aircraft specifically is the A400M replacing in this instance? IIRC the AdlA are getting something like 50 A400M at the last count, presumably they're replacing the C-160.
Its the C160 which are absolutely at the end of their lives plus give a little strat lift which has been helping the French out in Mali. Seeing how RAF and the Canadians have been using the C17 to help out on strategic lift.

I do wonder why France never considered C17 as they do have the requirement for such craft
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Old March 7th, 2013   #3
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Its the C160 which are absolutely at the end of their lives plus give a little strat lift which has been helping the French out in Mali. Seeing how RAF and the Canadians have been using the C17 to help out on strategic lift.

I do wonder why France never considered C17 as they do have the requirement for such craft
Requirements - yes.

Cash - no, because they're investing it all in A400M.

I'd imagine that 40-44 A400M and 4-6 C-17A would enormously improve their strategic airlift capability, but they only seem to be investing in products delivered by local industry (apart from a few specific capabilities - GBU-49 dual mode Paveway II/III and Harfang / Heron UAV springs to mind).
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Old March 8th, 2013   #4
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Nato already share ownership with A-3 AWACS, isn't they also planning to pull the resources for share ownership of C-17 (or they have done it already ?). If they can pull share ownership of C-17, then perhaps Franch can use that. Afterall I do believe most of their requirement will be meet by A-400M.
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Old March 8th, 2013   #5
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The collective E-3 & C-17 fleets are not owned or shared by all of NATO. Countries opt in, pay a share, & get the use of the aircraft. France, like the UK, has its own E-3s, & has no share in the NATO E-3 fleet. The SAC C-17s (all three of them) are owned by a 12 nation consortium, including two countries (Finland & Sweden) which are not NATO members. France, the UK, Germany, Italy, Spain, Turkey & several other NATO members have no share in those C-17s.

There are other collective arrangements within NATO that not all members take part in.
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Old June 28th, 2013   #6
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France has finally presented a request for the Reaper UAV.

http://www.dsca.mil/PressReleases/36...ance_13-40.pdf

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The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress today of a
possible Foreign Military Sale to France of 16 MQ-9 Reaper Remotely Piloted Aircraft
and associated equipment, parts, training and logistical support for an estimated cost
of $1.5billion.
Specifically
  • 16 MQ - 9 Reaper Remotely Piloted Aircraft
  • 8 Mobile Ground Control Stations (GCS)
  • 48 Honeywell TPE331 - 10T Turboprop Engines (16 installed and 32 spares)
  • 24 Satellite Earth Terminal Substations
  • 40 Ku Band Link - Airborne Communication Systems
  • 40 General Atomics Lynx (exportable) Synthetic Aperture Radar/Ground Moving Target Indicator (SAR/GMTI) Systems
  • 40 AN/DAS - 1 Multi - Spectral Targeting Systems (MTS) - B
  • 40 Ground Data Terminals
  • 40 ARC - 210 Radio Systems
  • 40 Embedded Global Positioning System/Inertial Navigation Systems
  • 48 AN/APX - 119 and KIV - 119 Identify Friend or Foe (IFF) Systems

Quote:
Also provided are spare and repair parts, communication, test, and support equipment, publications and technical documentation, airworthiness and maintenance support, site surveys and bed down planning, personnel training and training equipment, operational flight test, U.S. Government and contractor technical and
logistics personnel services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $1.5 billion.
There's currently quite a big bit of investment going on in French UAV forces, they're currently doing operational assessments of the Watchkeeper system for the Frency Army and IIRC are looking for 30 systems
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Old July 5th, 2013
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Old July 9th, 2013   #7
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The French army has a critical need in terms of UAV, we saw her lately at war in Mali or she has to appeal to the American assistance in this area ...

Today , just above my house , I shooted with my phone 4 Rafales flying together , and then 6 Rafales flying with a A330MRTT . It was so impressive !

They were training for the 14 juillet parade .
When I have the permission to post videos , I'll put it here .

Last edited by OPSSG; July 10th, 2013 at 01:36 AM. Reason: Combined into 1 post
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Old August 3rd, 2013   #8
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French air force accepts it's first A400M airlifter

First A400M Airlifter Delivered to France | Defense News | defensenews.com

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Belgium, France, Germany, Luxembourg, Spain, Turkey and the UK joined in a program that together with export customer Malaysia has garnered 174 orders.

The production schedule should see a further two A400Ms delivered to France this year from the Airbus Military assembly plant in Seville, Spain, with Turkey also scheduled to receive its first aircraft.

Among the other significant A400M operators, Britain is scheduled to get its first aircraft next year, and German deliveries will follow in 2015.

The turboprop aircraft has a payload capability of up to 37 tons or 116 paratroopers, and can also serve as an air-to-air tanker for fast jets and other aircraft.
Good news for the French air force, giving them a more serious airlift capability, a capability demonstrated to be lacking to a degree during Operation Serval in Mali.

But according to info supplied to a journalist of AirCosmos (G_Steuer on Twitter) from the recent defence budget law there's supposed to only be 15 aircraft delivered by 2019 where until now the expectation was 31 aircraft by 2019.

From the same source
  • only 6 Mirage 2000Ds to be modernised by 2019.
  • 14 tactical UAVs for the Army by 2019
  • ANL/FASGW deliveries not before 2019
  • Possible delivery of 2 Reaper UAVs from the US later this year

I know not strictly all French Air Force, but thought i'd include it.
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Old August 3rd, 2013   #9
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So French will only take 15 out of 31, or less 16. Taking from other info, seems Spain and Germany also reducing their delivery A-400. From Spain and Germany will be less 13 each, thus make it 26. Plus French, make it less 42.

Those 42 for Airbus, need to be replaced by other nation that interested. It's only rumoured, however based on local forum in Malaysia and Indonesia, Malaysia being offered to take additional 4 from it's current order of four. While Indonesia being offered unspecified number, although with Indonesia already upgrading current C-130H and ex RAAF C-130H, don't see it need new mid-heavy transport soon.

Those offered used being told by Airbus can only be deliver after 2020, since Airbus committed to the original Euro nation order first. However seems Airbus now trying to sell those Euro orders to Asia, Middle-East.

Australia can be a market, if not already committed to C-130J, and C-17. Not a best timing for A-400.
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Old August 3rd, 2013   #10
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So French will only take 15 out of 31, or less 16. Taking from other info, seems Spain and Germany also reducing their delivery A-400. From Spain and Germany will be less 13 each, thus make it 26. Plus French, make it less 42.

Those 42 for Airbus, need to be replaced by other nation that interested. It's only rumoured, however based on local forum in Malaysia and Indonesia, Malaysia being offered to take additional 4 from it's current order of four. While Indonesia being offered unspecified number, although with Indonesia already upgrading current C-130H and ex RAAF C-130H, don't see it need new mid-heavy transport soon.

Those offered used being told by Airbus can only be deliver after 2020, since Airbus committed to the original Euro nation order first. However seems Airbus now trying to sell those Euro orders to Asia, Middle-East.

Australia can be a market, if not already committed to C-130J, and C-17. Not a best timing for A-400.
As has been discussed in the RNZAF thread, the early 2020's timing would probably work there.

Another possibility could be South Africa, originally ordered 8, then cancelled, but is still an industrial partner in the A400 project and I read recently that there is a suggestion that they may be reconsidering.

As for the RAAF, timing would certainly be an issue, the C130J's probably won't be replaced until closer to 2030, and by that time LM would no doubt have a further upgrade of the C130 available and maybe a new larger design too, but I suppose that will also depend on what a future US requirement might be by then.
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Old August 4th, 2013   #11
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They're not neccesarily ditching the rest of their order for 50, in the recent White paper released in May it was still committed to 50 A400Ms.

I expect it's a scenario like their Rafales, originally it was going to be they accept 11 aircraft per year for the next six years but now it's down to 26 over the same period.*

If you're after airframes look no further than Germany & Spain, IIRC Spain is trying to shift 13.

EDIT: From AirCosmos, sheduled deliveries from 2014 - 2019
  • Introduction of new French BM - M51-2 (updated M51)
  • 2 optical observation satellites Musis / CSO
  • 12 MALE UAVs
  • 14 tactical UAVs (against 30 requested by the White Paper)
  • 26 Rafale fighter jets
  • 13 A400M transport aircraft (including two this year)
  • 6 combat aircraft Mirage 2000D renovated
  • 42 NH-90 helicopters
  • 16 Tiger helicopters
  • 4 patrol aircraft ATL-renovated 2 (15 in the White Paper)
  • 2 MRTT tanker aircraft (12 in the White Paper)
  • 450 missiles MMP successors of Milan (2850 in the White Paper)
  • 532 AASM guided bombs (in the 1742 White Paper)

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*But the article does say that it appears to be a sharp reduction in orders, but some of this would be offset by pushing it back to the next round but it's not clear what. When it talks about (X in the White Paper), i'm not entirely sure if that means what the WP expected to be delivered or just referencing the total number. If it was a comparison, how come the Rafales don't have a reference?
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